Is Zen simply "sitting"/Zazen?

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Tao
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Re: Is Zen simply "sitting"/Zazen?

Post by Tao »

>still too much words. just tell me one word. and ı know what ı am chasing.

Shobogenzo are thounsand pages, maybe you need more words than you think
master of puppets
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Re: Is Zen simply "sitting"/Zazen?

Post by master of puppets »

Tao wrote: Wed Jun 29, 2022 7:57 am >still too much words. just tell me one word. and ı know what ı am chasing.

Shobogenzo are thounsand pages, maybe you need more words than you think
:namaste:
master of puppets
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Re: Is Zen simply "sitting"/Zazen?

Post by master of puppets »

original question
bcol01 wrote: Tue May 31, 2022 6:49 pm Is zen simply "sitting"/zazen?
If you're progressing under zaten sure it is much more than sitting. If not having progress sure it is just sitting.
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Johnny Dangerous
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Re: Is Zen simply "sitting"/Zazen?

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

master of puppets wrote: Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:40 am
Tao wrote: Tue Jun 28, 2022 11:04 am Mental stillness is needed to see.

But it's not the goal.

Not even to see is the goal.

There must be some "return" to a not-always-still mind who is aware of what you saw in stillness.

So we have some possibilities:

Non-stillnes and non-essence (nature of mind) -> Beginning
Stillness in ignorance -> focusing/absortion
Stillnes while seeing the essence -> kensho/understanding
Non-stillness while seeing the essence -> samadhi/shikantaza

and then bear in mind how pervasive is each state, when the last state is 24x7 pervasive you are very close...

Some Zen propose some variations like:

Non-stillnes and non-essence (nature of mind) -> Beginning
Stillnes and Non-stillness in ignorance
Stillness and Non-stillness while seeing the essence

PS: Of course terminology is very rough, sorry, hope you are tolerant :)
still too much words. just tell me one word. and ı know what ı am chasing.
There is no direct knowledge of the mind without knowledge of its movement and continual manifestation.

One word answers are just sophistry most of the time.
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when afflicted by disease

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when sad

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when suffering occurs

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when you are scared

-Khunu Lama
master of puppets
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Re: Is Zen simply "sitting"/Zazen?

Post by master of puppets »

Johnny Dangerous wrote: Fri Jul 22, 2022 6:50 pm
master of puppets wrote: Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:40 am
Tao wrote: Tue Jun 28, 2022 11:04 am Mental stillness is needed to see.

But it's not the goal.

Not even to see is the goal.

There must be some "return" to a not-always-still mind who is aware of what you saw in stillness.

So we have some possibilities:

Non-stillnes and non-essence (nature of mind) -> Beginning
Stillness in ignorance -> focusing/absortion
Stillnes while seeing the essence -> kensho/understanding
Non-stillness while seeing the essence -> samadhi/shikantaza

and then bear in mind how pervasive is each state, when the last state is 24x7 pervasive you are very close...

Some Zen propose some variations like:

Non-stillnes and non-essence (nature of mind) -> Beginning
Stillnes and Non-stillness in ignorance
Stillness and Non-stillness while seeing the essence

PS: Of course terminology is very rough, sorry, hope you are tolerant :)
still too much words. just tell me one word. and ı know what ı am chasing.
There is no direct knowledge of the mind without knowledge of its movement and continual manifestation.

One word answers are just sophistry most of the time.
If you can go many with the one word it is still an experience.
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