Hevajra or Chakrsamvara Empowerements in 2022

[Soma999]

If commitments are too « rigid » in their forms, instead of helping you they can be felt as a burden.

If people take an empowerment, there is something in them that feels called. They can answer to this call at their own rythmns.

For some people, one sadhana per week is whag suits them. Would they have to do it everyday, they could feel it as a burden.

No one have the same opportunities, time, possibilities… everyone should see for themselves what is good for them.

[Lobsang Chojor]

If commitments are too « rigid » in their forms, instead of helping you they can be felt as a burden.

If people take an empowerment, there is something in them that feels called. They can answer to this call at their own rythmns.

For some people, one sadhana per week is whag suits them. Would they have to do it everyday, they could feel it as a burden.

No one have the same opportunities, time, possibilities… everyone should see for themselves what is good for them.

It's not like that though, your guru tells you the commitments after the empowerment and if you keep them. If you have to do a sadhana everyday, you do the sadhana everyday not whenever you feel like it.

Commitments shouldn't be viewed as a burden but as the kindness of the guru making sure we practice everyday and we can make progress.

[Soma999]

I have participated at quiet many empowerments, and 99 % of the time the commitments were given before so that each one could chose if they could hold the commitment. It didn’t make the empowerment less profund.

Sadhakas who live some commitments as a burden are a reality, and i don’t see any good in it.

[Malcolm]

If commitments are too « rigid » in their forms, instead of helping you they can be felt as a burden.

Practice commitments are one thing, samaya another.

[conebeckham]

I also have more transmissions than I could ever practice on a daily basis, FWIW. Sometimes it is the empowerment itself that provides an opportunity for liberation or some sort of experience. But I think it’s essential for each of us to question our motivations. And as Malcolm said, samayas and practice commitment are two different things—so one’s relationship with the Vajra master bears examination, as it is perhaps the most important thing.

[Toenail]

I am just curious--why would someone NOT practice the sadhana, after getting the wang? Or, asked another way, why would anyone want to receive the Wang and not practice the method?

Receiving empowerment itself is a valid path of attaining buddhahood. Many people have a daily practice and the view generally encouraged is to practice all deities in one by keeping up a main practice. Also everybody will do Vajrasattva at least 21 times a day with the same view. If you attend one terma collection empwoerment or whatever you will have received dozens of empowerment and practices. It is impossible to practice them all, let alone every day. It is neurotic to think one has to practice all empowerments one receives and it means one does not cultivate the right understanding.

[heart]

I am just curious--why would someone NOT practice the sadhana, after getting the wang? Or, asked another way, why would anyone want to receive the Wang and not practice the method?

Receiving empowerment itself is a valid path of attaining buddhahood. Many people have a daily practice and the view generally encouraged is to practice all deities in one by keeping up a main practice. Also everybody will do Vajrasattva at least 21 times a day with the same view. If you attend one terma collection empwoerment or whatever you will have received dozens of empowerment and practices. It is impossible to practice them all, let alone every day. It is neurotic to think one has to practice all empowerments one receives and it means one does not cultivate the right understanding.

This is certainly not true in all traditions, like Sakya and Gelug. Many years ago I was in Dharamsala and HHDL was going to give a teaching on emptiness and then the empowerment of the Yamapntaka. I wanted to listen to the teaching but since I at the time was practicing the Karma Kagyu Ngondro I had some doubts about taking the empowerment. After the teaching HHDL started immediate with the empowerment and the first thing he said was; "Everyone taking this empowerment have to practice the sadhana every day for the rest of your life. If you're not able to do that you should leave right now." I and my girlfriend was sitting pretty close to his holiness and as we where also the only persons that where leaving and we had everyones eyes on us while HHDL and everyone else waited for us to leave. Pretty embarrassing. But that is the reality outside the Nyingma.

/magnus

[James84]

If commitments are too « rigid » in their forms, instead of helping you they can be felt as a burden.

Practice commitments are one thing, samaya another.

How long do practice commitments last? And is it a breach of Samaya if you don't do the practice? I had my first empowerment and made the rookie mistake of not asking before. As far as Samaya goes the Vajra master did not mention anything but asked us to recite at least 7 mantras for the deity a day. I have been doing that, but wondered how long this should be done

[Konchog1]

"Everyone taking this empowerment have to practice the sadhana every day for the rest of your life. If you're not able to do that you should leave right now." I and my girlfriend was sitting pretty close to his holiness and as we where also the only persons that where leaving and we had everyones eyes on us while HHDL and everyone else waited for us to leave. Pretty embarrassing. But that is the reality outside the Nyingma.

If I was there I would have said, "look, the wise people who know their limits are leaving".

How long do practice commitments last? And is it a breach of Samaya if you don't do the practice? I had my first empowerment and made the rookie mistake of not asking before. As far as Samaya goes the Vajra master did not mention anything but asked us to recite at least 7 mantras for the deity a day. I have been doing that, but wondered how long this should be done

Until Enlightenment or death, whichever comes first.

[Johnny Dangerous]

I am just curious--why would someone NOT practice the sadhana, after getting the wang? Or, asked another way, why would anyone want to receive the Wang and not practice the method?

Receiving empowerment itself is a valid path of attaining buddhahood. Many people have a daily practice and the view generally encouraged is to practice all deities in one by keeping up a main practice. Also everybody will do Vajrasattva at least 21 times a day with the same view. If you attend one terma collection empwoerment or whatever you will have received dozens of empowerment and practices. It is impossible to practice them all, let alone every day. It is neurotic to think one has to practice all empowerments one receives and it means one does not cultivate the right understanding.

This is certainly not true in all traditions, like Sakya and Gelug. Many years ago I was in Dharamsala and HHDL was going to give a teaching on emptiness and then the empowerment of the Yamapntaka. I wanted to listen to the teaching but since I at the time was practicing the Karma Kagyu Ngondro I had some doubts about taking the empowerment. After the teaching HHDL started immediate with the empowerment and the first thing he said was; "Everyone taking this empowerment have to practice the sadhana every day for the rest of your life. If you're not able to do that you should leave right now." I and my girlfriend was sitting pretty close to his holiness and as we where also the only persons that where leaving and we had everyones eyes on us while HHDL and everyone else waited for us to leave. Pretty embarrassing. But that is the reality outside the Nyingma.

/magnus

There are all kinds of transmissions one can get in Sakya that don’t involve a daily commitment. Idk that any are actual wangs, I think they are jenangs or something of the sort. I’ve taken a bunch of these and only one had any requirement- weekly at that. I feel the attitude I was implicitly taught is that if there is, say, a short empowerment etc. given by a lama with no restrictions/requirements it is worth attending on principle even if you don’t presently intend on doing the practice; simply due to the blessing it confers and the significance of connections made.

This is not so for the HYT affairs of course where daily practice is specified , but let’s be serious people get all kinds of transmissions more generally that they do not practice.

[Nicholas2727]

How long do practice commitments last? And is it a breach of Samaya if you don't do the practice? I had my first empowerment and made the rookie mistake of not asking before. As far as Samaya goes the Vajra master did not mention anything but asked us to recite at least 7 mantras for the deity a day. I have been doing that, but wondered how long this should be done

Until Enlightenment or death, whichever comes first.
[/quote]

How does this work for people who switch traditions? I know a few zen teachers who talk about how they were formerly Vajrayana practitioners and I would guess they have some practice commitments? Maybe they haven't abandoned them and do it in private, but I feel it could be hard balancing the two practices.

Possibly a better question for them haha

[Konchog1]

How long do practice commitments last? And is it a breach of Samaya if you don't do the practice? I had my first empowerment and made the rookie mistake of not asking before. As far as Samaya goes the Vajra master did not mention anything but asked us to recite at least 7 mantras for the deity a day. I have been doing that, but wondered how long this should be done

Until Enlightenment or death, whichever comes first.

How does this work for people who switch traditions? I know a few zen teachers who talk about how they were formerly Vajrayana practitioners and I would guess they have some practice commitments? Maybe they haven't abandoned them and do it in private, but I feel it could be hard balancing the two practices.

Possibly a better question for them haha
[/quote]I remember hearing Virupa lived at a non-Tantric monastery and practiced his sadhana in private. Otherwise, yes they abandoned them. You should ask them.

[ajhayes]

I float a bit between Zen and Tibetan. Even when my practice tends more toward Zen, I ensure that I keep my Samaya commitments. That's just me though, others results may vary.

[Kai lord]

If commitments are too « rigid » in their forms, instead of helping you they can be felt as a burden.

If people take an empowerment, there is something in them that feels called. They can answer to this call at their own rythmns.

For some people, one sadhana per week is whag suits them. Would they have to do it everyday, they could feel it as a burden.

No one have the same opportunities, time, possibilities… everyone should see for themselves what is good for them.

One easy way out is to only take those empowerments you want to practice or already have.

[Malcolm]

How does this work for people who switch traditions? I know a few zen teachers who talk about how they were formerly Vajrayana practitioners and I would guess they have some practice commitments? Maybe they haven't abandoned them and do it in private, but I feel it could be hard balancing the two practices.

Practice commitments are voluntary. And if you find you don't really gel with a practice, there is no reason to continue with it. Of course, when teachers give important cycles, they want people to take them seriously. But there is actually no _samaya_ to do this or that practice. These commitments are given to discourage the idly curious.

[jmlee369]

I am just curious--why would someone NOT practice the sadhana, after getting the wang? Or, asked another way, why would anyone want to receive the Wang and not practice the method?

Receiving empowerment itself is a valid path of attaining buddhahood. Many people have a daily practice and the view generally encouraged is to practice all deities in one by keeping up a main practice. Also everybody will do Vajrasattva at least 21 times a day with the same view. If you attend one terma collection empwoerment or whatever you will have received dozens of empowerment and practices. It is impossible to practice them all, let alone every day. It is neurotic to think one has to practice all empowerments one receives and it means one does not cultivate the right understanding.

This is certainly not true in all traditions, like Sakya and Gelug. Many years ago I was in Dharamsala and HHDL was going to give a teaching on emptiness and then the empowerment of the Yamapntaka. I wanted to listen to the teaching but since I at the time was practicing the Karma Kagyu Ngondro I had some doubts about taking the empowerment. After the teaching HHDL started immediate with the empowerment and the first thing he said was; "Everyone taking this empowerment have to practice the sadhana every day for the rest of your life. If you're not able to do that you should leave right now." I and my girlfriend was sitting pretty close to his holiness and as we where also the only persons that where leaving and we had everyones eyes on us while HHDL and everyone else waited for us to leave. Pretty embarrassing. But that is the reality outside the Nyingma.

/magnus

Toenail, it's not the case that every Gelug Highest Yoga Tantra initiation comes with a practice commitment, that is totally up to the vajra master. Thus, two people receiving the same initiation from the same guru on different occasions can have completely different practice commitments, one person might have none at all while the other is expected to do at least the short sadhana daily for the rest of their life as well completing the enabling retreat at least once. But whatever commitment is given, we are expected to keep.

As for your experience Magnus, I think His Holiness would have been pleased. During the Kalachakra initiation in Bloomington USA in 1999 he said:

I would like to congratulate those who are attending here only for the preliminary teachings and not the Kalachakra. Because in actual fact the topics I am covering in the preliminary teachings are the more important elements of the practice. So I would like to express my appreciation for those who are just attending the preliminary teachings.

Those who do the opposite, not attend the preliminary teachings but rather come just for the Kalachakra Empowerment Ceremony, I must admit that these people are more clever than I am. When I announce a Kalachakra Empowerment, because Kalachakra is so popular it attracts people, but what I really intend is to spend time during the preliminary teachings and speak more about the general aspects of the path of the Dharma. So these people have in fact managed to fool me but of course if among those people who are just attending the Kalachakra teaching if they have a firm grounding in the common paths, the general practices of the Dharma then of course it is fine. But if people simply come for the empowerment with no real grounding in the preliminary practices then simply attending the Kalachakra ceremony alone, I do not know what benefit that can have.

[Aloke]

Sahaja Hevajra Empowerment
At the persistent request of some students
Khenpo Migmar
will bestow online
Sahaja Hevajra Empowerment

August 13th
from 1:30pm to 3:30pm.
BOSTON EST TIME ZONE

Suggested PayPal donation
$30-$50 towards translation fund.

ZOOM LINK HERE:
https://us02web.zoom.us/j/8720826043
password 'lama'

For further information, please contact us at [email protected]
Sakya Institute: sakya.net
Mangalam Studio: mangalamstudio.com
Mangalam Online Course: mangalamonlinecourse.com
Lama Migmar: lamamigmar.net

[Terma]

How does this work for people who switch traditions? I know a few zen teachers who talk about how they were formerly Vajrayana practitioners and I would guess they have some practice commitments? Maybe they haven't abandoned them and do it in private, but I feel it could be hard balancing the two practices.

Practice commitments are voluntary. And if you find you don't really gel with a practice, there is no reason to continue with it. Of course, when teachers give important cycles, they want people to take them seriously. But there is actually no _samaya_ to do this or that practice. These commitments are given to discourage the idly curious.

Really? I understand the notion that we are all free to do what we please, but when your guru gives a practice commitment and one just decides to disregard it, does that not go against your guru's wishes?

Pretty slippery slope with this one I think.

[Sādhaka]

First of all Samaya isn’t to be discussed on an open forum, although I think that it’s okay to say the word, as long as we don’t go too much into detail, especially specifics of details related to practices.

Now not to speak for Malcolm, though he just said that practice commitments are given to discourage the idly curious from attending. In other words if a newcomer to Highest Yoga Tantra attends a Empowerment for the first time, and they have no other way to keep their Samaya, of course they should follow up with the practice commitments.

For someone who isn’t a newcomer who is already keeping their Samaya, they can choose to add the new practice commitments to what they’re already doing, or not. The biggest thing is to keep the Samayas. Practice commitments and Samaya are not the same thing. They can be in a sense though as I pointed out above.

For an extreme example, imagine how many Empowerments Jamgon Kongtrul or Jamyang Khyentse Wangpo received. Do you think they did all the practices that they received, every single day? That would be impossible.

Now if one receives a Empowerment for a important Cycle and the Guru giving it becomes one’s Tsawai Lama, then that’s perhaps a different matter. However if one is receiving a Empowerment because they feel a connection to the Lama giving it and they also want to have connection to the specific practice, yet they already have a Tsawai Lama, then the important thing is to keep the general Highest Yoga Tantra Samayas, that can be fulfilled with Guru Yoga (often with the Hundred-Syllable practice, although there are many other Guruyoga practices) wherein all one’s Yidams and practice commitments are fulfilled.

Of course there is a little bit different view on this between Gelug and other schools; but this was already brought up in the other thread, and relates to what I just said here about if the Lama giving the Empowerment becomes one’s Tsawai Lama or not. Also if the Gelug Lama bestowing the Empowerment is also a Rimé Lama, then they may agree that all practice commitments that one has received are fulfilled as long as one is keeping their Samaya in general….

[Malcolm]

Really? I understand the notion that we are all free to do what we please, but when your guru gives a practice commitment and one just decides to disregard it, does that not go against your guru's wishes?

Depends on your level of understanding. If you understand that all practices have the same basic point, and unify everything in guru yoga, there is no problem. If you don't have this understanding, you are going to wind up in trouble.

The basis command one receives from one's gurus are: practice until you attain awakening. It doesn't really matter which practice you do, as long as you do something.

On the other hand, I am Dzogchen practitioner of the tradition of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu, and so I follow his directions.