Most Important Empowerments in the Sakya Tradition

[Schopenhauer]

What are the most important empowerments in the Sakya tradition, besides the Hevajra and Lamdre empowerments?

[Malcolm]

What are the most important empowerments in the Sakya tradition, besides the Hevajra and Lamdre empowerments?

Vajrayoginī

Then in no particular order:
Vajrakīlaya
Sarvavidyā
Guhyasamāja
Vajrabhairava
Cakrasamvara
Mahākāla

[n8pee]

Vajrayoginī

Why is this?

[Malcolm]

Vajrayoginī

Why is this?

Apart from Lamdre, Naropa’s Khecari is the most important set of instructions in Sakya. It’s easy to practice, profound, and complete. According to the Sakya Tradition, it’s the ultimate practice lineage from the Cakrasamvara tantra tradition as preserved by this school.

[WeiHan]

Vajrayoginī

Why is this?

Heard quite many Sakyapas practiced this only and attained siddhahood. In one of Namkhai Norbu's book about his uncle, he mentioned he visited the Siddha of Nalong with his uncle. This Siddha of Nalong was one of those that attained full accomplishment with Vajrayogini practice alone. After he passed away, his body naturally manifested unending relics just like the late Choying Dorje Rinpoche. One of his vajra brother, a Ngor khenpo attained full rainbow body- his body left for Kechari without remain. These are quite recent.

[Passing By]

Vajrayoginī

Why is this?

Apart from Lamdre, Naropa’s Khecari is the most important set of instructions in Sakya. It’s easy to practice, profound, and complete. According to the Sakya Tradition, it’s the ultimate practice lineage from the Cakrasamvara tantra tradition as preserved by this school.

Easier than Ganga Mahamudra and Dzogchen? Speaking of which, is this found only in Sakya or does Kagyu Mahamudra / Samvara contain the gist of it also?

[Malcolm]

Why is this?

Apart from Lamdre, Naropa’s Khecari is the most important set of instructions in Sakya. It’s easy to practice, profound, and complete. According to the Sakya Tradition, it’s the ultimate practice lineage from the Cakrasamvara tantra tradition as preserved by this school.

Easier than Ganga Mahamudra and Dzogchen? Speaking of which, is this found only in Sakya or does Kagyu Mahamudra / Samvara contain the gist of it also?

They are three completely different paths.

[Konchog1]

Apart from Lamdre, Naropa’s Khecari is the most important set of instructions in Sakya. It’s easy to practice, profound, and complete. According to the Sakya Tradition, it’s the ultimate practice lineage from the Cakrasamvara tantra tradition as preserved by this school.

In the Ganden Tradition, it is recommended to practice Heruka first. It's my understanding the Sakyapa only practice Hevajra first. Do you know the reason for this?

[Malcolm]

Apart from Lamdre, Naropa’s Khecari is the most important set of instructions in Sakya. It’s easy to practice, profound, and complete. According to the Sakya Tradition, it’s the ultimate practice lineage from the Cakrasamvara tantra tradition as preserved by this school.

In the Ganden Tradition, it is recommended to practice Heruka first. It's my understanding the Sakyapa only practice Hevajra first. Do you know the reason for this?

Yogini includes Heruka.

[yagmort]

Apart from Lamdre, Naropa’s Khecari is the most important set of instructions in Sakya. .

what are the completion stages of both Lamdre and Khecari, respectively?
from what i understand Lamdre is based on Hevajra - do sakyapas practice tummo?

[Malcolm]

Apart from Lamdre, Naropa’s Khecari is the most important set of instructions in Sakya. .

what are the completion stages of both Lamdre and Khecari, respectively?
from what i understand Lamdre is based on Hevajra - do sakyapas practice tummo?

Yes.

[yagmort]

so Lamdre completion stage is tummo?
do they only practice tummo or there are other yogas involved akin to 6 dharmasa of Naropa set?

what about Khecari's completion stage?

[Malcolm]

so Lamdre completion stage is tummo?
do they only practice tummo or there are other yogas involved akin to 6 dharmasa of Naropa set?

what about Khecari's completion stage?

Lamdre has a completion stage with signs for each of the three inner empowerments: tummo and other prāṇāyama practices for the secret; karma mudra for the third; vajra waves for the fourth. It also has a dream yoga, luminosity yoga, etc., like the Naro chos drug system.

Yogini's completion stage with signs is also tummo, and some ancillary practices, such as mental recitation, etc. Karma mudra is unnecessary in this system.

[yagmort]

thank you.

never heard of "vajra waves" before. possible to explain what is it?

is there an explanation in Khecari root text as to why karmamudra is unnecessary in this system? is it substituted with a visualized consort? or there is simply no consort practice of any kind at all?

[Malcolm]

thank you.

never heard of "vajra waves" before. possible to explain what is it?

is there an explanation in Khecari root text as to why karmamudra is unnecessary in this system? is it substituted with a visualized consort? or there is simply no consort practice of any kind at all?

As for your first question, no.

There is explanation, but you need to receive the teaching.

Karmamudra practice in this system is associated with the Yab, Cakrasamvara, but not the yum, Vajrayogini. It is explained that karmamudra is not necessary for the realization of mahamudra in Yogini practice. This is probably based on the Kalacakra's rejection of karmamudra as well.

[AmidaB]

It is explained that karmamudra is not necessary for the realization of mahamudra in Yogini practice. This is probably based on the Kalacakra's rejection of karmamudra as well.

Dear Loppon La,
Could you please elaborate a bit further on the explanation part. Why is not neccessary the karmamudra in Vajrayogini's practice and what was the basis of Kalacakra's rejection?
Thank you.

[yagmort]

...each of the three inner empowerments: tummo and other prāṇāyama practices for the secret; karma mudra for the third; vajra waves for the fourth...

is that a typo? i thought it is a typo initially, but maybe it is not. you talk about three empowerments and indeed have mentioned three only, but enumerate last 2 as "third" and "fourth". so is it three or four? if four what is the missing link between tummo and karmamudra?

[Malcolm]

...each of the three inner empowerments: tummo and other prāṇāyama practices for the secret; karma mudra for the third; vajra waves for the fourth...

is that a typo? i thought it is a typo initially, but maybe it is not. you talk about three empowerments and indeed have mentioned three only, but enumerate last 2 as "third" and "fourth". so is it three or four? if four what is the missing link between tummo and karmamudra?

There are four empowerments: one outer; three inner.

[Kai lord]

Vajrayoginī

Why is this?

Also the mandala has not dissolved yet. It is present to this age. Refers to the twenty four holy sites for more information.

Happy vesak day, everyone!!

[rupam]

Apart from Lamdre, Naropa’s Khecari is the most important set of instructions in Sakya. It’s easy to practice, profound, and complete. According to the Sakya Tradition, it’s the ultimate practice lineage from the Cakrasamvara tantra tradition as preserved by this school.

In the Ganden Tradition, it is recommended to practice Heruka first. It's my understanding the Sakyapa only practice Hevajra first. Do you know the reason for this?

I do not practice VY but Sakyapas don't have to accomplish Hevajra or Chakrasamvara before they practice VY. Many Sakyapas in the West just receive Hevajra or Chakrasamvara as a prerequisite for VY empowerment(blessing). One of my teachers said when you practice VY, you are also practicing Chakrasamvara just like Gaden Yamantaka contains peaceful Manjushri.