Bodhisattva vow required?

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dpcalder
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Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by dpcalder »

I have found a teacher and I am interested in learning the tantric practice of dream yoga from him. He is in the Bon tradition. Is a bodhisattva vow required for this? I would really like to try to avoid reincarnating again
Norwegian
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by Norwegian »

dpcalder wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:50 pm I have found a teacher and I am interested in learning the tantric practice of dream yoga from him. He is in the Bon tradition. Is a bodhisattva vow required for this? I would really like to try to avoid reincarnating again
Every practice in Tantra and Dzogchen is rooted in Bodhicitta, so yes.
"The Guru is the Buddha, the Guru is the Dharma,
The Guru is the Sangha too,
The Guru is Śrī Heruka.
The All-Creating King is the Guru."

-- The Secret Assembly Tantra
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Johnny Dangerous
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

This is like asking if you can ride in a car without the engine.
Don’t you see what’s wrong with the world today? Oh Everybody wants somebody to be their own piece of clay.

-Marvin Gaye
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nyonchung
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by nyonchung »

Johnny Dangerous wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:13 pm This is like asking if you can ride in a car without the engine.
I don't know for Bön tradition, ask him

Otherwise, in a Buddhist context, you can actually take them by yourself
"Me and the sky don't hold views - Me and the river have no fixed practice
Me and the madman don't have a guide- Me and the rainbow have no experiences
Me, the sun and the moon have no certitudes - Me and the jewel bear no fruit" - Dampa Sanggyé as quoted by Domar Mingyur Dorjé (born 1675)
Norwegian
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by Norwegian »

nyonchung wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:23 pm Otherwise, in a Buddhist context, you can actually take them by yourself
I get the feeling that OP doesn't want to take them, viewing the Bodhisattva vow as a kind of problem. Perhaps I'm mistaken.
"The Guru is the Buddha, the Guru is the Dharma,
The Guru is the Sangha too,
The Guru is Śrī Heruka.
The All-Creating King is the Guru."

-- The Secret Assembly Tantra
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nyonchung
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by nyonchung »

Norwegian wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:34 pm
nyonchung wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:23 pm Otherwise, in a Buddhist context, you can actually take them by yourself
I get the feeling that OP doesn't want to take them, viewing the Bodhisattva vow as a kind of problem. Perhaps I'm mistaken.
:oops: Rereading, you're absolutely right, it's up to the OP to ask the question to his master and tell him frankly his opinions on the question

In a Buddhist context any mantrayana teaching implies bodhisattva vows as a basis, the final goal being to free all beings, not even next life I think
"Me and the sky don't hold views - Me and the river have no fixed practice
Me and the madman don't have a guide- Me and the rainbow have no experiences
Me, the sun and the moon have no certitudes - Me and the jewel bear no fruit" - Dampa Sanggyé as quoted by Domar Mingyur Dorjé (born 1675)
dpcalder
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by dpcalder »

Norwegian wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:34 pm
nyonchung wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:23 pm Otherwise, in a Buddhist context, you can actually take them by yourself
I get the feeling that OP doesn't want to take them, viewing the Bodhisattva vow as a kind of problem. Perhaps I'm mistaken.
You are correct. I would prefer to not reincarnate again
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DNS
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by DNS »

dpcalder wrote: Thu Jun 23, 2022 1:03 am You are correct. I would prefer to not reincarnate again
There's always Pure Land Buddhism, which seeks rebirth to the Pure Land (a heavenly realm where enlightenment will be easier to attain).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pure_Land_Buddhism

Or if that's not what you want and you want parinirvana at the end of this life, then there's always Theravada. No bodhisattva vows in Theravada required.
https://www.dhammawiki.com/index.php?title=Theravada

But no guarantees with either Pure Land or Theravada, as the hard spiritual work and progress still needed.
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by KristenM »

dpcalder wrote: Thu Jun 23, 2022 1:03 am
Norwegian wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:34 pm
nyonchung wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:23 pm Otherwise, in a Buddhist context, you can actually take them by yourself
I get the feeling that OP doesn't want to take them, viewing the Bodhisattva vow as a kind of problem. Perhaps I'm mistaken.
You are correct. I would prefer to not reincarnate again
Just be an atheist, problem solved.

Why would you even want to follow the Buddhist path if not to be more selfless and liberated from egotism? You seem to have a desire to not be reborn based upon a strong sense of ego and self. No self, no problem. The suffering you experience being reborn is based upon a sense of ego.
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Konchog1
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by Konchog1 »

As Lama Tsongkhapa says in his Great Treatise of the Stages of the Mantric Path, Vajrayana is merely Resultant Mahayana. Bodhichita is a given.
Equanimity is the ground. Love is the moisture. Compassion is the seed. Bodhicitta is the result.

-Paraphrase of Khensur Rinpoche Lobsang Tsephel citing the Guhyasamaja Tantra

"All memories and thoughts are the union of emptiness and knowing, the Mind.
Without attachment, self-liberating, like a snake in a knot.
Through the qualities of meditating in that way,
Mental obscurations are purified and the dharmakaya is attained."

-Ra Lotsawa, All-pervading Melodious Drumbeats
Kai lord
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by Kai lord »

dpcalder wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:50 pm I have found a teacher and I am interested in learning the tantric practice of dream yoga from him. He is in the Bon tradition. Is a bodhisattva vow required for this? I would really like to try to avoid reincarnating again
Yes because on the first page of deity yoga after dissolution , it usually reads "I manifest my deity form out of the great compassion to help all sentinel beings"

So yeah, you need bodhicitta to do deity yoga which is preliminary for stuffs like dream yoga.
PeterC
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by PeterC »

dpcalder wrote: Thu Jun 23, 2022 1:03 am
Norwegian wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:34 pm
nyonchung wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:23 pm Otherwise, in a Buddhist context, you can actually take them by yourself
I get the feeling that OP doesn't want to take them, viewing the Bodhisattva vow as a kind of problem. Perhaps I'm mistaken.
You are correct. I would prefer to not reincarnate again
If you’re saying “I would prefer” about this then you’ve missed the point
Soma999
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Re: Bodhisattva vow required?

Post by Soma999 »

There are two things : boddicitta and boddhisattva vows.

Bodicitta in its official definition is the wish to become a Buddha for the welfare of all. In fact, acting for the welfare of all manifests the Buddha, and becoming Buddha manifests the welfare of all.

Bodicitta is the wish to benefits all. This intention permeates all your sadhana, and infused with such an intent they generates the highest good.

You can have bodicitta, and don’t want to reincarnate. There are no opposition.

Now boddicitta vows are something else, but you can also understand the deeper meaning of the vows : it is to take bodicitta to heart, and generate a good heart.

A teacher during empowerment and the transmission of the bodisattva vows said those who are no so interested in the boddisattva vows should generate the wish to have a good heart instead of receiving the vows.
So, some teachers leave this possibilities, and you can speak with them about that.

What is important is to generate bodicitta. If you have that you have what is essential.

Also, you can have very good teachings on dream yoga without having to take any « official » vows. Charlie Morley is a specialist in lucid dreaming, and a buddhist. You can follow his workshops and he wrote some very good books.

Don’t feel threatened by vows. The deeper meaning about all this is to take the highest intention, that is no doing things for you, but for us, and to expand the us to the limit of space.

Speak to this with your teacher. If he is open you will find a solution.
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