Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Tata1
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Tata1 »

laowhining wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 5:54 pm
Domingo wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 5:18 pm In the same year, this Khenpo held a retreat on Mandarava Sogtig in Singapore. However, this retreat was only for "practitioners who have received the teaching and transmission from Rinpoche." Therefore, it seems, this Khenpo at least didn't have the permission to give Mandarva transmission back then.
Or he could have felt it better to encourage people to receive the transmission from its source.
This
Malcolm
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Malcolm »

Domingo wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 5:18 pm Malcolm, if you write "ChNN authorized Khenpo Yeshe Wangpo to transmit the Longsal teachings, to the extent of the former giving the latter a hat", does that mean that this Khenpo was only authorized to transmit Longsal to ChNN's tulku, but not to other people?
The post you mention is 7 years old. There would be no reason for this person to give these transmission while ChNN was alive. That changed in 2018.

As far as your other question goes, I have no answer for it.
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by heart »

Shaiksha wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:44 pm
heart wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 9:43 am I have many friends who's master died and then had a reincarnation recognised but it haven't really matter for them so much. Tulkus are mainly important for Tibetan monasteries not for individuals. I personally doubt they will save Western organisations like Rigpa or DC. But who knows. :smile:

/magnus
But, isn't this case unique? Currently, there is no one who is authorized to transmit the Longsal cycle discovered by CNNR? Or, at least, no one who are authorized and are teaching/passing down the cycle. If this continues, then the unique lineage will die out. A tulku may potentially solve this issue.
It seems many unique teachings was lost in Tibet in this same manner and died out. So no.

/magnus
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by conebeckham »

Malcolm wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 1:38 pm
heart wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 9:43 am
Malcolm wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:47 pm

I heard from a reliable source a reincarnation of ChNN has been identified. I have no other details than this, but source is highly placed within the DC.


I have many friends who's master died and then had a reincarnation recognised but it haven't really matter for them so much. Tulkus are mainly important for Tibetan monasteries not for individuals. I personally doubt they will save Western organisations like Rigpa or DC. But who knows. :smile:

/magnus
100% agree.
I will give this a "Third." They may not save Tibetan organizations, either. Who knows, indeed?? :shrug:
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Tata1 »

Anyone know how the relationship between the khempo and the DC is? Is it possible for more western gars to invite him?
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Domingo »

Malcolm wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 6:12 pm
Domingo wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 5:18 pm Malcolm, if you write "ChNN authorized Khenpo Yeshe Wangpo to transmit the Longsal teachings, to the extent of the former giving the latter a hat", does that mean that this Khenpo was only authorized to transmit Longsal to ChNN's tulku, but not to other people?
The post you mention is 7 years old. There would be no reason for this person to give these transmission while ChNN was alive. That changed in 2018.

As far as your other question goes, I have no answer for it.
I'm sorry, probably my english is too poor, but I'm just not sure what "to the extent of the former giving the latter a hat" means. Does that mean, this Khenpo is only authorized to transmit Longsal to the tulku of ChNN?
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Sādhaka »

I heard that Chögyal Namkhai Norbu said something along the lines that he didn't want to come back as a Tulku to this dimension....

Well, then it looks like out of his compassion for us, we get yet another chance (not to say that if he didn't Reincarnate here again that he doesn't have compassion for us of course).

Who might be recognizing his Reincarnation? Could we perhaps expect the Gyalwa Dalai Lama and/or Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak to soon? Or someone else...?
Last edited by Sādhaka on Mon Nov 28, 2022 11:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Malcolm
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Malcolm »

Domingo wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 9:54 pm
Malcolm wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 6:12 pm
Domingo wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 5:18 pm Malcolm, if you write "ChNN authorized Khenpo Yeshe Wangpo to transmit the Longsal teachings, to the extent of the former giving the latter a hat", does that mean that this Khenpo was only authorized to transmit Longsal to ChNN's tulku, but not to other people?
The post you mention is 7 years old. There would be no reason for this person to give these transmission while ChNN was alive. That changed in 2018.

As far as your other question goes, I have no answer for it.
I'm sorry, probably my english is too poor, but I'm just not sure what "to the extent of the former giving the latter a hat" means. Does that mean, this Khenpo is only authorized to transmit Longsal to the tulku of ChNN?
I have no idea.
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Shaiksha »

Tata1 wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 4:08 pm ... Besides one should receive teachings if one is inspired by that teacher, not to receive a particular set of teachings only.

There is a bhutanese dudjom btw my friend.
Thanks for the information. Indeed, we do have a Dudjom reincarnation from Bhutan which I was aware of before.

In relation to choosing a teacher, rather than teachings. I think that they are related. So, let's take CNNR for example. He inspired so many practitioners and you found out about him and now wanted to take his teachings. As he is no longer around, the next best thing is to find someone who is a lineage holder, right?

Similarly, you read about Dudjom Lingpa and you got inspired that some of his disciples got rainbow body. Then, you find a lineage holder to take his teachings. But, in this case, there is no shortage of teachers who can give you the transmissions, empowerments, etc, right?
Last edited by Shaiksha on Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:11 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Virgo »

Malcolm wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:47 pm
Tata1 wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 2:37 pm Chnn was not a fan of tulku system
I heard from a reliable source a reincarnation of ChNN has been identified. I have no other details than this, but source is highly placed within the DC.
This seems odd to me. But perhaps it will give some people faith.

I have mixed feelings. But when I read threads about more Western mind termas appearing, it makes me think spreading Vajrayana without certain key facets of the culture it comes from might be untenable in the end. That isn't to say there aren't some terrific Western teachers -- there most certainly are, and will be. But maybe we are really taking the fish out of water.

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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Virgo »

Nor is it to say that every aspect of Tibetan Culture needs to or should come along with Vajrayana either.

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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Shaiksha »

Sādhaka wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 11:38 pm I heard that Chögyal Namkhai Norbu said something along the lines that he didn't want to come back as a Tulku to this dimension....

Well, then it looks like out of his compassion for us, we get yet another chance (not to say that if he didn't Reincarnate here again that he doesn't have compassion for us of course).

Who might be recognizing his Reincarnation? Could we perhaps expect the Gyalwa Dalai Lama and/or Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak to soon? Or someone else...?
My understanding with the tulku system, you should not take it too literally. They go through certain processes to identify a 'suitable child' and then 'bless the child with the wisdom mind of the late master' and so on. So, the fact that there were two Dudjom reincarnations living together at one time, etc, etc. I now take this whole business with a pinch of salt.
Last edited by Shaiksha on Tue Nov 29, 2022 1:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Sādhaka »

Well there are Body, Speech, Mind, Qualities, and Activities Incarnations (i.e. there can be at least five) of any given Tulku.

My current living-Guru is a Bönpo; yet at the same time if Chögyal Rinpoche has 'decided' to appear to us again, I'll pay attention to his Reincarnation in earnest
Last edited by Sādhaka on Tue Nov 29, 2022 2:42 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Malcolm »

Sādhaka wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 2:39 am Well there are Body, Speech, Mind, Qualities, and Activities Incarnations (i.e. there can be at least five) of any given Tulku.
This is a somewhat modern Tibetan system, that really has no precedent prior the 18th century of which I am aware. And even the earlier system has no basis outside of Tibet.

Moreover, actual Tulkus, nirmanakays, have no such limitations.
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by florin »

Malcolm wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:47 pm
Tata1 wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 2:37 pm Chnn was not a fan of tulku system
I heard from a reliable source a reincarnation of ChNN has been identified. I have no other details than this, but source is highly placed within the DC.
Does this imply Rinpoche left a letter with instructions?
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by treehuggingoctopus »

Domingo wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 9:54 pmDoes that mean, this Khenpo is only authorized to transmit Longsal to the tulku of ChNN?
That would be rather strange, wouldn't it? Normally the hat event means that the receiver is a recognised and legitimate lineage holder, and she or he can transmit lineage teachings as required.
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by dzoki »

florin wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 9:23 am
Malcolm wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:47 pm
Tata1 wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 2:37 pm Chnn was not a fan of tulku system
I heard from a reliable source a reincarnation of ChNN has been identified. I have no other details than this, but source is highly placed within the DC.
Does this imply Rinpoche left a letter with instructions?
Rinpoche did as far as I know leave a letter, where he says that there will be no tulku of him. So what this implies is that someone found a boy and slapped a name onto him, just like it happened with Patrul Rinpoche, Ju Mipham and was attempted with Chadral Sangye Dorje.
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by florin »

dzoki wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 1:34 pm
florin wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 9:23 am
Malcolm wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:47 pm

I heard from a reliable source a reincarnation of ChNN has been identified. I have no other details than this, but source is highly placed within the DC.
Does this imply Rinpoche left a letter with instructions?
Rinpoche did as far as I know leave a letter, where he says that there will be no tulku of him. So what this implies is that someone found a boy and slapped a name onto him, just like it happened with Patrul Rinpoche, Ju Mipham and was attempted with Chadral Sangye Dorje.

Yes. That is why i asked this question. It has the potential to turn into a massive controversy. We all know what Rinpoche’s view was on the tulkus system and him coming back. And now they find a tulku of his ?
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by Malcolm »

florin wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 9:23 am
Malcolm wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:47 pm
Tata1 wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 2:37 pm Chnn was not a fan of tulku system
I heard from a reliable source a reincarnation of ChNN has been identified. I have no other details than this, but source is highly placed within the DC.
Does this imply Rinpoche left a letter with instructions?
I imagine, just my guess, that this recognition happened in Tibet, by Tibetans, for Tibetan reasons, which have nothing to do with the DC, Longsal, or even Dzogchen.
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Re: Did Ch. Namkhai Norbu R. attain rainbow body?

Post by jet.urgyen »

Malcolm wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 1:46 pm
florin wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 9:23 am
Malcolm wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:47 pm

I heard from a reliable source a reincarnation of ChNN has been identified. I have no other details than this, but source is highly placed within the DC.
Does this imply Rinpoche left a letter with instructions?
I imagine, just my guess, that this recognition happened in Tibet, by Tibetans, for Tibetan reasons, which have nothing to do with the DC, Longsal, or even Dzogchen.
who recognized him?
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