something extremely uncomofortable happens when I lust

General discussion, particularly exploring the Dharma in the modern world.
Vasana
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Re: something extremely uncomofortable happens when I lust

Post by Vasana »

PadmaVonSamba wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 9:00 pm
Vasana wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 4:46 pm
PadmaVonSamba wrote: Sun Jan 01, 2023 1:18 pm
That’s actually a mistaken view. The Buddha listed many misfortunes that are not caused by karma.
Where are these misfortunes spoken of?
Sivaka Sutra:
http://tibetanbuddhistencyclopedia.com/ ... vaka_Sutta
I think certain Mahayana sutras may present different views on karma and it's results, but that doesn't invalidate the common sense logic of the Sivaka sutra.

The image I attached feels relevant here.
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'When thoughts arise, recognise them clearly as your teacher'— Gampopa
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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: something extremely uncomofortable happens when I lust

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

Vasana wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 9:41 pm I think certain Mahayana sutras may present different views on karma and it's results, but that doesn't invalidate the common sense logic of the Sivaka sutra.
The image I attached feels relevant here.
Well, of course nothing arises which isn’t a composite of other causes. That’s basically the principle of dependent origination.

The point in this discussion is that thinking that unrelated misfortunes arise because one craves sweet food or sexual pleasure doesn’t really make sense.
The cartoon of the camel illustrates that point. Whatever we experience for the moment is a temporary summation of an infinite variety of causes and conditions.

Since everything can (theoretically) be traced back to causes, we could say that technically, the Big Bang is still happening.
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rozoksmaslom
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Re: something extremely uncomofortable happens when I lust

Post by rozoksmaslom »

PadmaVonSamba wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 2:44 pm
In your OP you say that maybe the universe is causing you to desire sweets and masturbation, and these desires are resulting in you having various misfortunes.
omw, what the actual swear word :rolling:
I never said anything like that, even remotely :D
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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: something extremely uncomofortable happens when I lust

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

rozoksmaslom wrote: Tue Mar 07, 2023 7:19 pm
PadmaVonSamba wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 2:44 pm
In your OP you say that maybe the universe is causing you to desire sweets and masturbation, and these desires are resulting in you having various misfortunes.
omw, what the actual swear word :rolling:
I never said anything like that, even remotely :D
Perhaps you simply have difficulty in taking responsibility for your actions, or have memory issues, and instead think that some kind of cosmic karma is the reason for what happens to you, because this is literally your opening statement:
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rozoksmaslom
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Re: something extremely uncomofortable happens when I lust

Post by rozoksmaslom »

PadmaVonSamba wrote: Tue Mar 07, 2023 10:13 pm
rozoksmaslom wrote: Tue Mar 07, 2023 7:19 pm
PadmaVonSamba wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 2:44 pm
In your OP you say that maybe the universe is causing you to desire sweets and masturbation, and these desires are resulting in you having various misfortunes.
omw, what the actual swear word :rolling:
I never said anything like that, even remotely :D
Perhaps you simply have difficulty in taking responsibility for your actions, or have memory issues, and instead think that some kind of cosmic karma is the reason for what happens to you, because this is literally your opening statement:
Universe sending you temptations, alluring things your way and causing you to have desires (as if, directly?) are two different things. Cause that would be super weird. (as if my situation wasn't weird enough)
I stated recently (probably a few times at this point) that it wasn't mere desires or cravings (which only exist in mental/emotional planes), but actual bodily actions, that triggered these demanifestations.

You seem to be keen on saying that the causes and effects that I stated have nothing to do with each other..
Have you read The Sutra On Cause And Effect?
http://www.cttbusa.org/cause_effect/cau ... effect.htm
There are many things there which don't really follow any usual, ordinary causality.
Last edited by rozoksmaslom on Fri Mar 10, 2023 12:04 am, edited 2 times in total.
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rozoksmaslom
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Re: something extremely uncomofortable happens when I lust

Post by rozoksmaslom »

PadmaVonSamba wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 1:54 pm
rozoksmaslom wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 8:19 am I can absolutely think of instances or cases where there's no judgement involved and you'll experience something we can describe as reward/punishment.
Give one example, please.
Just because you believe that something is a reward or punishment doesn’t mean that it is, does it?
Talking about this is just a matter of semantics/playing with words, which I don't think solves anything, but you're the one who brought the reward/punishment aspect into this (iirc).
But to answer your question, ok.... if you work out every day for a year, you'll reap the benefits of being shredded and fit. You'll eat nothing but candy or literal junk, sit on the couch all day every day, your teeth will rot and eventually fall all out, you'll be fat and feel like crap. So you can say you'll get rewarded/punished by your own actions. By who? By life. By your biochemistry. Which is life also.
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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: something extremely uncomofortable happens when I lust

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

rozoksmaslom wrote: Fri Mar 10, 2023 12:16 am
PadmaVonSamba wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 1:54 pm
rozoksmaslom wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 8:19 am I can absolutely think of instances or cases where there's no judgement involved and you'll experience something we can describe as reward/punishment.
Give one example, please.
Just because you believe that something is a reward or punishment doesn’t mean that it is, does it?
Talking about this is just a matter of semantics/playing with words, which I don't think solves anything, but you're the one who brought the reward/punishment aspect into this (iirc).
But to answer your question, ok.... if you work out every day for a year, you'll reap the benefits of being shredded and fit. You'll eat nothing but candy or literal junk, sit on the couch all day every day, your teeth will rot and eventually fall all out, you'll be fat and feel like crap. So you can say you'll get rewarded/punished by your own actions. By who? By life. By your biochemistry. Which is life also.
I’m not saying that you haven’t created your own misery. I’m saying there’s no reason to believe that the negative effects you are experiencing have anything to do with what you think the causes are.

You asked for people’s thoughts concerning your situation. So, that’s what I’m offering. Just because things seem to happen together doesn’t mean there’s any actual connection. The sutra on cause and effect doesn’t have anything to do with it.
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