Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

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Nalanda
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Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by Nalanda »

https://www.drikungboston.org/

Is it more like a request by this temple for help/donation?

Or is there a background practice here that I'm not aware of? Is there a benefit for the donor? Do they become a participant in the benefits of reading this text by donating?
IF YOU PRACTICE WITH A STRONG BELIEF IN WHAT
YOU ARE DOING, THEN THERE IS NO LIMIT TO WHAT
YOU CAN ACCOMPLISH WITH YOUR PRACTICE.

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zerwe
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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by zerwe »

Sponsoring Pujas, recitations, etc... are standard to many traditions.

First and foremost, this offers lay people an opportunity to accumulate merit.
Second, yes it helps to support monastics etc...

Shaun :namaste:
Vasana
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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by Vasana »

Many sutras explain the benefits and merits obtained from listening/sharing/copying/printing this and other sutras. I think there is a chapter on this in the '10,000 line' version of the Prajnapramita on the 84,000 website.
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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by Zhen Li »

Vasana wrote: Fri Sep 16, 2022 5:51 pm Many sutras explain the benefits and merits obtained from listening/sharing/copying/printing this and other sutras. I think there is a chapter on this in the '10,000 line' version of the Prajnapramita on the 84,000 website.
Chapter 3 in the 8000 Line version (which is the one being sponsored) is largely similar.

In Nepal it's more common to split the folios between different reciters so it can be done in an hour. In Japan, tendoku allows the whole thing to be recited with just the titles of the fascicles being read. So, it is impressive that this lama is going to single handedly recite from cover to cover 108 times.
Nalanda
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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by Nalanda »

Zhen Li wrote: Sat Sep 17, 2022 6:46 am
Vasana wrote: Fri Sep 16, 2022 5:51 pm Many sutras explain the benefits and merits obtained from listening/sharing/copying/printing this and other sutras. I think there is a chapter on this in the '10,000 line' version of the Prajnapramita on the 84,000 website.
Chapter 3 in the 8000 Line version (which is the one being sponsored) is largely similar.

In Nepal it's more common to split the folios between different reciters so it can be done in an hour. In Japan, tendoku allows the whole thing to be recited with just the titles of the fascicles being read. So, it is impressive that this lama is going to single handedly recite from cover to cover 108 times.
May I know why we do this? A lama/teacher reciting 108 times? As opposed to each one of us doing it? And by donating, are we then participant in the benefit of the teacher reciting it?
IF YOU PRACTICE WITH A STRONG BELIEF IN WHAT
YOU ARE DOING, THEN THERE IS NO LIMIT TO WHAT
YOU CAN ACCOMPLISH WITH YOUR PRACTICE.

CHAKUNG JIGME WANGDRAK RINPOCHE

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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by pemachophel »

If one sponsors someone to do a practice, then both the sponsor and the practitioner reap the same merit. This is basic Mahayana Buddhism. We do it for the two purposes of self and others -- one's personal benefit and the benefit of all sentient beings covered by the sky. How wonderful!
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Zhen Li
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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by Zhen Li »

Nalanda wrote: Sat Sep 17, 2022 2:53 pm
Zhen Li wrote: Sat Sep 17, 2022 6:46 am
Vasana wrote: Fri Sep 16, 2022 5:51 pm Many sutras explain the benefits and merits obtained from listening/sharing/copying/printing this and other sutras. I think there is a chapter on this in the '10,000 line' version of the Prajnapramita on the 84,000 website.
Chapter 3 in the 8000 Line version (which is the one being sponsored) is largely similar.

In Nepal it's more common to split the folios between different reciters so it can be done in an hour. In Japan, tendoku allows the whole thing to be recited with just the titles of the fascicles being read. So, it is impressive that this lama is going to single handedly recite from cover to cover 108 times.
May I know why we do this? A lama/teacher reciting 108 times? As opposed to each one of us doing it? And by donating, are we then participant in the benefit of the teacher reciting it?
This is a good question and in terms of the spread of merit, pemachophel is correct.

As regards the technical side of things (speaking from my experience and not from the case of this particular lama's sect), we should not really just open a sutra and read it like a novel. There is a framing opening and closing puja that needs to be done, and this can also work to enhance the efficacy of the recitation. If the right set of deities, bodhisattvas, and so forth are present, they can both protect the recitation from maras and help the intended results of the recitation/puja be fulfilled as wished.

So, it is generally more effective for a trained ritual specialist to be paid to do such a recitation so the average busy layperson doesn't have to learn all these from scratch. To put it another way, you can either train for a decade to become a skilled acharya and then do the puja, or you can pay a skilled acharya to do the same puja and get the same benefit in a much shorter period of time.
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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by Vasana »

Zhen Li wrote: Sun Sep 18, 2022 4:47 am
Nalanda wrote: Sat Sep 17, 2022 2:53 pm
Zhen Li wrote: Sat Sep 17, 2022 6:46 am
Chapter 3 in the 8000 Line version (which is the one being sponsored) is largely similar.

In Nepal it's more common to split the folios between different reciters so it can be done in an hour. In Japan, tendoku allows the whole thing to be recited with just the titles of the fascicles being read. So, it is impressive that this lama is going to single handedly recite from cover to cover 108 times.
May I know why we do this? A lama/teacher reciting 108 times? As opposed to each one of us doing it? And by donating, are we then participant in the benefit of the teacher reciting it?
This is a good question and in terms of the spread of merit, pemachophel is correct.

As regards the technical side of things (speaking from my experience and not from the case of this particular lama's sect), we should not really just open a sutra and read it like a novel. There is a framing opening and closing puja that needs to be done, and this can also work to enhance the efficacy of the recitation. If the right set of deities, bodhisattvas, and so forth are present, they can both protect the recitation from maras and help the intended results of the recitation/puja be fulfilled as wished.

So, it is generally more effective for a trained ritual specialist to be paid to do such a recitation so the average busy layperson doesn't have to learn all these from scratch. To put it another way, you can either train for a decade to become a skilled acharya and then do the puja, or you can pay a skilled acharya to do the same puja and get the same benefit in a much shorter period of time.
But none of that should discourage a lay practitioner from picking up and sutra and just reading it, imo. Not everything needs to be a ritual.
'When thoughts arise, recognise them clearly as your teacher'— Gampopa
'When alone, examine your mind, when among others, examine your speech'.— Atisha
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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by Nalanda »

pemachophel wrote: Sat Sep 17, 2022 11:21 pm If one sponsors someone to do a practice, then both the sponsor and the practitioner reap the same merit. This is basic Mahayana Buddhism.
Yeah. I asked about that here: https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?t=40999

I'm trying to find sources where I could read/watch/listen more. If you have some, I'd love to learn more about it.
IF YOU PRACTICE WITH A STRONG BELIEF IN WHAT
YOU ARE DOING, THEN THERE IS NO LIMIT TO WHAT
YOU CAN ACCOMPLISH WITH YOUR PRACTICE.

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Nalanda
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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by Nalanda »

Zhen Li wrote: Sun Sep 18, 2022 4:47 am As regards the technical side of things (speaking from my experience and not from the case of this particular lama's sect), we should not really just open a sutra and read it like a novel. There is a framing opening and closing puja that needs to be done, and this can also work to enhance the efficacy of the recitation. If the right set of deities, bodhisattvas, and so forth are present, they can both protect the recitation from maras and help the intended results of the recitation/puja be fulfilled as wished.

So, it is generally more effective for a trained ritual specialist to be paid to do such a recitation so the average busy layperson doesn't have to learn all these from scratch. To put it another way, you can either train for a decade to become a skilled acharya and then do the puja, or you can pay a skilled acharya to do the same puja and get the same benefit in a much shorter period of time.
I fully believe you actually. I just wish I could read more about it or hear a teaching about it. The other poster said "Not everything needs to be a ritual." That was my thinking also before until I learned it's not a mere ritual and that there's actually something more happening there. I just wish I could find some source, teachings, sutras that explain this more so I have some kind of basis for this. Got something you can share?
IF YOU PRACTICE WITH A STRONG BELIEF IN WHAT
YOU ARE DOING, THEN THERE IS NO LIMIT TO WHAT
YOU CAN ACCOMPLISH WITH YOUR PRACTICE.

CHAKUNG JIGME WANGDRAK RINPOCHE

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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by Zhen Li »

Nalanda wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 11:44 am I fully believe you actually. I just wish I could read more about it or hear a teaching about it. The other poster said "Not everything needs to be a ritual." That was my thinking also before until I learned it's not a mere ritual and that there's actually something more happening there. I just wish I could find some source, teachings, sutras that explain this more so I have some kind of basis for this. Got something you can share?
There is certainly a place for simple sutra reading and study, but recitation with an intention to benefit beings and dedicate merit is a different matter and can be made more effective. The primary source for this practice is really in the Prajñāpāramitā sūtras themselves, starting with Chapter 3 of the Aṣṭasāhasrikā. Besides being mentioned in other sūtras, the practice is also discussed in Ādikarma literature like Ādikarmapradīpa, and there's a Tibetan Pustakapāṭhopāya manual which may be more specific to vajrayāna. The practice differs from place to place and tradition to tradition, and since this is a Kagyu subforum, it might be best to ask a Kagyu Lama about this matter. The practice need not necessarily be esoteric, since we are talking about exoteric Mahāyāna sūtras here.
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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by Nalanda »

Zhen Li wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 3:24 pm
Nalanda wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 11:44 am I fully believe you actually. I just wish I could read more about it or hear a teaching about it. The other poster said "Not everything needs to be a ritual." That was my thinking also before until I learned it's not a mere ritual and that there's actually something more happening there. I just wish I could find some source, teachings, sutras that explain this more so I have some kind of basis for this. Got something you can share?
There is certainly a place for simple sutra reading and study, but recitation with an intention to benefit beings and dedicate merit is a different matter and can be made more effective. The primary source for this practice is really in the Prajñāpāramitā sūtras themselves, starting with Chapter 3 of the Aṣṭasāhasrikā. Besides being mentioned in other sūtras, the practice is also discussed in Ādikarma literature like Ādikarmapradīpa, and there's a Tibetan Pustakapāṭhopāya manual which may be more specific to vajrayāna. The practice differs from place to place and tradition to tradition, and since this is a Kagyu subforum, it might be best to ask a Kagyu Lama about this matter. The practice need not necessarily be esoteric, since we are talking about exoteric Mahāyāna sūtras here.
Aṣṭasāhasrikā happens to be unavailable yet on 84000. What translation is good for now?
IF YOU PRACTICE WITH A STRONG BELIEF IN WHAT
YOU ARE DOING, THEN THERE IS NO LIMIT TO WHAT
YOU CAN ACCOMPLISH WITH YOUR PRACTICE.

CHAKUNG JIGME WANGDRAK RINPOCHE

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Zhen Li
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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by Zhen Li »

Nalanda wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 11:01 am Aṣṭasāhasrikā happens to be unavailable yet on 84000. What translation is good for now?
Only Conze's translation is available.

I can't confirm that the Tibetan translation has the same chapters. The Chinese equivalent has differences, for instance. But I think it should largely be the same.
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Re: Why sponsor a reading of the Prajnaparamita? (Drikung Boston)

Post by hershelhonk »

:twothumbsup: Because of the dedication of merit where we offer our efforts on behalf of all sentient beings, the value is the same. It’s important to note that we are one of those sentient beings so it supports the centre and gives us the same merit, if not more as actually reciting it.
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