5th School of Tibetan Buddhism

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nyonchung
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Re: 5th School of Tibetan Buddhism

Post by nyonchung »

Forgot also that the Chagzampa can be considered as a branch of the zhijé / chö tradition!

Back to the Shangpa tradition, it quicly lost its textual explanation traditions, so many shangpa masters (most of them being from the Tsang area) studied, if not in Sakya itself, in sakyapa monasteries like Lelung etc.

One key person in the textual organization of the shangpa transmissions was Khetsün Zhönnu Drub (1255-1319), he notably re-arrangered the rdo rje tshigs rkang according to methodic lines (probably learned in Sakya - according to Künga Drölchog, who quotes earlier Sakya masters, he played the same role in collecting part of the lam 'bras - precise references in the gsan yig=
- Kun dga' grol mchog thob yig - f. 166b (p. 294) : rtsa ba rdo rje tshigs rkang / tshigs gsal / them yig / bzhi lam 'bras gsum / rgya gar mkha' gro'i khyad par gyi gdams pa bcwa lnga / khyung po nyams len drug ldan / rgyu lus sbyang ba gnyis ldan khyung po mdzad pas / rmi lam 'byams gcod yig rnying / rmo gcog pas mdzad pa'i nyams myong yon tan rgya mtsho / sgyu ma 'od phreng / sangs rgyas ston pa 'i lam mchog dri med / zhus lan zla ba'i dkyil 'khor / zhus lan nyi ma'i dkyi 'khor / zhus - f. 167 (p. 295) - lan ma rig mun sel / sgyu lus 'dzin par rang grol

Most importantly he was the first to put the instructions the gser chos in writing, and is, in my opinion, probably the one who compiled the rnam thar of the early masters of the tradition (as we know them nowadays), and I think, again, following the historiographical model of the Sakya tradition (he was a disciple of Drogön Phagpa, and of Chim Namkha Drag)
Quite interestingly Sakya Pendita (born some 60 years after Khyungpo Neljor) is mentioned in one of the tshigs rkang ....
His disciple Zhangtön Jangchub Sherab (both in Sakya and Shangpa lineages) completed his work
Dölpopa is a disciple in the Shangpa tradition, Dragphug Sönam Pel (1277-1350) in the Sakya tradition

Oh, and he certainly played a role in the organization of the chö teachings he received from Sanggyé Tönpa (along with the Shangpa line)

All schools are deeply interconnected
"Me and the sky don't hold views - Me and the river have no fixed practice
Me and the madman don't have a guide- Me and the rainbow have no experiences
Me, the sun and the moon have no certitudes - Me and the jewel bear no fruit" - Dampa Sanggyé as quoted by Domar Mingyur Dorjé (born 1675)
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nyonchung
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Re: 5th School of Tibetan Buddhism

Post by nyonchung »

PeterC wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 7:27 am
nyonchung wrote: Tue Jun 21, 2022 9:34 pm Gelugpas are, by far, the largest in number and, never forget it, the state school since 1642, they may appear quite united, but that was not always the case
Not the case today either. Without wanting to legitimize their breakaway movement, it is numerically pretty large.
Having been the state religion in Central Tibet for over 3 centuries left a deep mark, and for practical purposes, it's still the case - as for numbers, if you include Tibet proper, Amdo (where Nyingmas were for long forbiden or restricted by the Qing) and Kham, Inner and Outer Mongolia (state school under the Qing), Buryats and Kalmuks (state school since around 1742) , they're still huge and ahead. The creation of huge Nyingma instutitions is certainly a major trend in Kham since almost two centuries, but there is a parallel redevelopment of Gelug institutions there. And there is an untold assimilationist movement (that tolerates other school,as long as they will be sooner or later assimilated) and it's not a new one, it has a long history - tolerating nyingmapas, sakyapas as long as they perform their rituals for state benefit, but imposing onthem Sera cursus - as was the case in Central from 1680 onwards - and when the XIIIth Dalai lama started to roll back the blackout on Sakyapa philosophical teachings, you had the Phabongkhapa counter-reform etc. all this has to be seen on the long term and with some patience ...
"Me and the sky don't hold views - Me and the river have no fixed practice
Me and the madman don't have a guide- Me and the rainbow have no experiences
Me, the sun and the moon have no certitudes - Me and the jewel bear no fruit" - Dampa Sanggyé as quoted by Domar Mingyur Dorjé (born 1675)
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Ayu
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Re: 5th School of Tibetan Buddhism

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[A tail of "undesired side discussion" has been removed, finally. Sorry for any inconvenience.]
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nyonchung
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Re: 5th School of Tibetan Buddhism

Post by nyonchung »

So, to sum it up, the Jonangpas are technically not the 5th, but 6th, since HHDL brought the Bönpo in the fold years back.
This has more to do with with the CTA (ex TIE) setup (and, well a bit of bureaucracy) than anything else.

The particularity being that it is a quite regional school(in the Ngawa area), centred around the Dzamthang principality, pretty active unde the Ming and Qing dynasties, the Dzamthang Chöjé at a time controled most of Golog and half of Gyalrong.

As I mentioned before, had been placed at their head the reincarnation of the Jetsün Dampa, supposed to be one of the reincarnations ot Taranatha and the Gelugpa religious ruler of Khalkha Mongolia - former "Outer Mongolie, persent-day Repulic of Mongolia
This made a lot of people confused, since the previous incarnation was not particularly remarkable, living as a layman most of his life - he was sent to study and do retret with the late Kalu Rinpoché but quickly left, oviously not very motivated nor talented.

In the present situation, seems not a very skillful move, seen both from the POW of people in Dzamthang, and of Mongolian Gelugpas - if not Mongolian authorities.
Plus, Dzamthang has its own lineage of reincarnations of Taranatha, and never accepted that the first Jetsün Damapa was the actual tülku of Taranatha - and the question is relatively well documented
One muts be aware that actually many tülku lineages put Taranatha among theit former lives, Jamgön Kongrül, Dzarong Trülzhig Rinpoché , many ...

For all practical purpose, the central transmission is the integral Dro lineage of the Kalachakra (but it's also present in the Sakya, Karma-kagyü and as few now in the Nyingma tradition since Kathog Rigdzin 1 Tsewang Norbu - 1698-1755), with a wealth of lineages of lung from Taranatha that totally disapearred elsewhere
And, yes, they are formally gzhan stong pa
But they keep a large amount of Sakyapa traditions - in fact the Dzamthang monasteries were not "rediscovered", but re-labeled "jonangpa" possibly relatively late, proof being that the "History of the Jonang Tradition" is quite a modern text:
- Jo nang chos 'byung
= dPal ldan jo nang pa'i chos 'byung rgyal ba'i chos tshul gsal byed zla ba'i sgron me
- cover title = "Jo nang chos 'byung zla ba'i sgron me"
- author = Ngag dbang blo gros sgrags pa (1920-1985) - Krung go bod kyi shes rig dpe skrun khang, Xining, 1992
and they were probably described by outsides as "sakyapas"

Michael Sheehy and the Jonang foundation did a considerable work, unearthing texts, publishing them
https://jonangpa.com/mission
you have there the translation of the biographies of a good number of Jonangpa masters (quoting the Tibetan text mentioned above)
and, for the Dro tradition of Kalachakra and varous aspects of the kalachakra tradition, the highly informative:
http://kalacakra.org/
Last edited by Ayu on Sat Jun 25, 2022 12:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Off topic comment on moderation removed. You can easily discuss this with me via PM.
"Me and the sky don't hold views - Me and the river have no fixed practice
Me and the madman don't have a guide- Me and the rainbow have no experiences
Me, the sun and the moon have no certitudes - Me and the jewel bear no fruit" - Dampa Sanggyé as quoted by Domar Mingyur Dorjé (born 1675)
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