Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

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vgh238
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Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by vgh238 »

i have been sort of wondering, whats the relationship between the mahayana sutras such as prajnaparamita series or Suramgamasamadhisutra and commentaries such as abhidharmakosabhasya by vasubhandu is the abhidharma the essence of those mahayana sutras or is the relationship between them more complicated and how should i approach them together.
thank you for any answers
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Aemilius »

Chandrakirti has said that in the Prajña Paramita sutras Buddha taught that the world doesn't exist, and in the Abhidharma he taught that the world exists.

The great chinese commentator Chih-I has said that some people need to be taught that all things exist, and they can then attain stopping and seeing (shamatha and vipashyana). And that some people need to be taugh that nothing exists, and they can then attain the stages of stopping and seeing.
svaha
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.
They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Sarvē mānavāḥ svatantrāḥ samutpannāḥ vartantē api ca, gauravadr̥śā adhikāradr̥śā ca samānāḥ ēva vartantē. Ētē sarvē cētanā-tarka-śaktibhyāṁ susampannāḥ santi. Api ca, sarvē’pi bandhutva-bhāvanayā parasparaṁ vyavaharantu."
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by vgh238 »

Aemilius wrote: Wed Jan 17, 2024 10:03 am Chandrakirti has said that in the Prajña Paramita sutras Buddha taught that the world doesn't exist, and in the Abhidharma he taught that the world exists.

The great chinese commentator Chih-I has said that some people need to be taught that all things exist, and they can then attain stopping and seeing (shamatha and vipashyana). And that some people need to be taugh that nothing exists, and they can then attain the stages of stopping and seeing.
in which text does chadrakirti mentions this

thank you for the reply
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Astus »

vgh238 wrote: Tue Jan 16, 2024 11:16 pm i have been sort of wondering, whats the relationship between the mahayana sutras such as prajnaparamita series or Suramgamasamadhisutra and commentaries such as abhidharmakosabhasya by vasubhandu is the abhidharma the essence of those mahayana sutras or is the relationship between them more complicated and how should i approach them together.
thank you for any answers
Mahayana sutras can mention/use/refer to various concepts found in different abhidharma literature (see e.g. Abhidharma in Early Mahayana by Johannes Bronkhorst).
Most of the extant abhidharma works represent different non-Mahayana Buddhist schools.
The main Mahayana abhidharma works are the Abhidharmasamuccaya and the Shastra on the Door to Understanding the Hundred Dharmas (大乘百法明門論), although other works might also be categorised as such.

One can approach non-Mahayana abhidharma material as representatives of specific interpretations of Indian Buddhism, and many of those ideas live on in Mahayana, either accepted as they are, or in a reinterpreted form, or as something rejected.
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Aemilius »

vgh238 wrote: Wed Jan 17, 2024 11:38 pm
Aemilius wrote: Wed Jan 17, 2024 10:03 am Chandrakirti has said that in the Prajña Paramita sutras Buddha taught that the world doesn't exist, and in the Abhidharma he taught that the world exists.

The great chinese commentator Chih-I has said that some people need to be taught that all things exist, and they can then attain stopping and seeing (shamatha and vipashyana). And that some people need to be taugh that nothing exists, and they can then attain the stages of stopping and seeing.
in which text does chadrakirti mentions this

thank you for the reply
In Entering the Middle Way (Madhyamaka-avatara), Chapter 6, Chandrakirti says:

" The Buddha unqualifiedly rejected the ultimate reality of both mind and material forms in the Perfection of Wisdom Texts, while in the Abhidharma he affirmed the conventional reality of both of them. [93]"

in Indian Madhyamaka Buddhist Philosophy After Nagarjuna, Volume 2, translated with notes and commentaries by Richard H. Jones, Jackson Square Boooks, New York, 2012.


Nagarjuna expresses this same theme in the Shunyata-shaptati, verse 44 :

"Is" and "is not" and also "is, is not" has been stated by the Buddhas with an intention (abhiprayena). It is not easy to understand!

in Nagarjuniana, Studies in the Writings and Philosophy of Nagarjuna, Christian Lindtner, Motilal Banarsidass, Delhi, 2011.
svaha
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.
They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Sarvē mānavāḥ svatantrāḥ samutpannāḥ vartantē api ca, gauravadr̥śā adhikāradr̥śā ca samānāḥ ēva vartantē. Ētē sarvē cētanā-tarka-śaktibhyāṁ susampannāḥ santi. Api ca, sarvē’pi bandhutva-bhāvanayā parasparaṁ vyavaharantu."
Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1. (in english and sanskrit)
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Astus »

Aemilius wrote: Thu Jan 18, 2024 12:59 pmIn Entering the Middle Way (Madhyamaka-avatara), Chapter 6, Chandrakirti says:

" The Buddha unqualifiedly rejected the ultimate reality of both mind and material forms in the Perfection of Wisdom Texts, while in the Abhidharma he affirmed the conventional reality of both of them. [93]"

in Indian Madhyamaka Buddhist Philosophy After Nagarjuna, Volume 2, translated with notes and commentaries by Richard H. Jones, Jackson Square Boooks, New York, 2012.
It's in the auto-commentary of 6.92 (入中論講記), but it actually says something different.
In general, mental and material dharmas in Abhidharma are ultimate realities, not conventional.
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Queequeg »

Aemilius wrote: Wed Jan 17, 2024 10:03 am The great chinese commentator Chih-I has said that some people need to be taught that all things exist, and they can then attain stopping and seeing (shamatha and vipashyana). And that some people need to be taugh that nothing exists, and they can then attain the stages of stopping and seeing.
Upaya is emphasized in Zhiyi's (Chih-i) writings, but not unique to him. I think this is characteristic of non-sectarian, non-fundamentalist, broad-and-deep teachers. Upaya emphasizes that the Buddha teaches what beings need to advance, not standard, one-size-fits-all teachings. This explains why the Buddha could teach such incompatible ideas as emptiness and reality of conditioned dharmas. These are just guidelines to undo any false conceits - though not taught that way. When they are taught, they are taught with the conviction that they are TRUE. But, when emptiness does its job, if it's internalized too excessively, the view is biased and must be rebalanced with tathagatagarbha. If tathagatgarbha does its job too thoroughly, emptiness needs to be pointed out. Zhiyi emphasized the Middle, but the Middle can end up being a bias if adhered to excessively, also. Wisdom is subtle.

Anyway, big beautiful subject but off topic.
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

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Astus wrote: Thu Jan 18, 2024 2:31 pmIn general, mental and material dharmas in Abhidharma are ultimate realities, not conventional.

Wait; what?

On the surface, that seems to contradict most if not all things that Buddha Sasana teaches.

I mean if I’m not mistaken, Abhidharma says that the two upper form realms aren’t even destroyed at the end of a Mahakalpa; and on the surface, that could sound like what is called ‘eternalism’….

Could you explain your statement a bit more and/or provide some quotes?
Last edited by Sādhaka on Fri Jan 19, 2024 3:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Astus »

Sādhaka wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 3:38 pmCould you explain your statement a bit more and/or provide some quotes?
Ultimate has a somewhat different meaning in Abhidharma. It means that something is actually a thing (i.e. dharma), an effective force. It does not mean it is necessarily eternal.

An example:

'The cognition [buddhi] of a pitcher ends when the pitcher is broken; the cognition of water ends when, in the mind [dhī], one analyzes [anyāpoha] water. The pitcher and the water, and all that resembles them, exist relatively or conventionally. The rest exists absolutely.'
(ABK 6.4; vol 3, p 1891)
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Sādhaka »

Thank you for the citation, Astus.

Although what does “The rest exists absolutely.” mean here?
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Kai lord »

Sādhaka wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 8:24 pm Thank you for the citation, Astus.

Although what does “The rest exists absolutely.” mean here?
Sarvastivadins argued that all dharmas, mental and matter, exists in all the three times, past, present and future while composite objects like the five aggregates are just constructs of those irreducible fundamental components. However, those dharmas are also conditioned, so they are interdependent on each other, subject to change, cause and effect, etc.

Like other Nikaya schools, Nirvana is unconditional.
Life is like a game, either you win or lose!
Life is like a fight, either you live or die!
Life is like a show, either you laugh or cry!
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

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Sādhaka wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 8:24 pmAlthough what does “The rest exists absolutely.” mean here?
The term is 'paramārthasat'. From the auto-commentary (p 1892):

'Therein, even when a thing is being broken - or [likewise, even when its (constituent) factors] are mentally removed - and the cognition of this thing continues, this thing exists absolutely (paramārthasat). For example, visible form (rūpa): for, therein, when a visible [thing (vastu)] is broken into atoms or infinitesimal particles [paramāṇu] and when taste [rasa] and the other factors have been mentally removed, the cognition of the intrinsic nature [svabhāva] of visible form persists. Sensation [vedanā], etc., is also to be seen in the same way. As this exists absolutely (paramārthasat), this is absolute truth (paramārthasatya).'
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Vajrasvapna »

vgh238 wrote: Tue Jan 16, 2024 11:16 pm i have been sort of wondering, whats the relationship between the mahayana sutras such as prajnaparamita series or Suramgamasamadhisutra and commentaries such as abhidharmakosabhasya by vasubhandu is the abhidharma the essence of those mahayana sutras or is the relationship between them more complicated and how should i approach them together.
thank you for any answers
Mahayana was a counteraction to the doctrines of the Abhidharma scriptures. Indeed, it is possible to observe an evolution in Vasubandhu's ideas from Abhidharma to his adoption of Mahayana ideas. Nagarjuna took a stance of employing negative language. In contrast, the evolution of Yogacara aimed to avoid such negative language. Inclusive to this idea is that emptiness signifies the emptiness of duality between subjective and objective, evolving ideas from earlier schools such as consciousness, seeds, and reflective awareness.

There was also a movement to unify schools, as seen in figures like Shantarakshita and Ratnakarashanti. The former advocated for reflective awareness as something conventional, while the latter saw it as ultimate. Since the first figure visited Tibet, his ideas endured within the Nyingma school.

I find it curious and strange that some monasteries in Tibet study the Abhidharma doctrine to understand concepts like karma.
Last edited by Vajrasvapna on Sat Jan 20, 2024 4:54 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Bristollad »

Vajrasvapna wrote: Sat Jan 20, 2024 4:14 pm Mahayana was a counteraction to the doctrines of the Abhidharma scriptures.
Is this your own idea or one you have read? From a scholarly point of view, there are several competing theories about the origin of the Mahayana but as yet, no definitive evidence. Most experts suggest that rather than being one movement with one fixed set of positions, a whole slew of ideas arose in various locations at various times, and these were eventually gathered and systemized.
Vajrasvapna wrote: Sat Jan 20, 2024 4:14 pm I find it curious and strange that some monasteries in Tibet study the Abhidharma doctrine to understand concepts like karma.
You find it curious that monks study the Dharma? There are five topics and their commentaries that form the traditional core of study in Tibetan monasteries:
Valid Cognition ( Pramana) tshad.ma
Perfection of Wisdom Studies ( Prajnaparamita ) phar.byin
Middle Way ( Madhyamika ) dbu.ma
Monastic Discipline ( Vinaya ) 'dul.pa
Phenomenology ( Ahbidharma ) mdzod
https://serajeymonastery.org/philosophical-studies/course-outline

From a doctrinal point of view, even though most Tibetans would hold that Madhyamika is the highest philosophical view, they study, contemplate and debate on the four tenet systems: Vaibhasika, Sautantrika, Cittamatra and Madhyamika. It is commonly said that only by understanding the lower viewpoints will you ever understand the full import of the higher, in the way that a temple needs strong foundations, not just a well-decorated shrine room.
The antidote—to be free from the suffering of samsara—you need to be free from delusion and karma; you need to be free from ignorance, the root of samsara. So you need to meditate on emptiness. That is what you need. Lama Zopa Rinpoche
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Vajrasvapna »

Bristollad wrote: Sat Jan 20, 2024 8:43 pm
Vajrasvapna wrote: Sat Jan 20, 2024 4:14 pm Mahayana was a counteraction to the doctrines of the Abhidharma scriptures.
Is this your own idea or one you have read? From a scholarly point of view, there are several competing theories about the origin of the Mahayana but as yet, no definitive evidence. Most experts suggest that rather than being one movement with one fixed set of positions, a whole slew of ideas arose in various locations at various times, and these were eventually gathered and systemized.
This is not an academic section of this forum, unlike debating the positions of various schools. It's clear that Madhyamaka and Yogacara are reactionary responses to Abhidharma.
Bristollad wrote: Sat Jan 20, 2024 8:43 pm
Vajrasvapna wrote: Sat Jan 20, 2024 4:14 pm I find it curious and strange that some monasteries in Tibet study the Abhidharma doctrine to understand concepts like karma.
You find it curious that monks study the Dharma? There are five topics and their commentaries that form the traditional core of study in Tibetan monasteries:
What is strange is that some Mahayana monks adopt Abhidharma concepts. I just saw a Tibetan monk using the Abhidharma to explain karma.
Bristollad wrote: Sat Jan 20, 2024 8:43 pm
Valid Cognition ( Pramana) tshad.ma
Perfection of Wisdom Studies ( Prajnaparamita ) phar.byin
Middle Way ( Madhyamika ) dbu.ma
Monastic Discipline ( Vinaya ) 'dul.pa
Phenomenology ( Ahbidharma ) mdzod
https://serajeymonastery.org/philosophi ... se-outline

From a doctrinal point of view, even though most Tibetans would hold that Madhyamika is the highest philosophical view, they study, contemplate and debate on the four tenet systems: Vaibhasika, Sautantrika, Cittamatra and Madhyamika. It is commonly said that only by understanding the lower viewpoints will you ever understand the full import of the higher, in the way that a temple needs strong foundations, not just a well-decorated shrine room.
Why, then, do they persist with an incorrect view about Yogacara? Original Yogacara sources never support an idealist perspective, nor do they deny external objects or alambana. While some religious groups may engage in debates on certain subjects, there often exists a significant bias in their discussions.
A Christian group will create a bias regarding the issue of the historical Jesus, just as Tibetans created a bias about Yogacara. Those who demonstrate a lack of bias are Western academics who study without this cultural bias.
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

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Thanks for sharing this useful knowledge with us. I came here to gather information and I found out that this website is full of informative posts.
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

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Vajrasvapna wrote: Sun Jan 21, 2024 3:44 pm It's clear that Madhyamaka and Yogacara are reactionary responses to Abhidharma.
okay, so it's your idea.
Vajrasvapna wrote: Sun Jan 21, 2024 3:44 pm What is strange is that some Mahayana monks adopt Abhidharma concepts. I just saw a Tibetan monk using the Abhidharma to explain karma.
It's only strange if you think Madhyamika and Yogacara are a rejection of Abhidharma.
Vajrasvapna wrote: Sun Jan 21, 2024 3:44 pm Why, then, do they persist with an incorrect view about Yogacara? Original Yogacara sources never support an idealist perspective, nor do they deny external objects or alambana. While some religious groups may engage in debates on certain subjects, there often exists a significant bias in their discussions.
Who persists in an incorrect view? The teachings I've received on Yogacara from my Tibetan teachers also gave a more nuanced understanding of this, e.g.
"That the Mind Only School refutes external objects means that they refute a form, for instance, and the valid cognition apprehending it are different entities; still, this school holds that forms are the same entity as the consciousness that perceives them - both the form the consciousness apprehending it being produced from a single predisposition contained within the mind. This school is, nevertheless, not solipsistic; it accepts that there are other beings who are different entities from oneself."
Cutting Through Appearances, p 249-250. Geshe Lhundup Sopa, Jeffrey Hopkins

Over my decades studying Buddhism, I've heard and read far more Westerners, particularly those who are students of Chinese Mahayana schools, take idealist positions. This seems particularly true of scholars trying to understand Buddhist tenets in terms of the Western philosophical systems they are familiar with.

I personally find the Mind Only view bonkers and incomprehensible :rolleye: but that's my hang-up and one my teachers regularly try to correct.
The antidote—to be free from the suffering of samsara—you need to be free from delusion and karma; you need to be free from ignorance, the root of samsara. So you need to meditate on emptiness. That is what you need. Lama Zopa Rinpoche
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by Aemilius »

Bristollad wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 10:16 am
Vajrasvapna wrote: Sun Jan 21, 2024 3:44 pm It's clear that Madhyamaka and Yogacara are reactionary responses to Abhidharma.
okay, so it's your idea.
Vajrasvapna wrote: Sun Jan 21, 2024 3:44 pm What is strange is that some Mahayana monks adopt Abhidharma concepts. I just saw a Tibetan monk using the Abhidharma to explain karma.
It's only strange if you think Madhyamika and Yogacara are a rejection of Abhidharma.
Vajrasvapna wrote: Sun Jan 21, 2024 3:44 pm Why, then, do they persist with an incorrect view about Yogacara? Original Yogacara sources never support an idealist perspective, nor do they deny external objects or alambana. While some religious groups may engage in debates on certain subjects, there often exists a significant bias in their discussions.
Who persists in an incorrect view? The teachings I've received on Yogacara from my Tibetan teachers also gave a more nuanced understanding of this, e.g.
"That the Mind Only School refutes external objects means that they refute a form, for instance, and the valid cognition apprehending it are different entities; still, this school holds that forms are the same entity as the consciousness that perceives them - both the form the consciousness apprehending it being produced from a single predisposition contained within the mind. This school is, nevertheless, not solipsistic; it accepts that there are other beings who are different entities from oneself."
Cutting Through Appearances, p 249-250. Geshe Lhundup Sopa, Jeffrey Hopkins

Over my decades studying Buddhism, I've heard and read far more Westerners, particularly those who are students of Chinese Mahayana schools, take idealist positions. This seems particularly true of scholars trying to understand Buddhist tenets in terms of the Western philosophical systems they are familiar with.

I personally find the Mind Only view bonkers and incomprehensible :rolleye: but that's my hang-up and one my teachers regularly try to correct.
In a way Abhidharma also teaches mind only, because the world appears from nothing (or from mind and karma) and disintegrates back into nothing. This is the normal Abhidharma view, i.e.the four kalpas of formation, existence, destruction and emptiness. Thus in the Abhidharma view matter is empty of eternity and empty of essence too.

(It may be different in different Abhidharmas, it depends on how they explain the shunya-kalpa ?)

The seven original Abhidharma treatises are:
1. Jnanaprasthana (Skt. Jñānaprasthāna) by Katyayanaputra
2. Prakaranapada (Skt. Prakaraṇapāda) by Vasumitra
3. Vijnanakaya (Skt. Vijñānakāya) by Devakṣema (or Devaśarman)
4. Dharmaskandha (Skt.) by Shariputra or by Maudgalyayana according to Chinese sources
5. Prajnapti-sastra (Skt.) by Maudgalyayana or by Katyayana according to Chinese sources
6. Dhatukaya (Skt.) by Vasumitra or Purna
7. Sangitiparyaya (Skt.) by Mahākauṣṭhila or by Shariputra according to Chinese sources
svaha
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They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Sarvē mānavāḥ svatantrāḥ samutpannāḥ vartantē api ca, gauravadr̥śā adhikāradr̥śā ca samānāḥ ēva vartantē. Ētē sarvē cētanā-tarka-śaktibhyāṁ susampannāḥ santi. Api ca, sarvē’pi bandhutva-bhāvanayā parasparaṁ vyavaharantu."
Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1. (in english and sanskrit)
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by sternumunstable »

I've been contemplating the relationship between Mahayana sutras like the Prajnaparamita series or the Suramgamasamadhisutra and commentaries such as Vasubandhu's Abhidharmakosabhasya. Is the Abhidharma the distilled essence of these Mahayana sutras, or does the relationship between them entail a more intricate dynamic? How should one approach studying them together?

I would greatly appreciate any insights or guidance on navigating this intricate relationship. Thank you in advance for any responses.
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Re: Relationship Between Mahayana Sutras And Abhidharma

Post by SilenceMonkey »

Vajrasvapna wrote: Sat Jan 20, 2024 4:14 pm Mahayana was a counteraction to the doctrines of the Abhidharma scriptures. Indeed, it is possible to observe an evolution in Vasubandhu's ideas from Abhidharma to his adoption of Mahayana ideas. Nagarjuna took a stance of employing negative language. In contrast, the evolution of Yogacara aimed to avoid such negative language. Inclusive to this idea is that emptiness signifies the emptiness of duality between subjective and objective, evolving ideas from earlier schools such as consciousness, seeds, and reflective awareness.

There was also a movement to unify schools, as seen in figures like Shantarakshita and Ratnakarashanti. The former advocated for reflective awareness as something conventional, while the latter saw it as ultimate. Since the first figure visited Tibet, his ideas endured within the Nyingma school.

I find it curious and strange that some monasteries in Tibet study the Abhidharma doctrine to understand concepts like karma.
Sorry to point out the obvious, but… take a look at the section on “Mahayana Abhidharma”:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abhidharma
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