fastest growing "religion"

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DNS
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fastest growing "religion"

Post by DNS »



He's right, those who consider their religion to be "none" are the fastest growing group. As he noted only 5% of Americans said none in 1972. Today, it is 32%.

All religions are in decline and going down in numbers, including Buddhism. Christianity is the fastest declining religion. I think that is because there are millions, billions of them, many in developed nations and as a nation gets more developed and technologically advanced, religion tends to decline there the most.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growth_of ... ure_change

But I'm a little hopeful for buddhism, in the long-run. After all, buddhism is often considered "atheist" or at least non-theistic. Or possibly transtheism.
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

Post by Archie2009 »

But is Christianity as much in decline in red states as it is in blue states? Or just in the red states that are becomming a little bluer in addition to blue states?
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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DNS wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 5:07 pm

He's right, those who consider their religion to be "none" are the fastest growing group. As he noted only 5% of Americans said none in 1972. Today, it is 32%.

All religions are in decline and going down in numbers, including Buddhism. Christianity is the fastest declining religion. I think that is because there are millions, billions of them, many in developed nations and as a nation gets more developed and technologically advanced, religion tends to decline there the most.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growth_of ... ure_change

But I'm a little hopeful for buddhism, in the long-run. After all, buddhism is often considered "atheist" or at least non-theistic. Or possibly transtheism.
Atheism seems to me little more than a reactionary posture, maybe a fancy label for an absence of conviction beyond hedonic impulses.
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

Post by DNS »

Archie2009 wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 6:50 pm But is Christianity as much in decline in red states as it is in blue states? Or just in the red states that are becomming a little bluer in addition to blue states?
I think it's mostly in decline in the blue states, but remember, the blue states have the highest populations (California, New York, etc). Red states like Wyoming, South Dakota, Kansas, Mississippi; have small populations.
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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Queequeg wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 6:55 pm Atheism seems to me little more than a reactionary posture, maybe a fancy label for an absence of conviction beyond hedonic impulses.
it can be that, if that’s what it is.
But if you are not raised to believe in any type of god, then god stuff just seems weird. It doesn’t make any sense. In that regard, it’s not a reaction at all.
But there are atheist zealots. Converts to atheism.
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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PadmaVonSamba wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 7:00 pm
Queequeg wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 6:55 pm Atheism seems to me little more than a reactionary posture, maybe a fancy label for an absence of conviction beyond hedonic impulses.
it can be that, if that’s what it is.
But if you are not raised to believe in any type of god, then god stuff just seems weird. It doesn’t make any sense. In that regard, it’s not a reaction at all.
But there are atheist zealots. Converts to atheism.
Yes. I see the point.

I guess what I'm questioning is whether the mere absence of a belief in God or gods is rightly called atheism. If the idea of God or gods, or the rejection of God or gods, never figured at all, then the person is outside of that theist/atheist dichotomy. To label such a person "atheist" is to force them into this spectrum whether they like it or not. In that respect, I should retract my suggestion that atheism might be a fancy label for those without any conviction beyond hedonic impulses.

Bill Maher is generally critical of identity politics, but here he is seeking recognition for some identity that resonates with him, and wanting everyone else who nominally has no belief in God or gods to be part of this group. Its a reactionary stance to want to recognize this as a quality that distinguishes an identity, and having followed Maher for years, I'm pretty confident to assert that for Maher, being an atheist is a reactionary stance. That's the whole bit in the clip posted above.
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

Post by Archie2009 »

PadmaVonSamba wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 7:00 pm
Queequeg wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 6:55 pm Atheism seems to me little more than a reactionary posture, maybe a fancy label for an absence of conviction beyond hedonic impulses.
it can be that, if that’s what it is.
But if you are not raised to believe in any type of god, then god stuff just seems weird. It doesn’t make any sense. In that regard, it’s not a reaction at all.
But there are atheist zealots. Converts to atheism.
Dogmatically worshipping materialism. Occassionally some scientists play with a crypto Hindu bs idea like universal consciousness.
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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Religion is always being redefined.
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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Queequeg wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 7:30 pm If the idea of God or gods, or the rejection of God or gods, never figured at all, then the person is outside of that theist/atheist dichotomy.
I was raised in an atheist family. We never talked about God, Jesus, or the absence of such beings. It simply wasn't part of my upbringing.
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

Malcolm wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 8:24 pm
Queequeg wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 7:30 pm If the idea of God or gods, or the rejection of God or gods, never figured at all, then the person is outside of that theist/atheist dichotomy.
I was raised in an atheist family. We never talked about God, Jesus, or the absence of such beings. It simply wasn't part of my upbringing.
Right. To not believe in something is like not having travelled to Greenland or not having ever tasted yak milk. It isn’t an advocacy of something.

I wasn’t bright up in a religious setting, including not being brought up in a Shinto household. My family wasn’t even Japanese. So how would it even arise as an issue? The point is, a-theist is just like that.
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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I was raised in a Jewish family and grew up on military bases through high school. Military bases tend to be more conservative (and Republican) compared to the rest of the population. Everyone had some religion, all were raised in some kind of religion. Approximately 48% of my classmates were Catholic, about 49% a protestant denomination, 2% Jewish, 1% Muslim, literally 0% atheist or agnostic. So it was a shocker for me after I grew up to find out there are so many people who were not raised into any religion.
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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I don’t think he’s correct. I think that he’s projecting his own new-atheist view onto the numbers, but, I believe, that the “nones,” are referring to organized religious affiliation. I think the numbers reflect a lot of “spiritual but not religious,” and many many beliefs that do not correspond to his reductionist materialist idea.

Also, he really comes across as an asshole (in my humble opinion). The “atheist day,” is reflective of the new atheist have-it-both-ways idea. When told that they are being fundamentalists, many public atheists will say “no, not at all, it’s just a lack of particular beliefs and can’t be judged that way,” but then, they will treat it as a belief system when it benefits them. Of course, new-atheism is a belief system, because what it affirms to be objective truth includes many unproven assumptions of reductionist materialism. …which is why most of the “nones,” are not on Bill Maher’s side.
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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climb-up wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 9:30 pm I don’t think he’s correct. I think that he’s projecting his own new-atheist view onto the numbers, but, I believe, that the “nones,” are referring to organized religious affiliation. I think the numbers reflect a lot of “spiritual but not religious,” and many many beliefs that do not correspond to his reductionist materialist idea.

Also, he really comes across as an asshole (in my humble opinion). The “atheist day,” is reflective of the new atheist have-it-both-ways idea. When told that they are being fundamentalists, many public atheists will say “no, not at all, it’s just a lack of particular beliefs and can’t be judged that way,” but then, they will treat it as a belief system when it benefits them. Of course, new-atheism is a belief system, because what it affirms to be objective truth includes many unproven assumptions of reductionist materialism. …which is why most of the “nones,” are not on Bill Maher’s side.
Beyond that, Bill Maher is an asshole.
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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My parents and i lived in communism. In communism Ceausescu would place churches on wheels and move these against people's desire and before their eyes behind other buildings. These were in the way of constructing his socialism.
My grandparents however have received political, rather religious, asylum in the US.

We also did not speak in the home of one or another as not to trigger unknown harm until about March 1977 when a 7.4 earthquake happened.
Then, seeing the swaying of the building, hearing the sounds, because of the fear shared with the others, I turned into a believer.
Next I was falling with the elevator from about the 3rd floor down. By the time I reached the ground I was certain I'd be crushed. I came out of the elevator shaft with my knees shaking and in shock. But I saw the summer light outside the dark hallway and walked out towards a fresh air. The old lady who opened the door for me was still staring at the damage behind me.

I am prone to accidents more than any other zodiacal sign, so I am sometimes counting my blessings. I'm not an atheist because "luck" does not rhyme with "atheism".
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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I never had any formal religious upbringing. When kids in my neighborhood talked about Sunday School stuff, it just sounded really, really weird to me. Years later, a of mine who’d served time in a federal prison said if you ever go in, tell them you are a Catholic. Apparently a lot of people in prison think Catholics can cast evil spells and will leave you alone. I can understand that feeling because of my experiences with the neighborhood kids.

Strangely, these days I’m really good at Bible trivia. I have no idea why!
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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DNS wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 9:25 pm I was raised in a Jewish family and grew up on military bases through high school. Military bases tend to be more conservative (and Republican) compared to the rest of the population. Everyone had some religion, all were raised in some kind of religion. Approximately 48% of my classmates were Catholic, about 49% a protestant denomination, 2% Jewish, 1% Muslim, literally 0% atheist or agnostic. So it was a shocker for me after I grew up to find out there are so many people who were not raised into any religion.
I got a literal ass chewing by an idiot butterbar, because I had "NRP" (No Religious Preference) on my dog tags.

I was also not raised in a religious setting. We were allowed to choose our path as we saw fit. In the end, I tend to be more agnostic than atheist. Disbelief is just another belief. I prefer not knowing.

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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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KeithA wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 10:34 pm I got a literal ass chewing by an idiot butterbar,


:shock: oh my!
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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PadmaVonSamba wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 10:12 pm I never had any formal religious upbringing. When kids in my neighborhood talked about Sunday School stuff, it just sounded really, really weird to me. Years later, a of mine who’d served time in a federal prison said if you ever go in, tell them you are a Catholic. Apparently a lot of people in prison think Catholics can cast evil spells and will leave you alone. I can understand that feeling because of my experiences with the neighborhood kids.
I know a lot of occultists who’ve gotten into Catholicism for the spells (literal transubstantiation, cult of the saints, etc.).
"Death's second name is 'omnipresent.' On the relative truth it seems we become separate. But on the absolute there is no separation." Lama Dawa
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

Post by Konchog Thogme Jampa »

Problem with atheism is there's nothing stopping you falling into nihilism having no respect for anything or anyone not having confidence in karma or thinking there are consequences for your actions
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Re: fastest growing "religion"

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Konchog Thogme Jampa wrote: Sun Apr 02, 2023 1:43 am Problem with atheism is there's nothing stopping you falling into nihilism having no respect for anything or anyone not having confidence in karma or thinking there are consequences for your actions
Why is that ‘the problem with atheism’? that’s pretty judgmental.
If you need to believe in a god to respect anything or anyone, not having confidence in karma or thinking there are consequences for your actions,
then maybe there is something wrong with your god.
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