But you misuse quotes all the time...tkp67 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 08, 2020 1:46 pmI mentioned the paraphrased in bold earlier in the thread.Queequeg wrote: ↑Thu Oct 08, 2020 1:01 pm These insights, the Threefold Inclusive Truth, apply equally to Myohorengekyo. The Saddharma is found in the dynamism of life. This is why Ichinen Sanzen starts with Mind. "Without mind that is the end of the matter. But if there is even the subtlest mind, then the three thousand." That's not the actual quote - its something along those lines.
When the mistake is made turning Buddhist Saddharma into a substantive thing that is somehow more fundamental than reality, that's no longer Buddhism. Its a wrong view. Its a matter of emphasis that when its drawn out puts a person in a very detrimental place - right back in the reifying of self and all that.
This is a metaphor. If you attach too much meaning to it, then yeah, I suppose it becomes a substantial thing. The point of this metaphor is (contrary to other things that have been asserted about what Nichiren taught) consistent with Mahayana teachings in general - that we are, in our nature as sentient beings, possessed of the qualities of a Buddha. However, we are afflicted with adventitious defilements. These defilements themselves are not substantial things that can be wiped away in the sense we wipe dirt off a mirror. They are merely mistaken or distorted views that arise because of... three poisons, attachments, etc. They don't actually have any substance anymore than a knot is anything substantial distinct from the tangled piece of string.There is nothing substantive in cleaning the mirror for clear realization?
The Shoshu response is that "We are buddhas as we are because we embrace the Daimoku!" And yet, Nichiren talked about polishing mirrors and things like that. So either Nichiren didn't have his story straight, or people are misunderstanding him. Go figure.
There is a subtle line that both accepts universal buddhanature as well as the necessity of walking the path to Buddhahood. Its the fine line that enables Lotus Buddhists to embrace ignorance and awakening together. But its not easy to penetrate and grasp. Its difficult to believe and difficult to understand. Its why Zhiyi took 7 volumes to try and explain it and still left the work unfinished because its implicitly beyond description and must be known through practice. Its why Nichiren concluded - "Here, just embrace the Daimoku because as beings of Mappo, its too much for you to get. But if you make this connection, then you are assured the opportunities in the future - at the Eternal Eagle Peak (or whatever the happy hunting ground is)."
That's the point: Liberation is not a substantial thing. Its the unbinding and release of all substantial things. Its the substantial things, or more accurately the naive belief in substantial things, that form the walls and bars of the prison of samsara. The Buddha appears in response to beings tangled up in ignorance - to show them how to get untangled. Its not some life purpose the way SG talks about "mission" and all that. Buddhas effortlessly respond to suffering beings - why? To help them find release and to become equal to him. He wants us to find the sublime flavor of liberation, but its got as much intention as breathing - that's just what buddhas and bodhisattvas do. Buddhas are mere functions of ignorance - Buddhas appear because there are ignorant beings; ignorant beings are ignorant beings because buddhas demonstrate liberation from ignorance.if liberation wasn't substantive why did the buddha dedicate his existence to it?
No. The ten factors are also empty of substantial existence. These are distinctions the Buddha pointed out to help us see. They are substantial only in so far as they resonate with our ignorance as its cure.Notice what is substantive is the reality that consists of the appearance, nature, entity, power, influence, internal cause, relation, latent effect, manifest effect, and their consistency from beginning. This represents individual sentient beings, the ignorance of suffering which is the cause of buddhism.
Ignorance of suffering is not quite the problem. Suffering is the problem. Suffering has a cause. The cause is ignorance. The Buddhist path cuts off the cause.
Indeed. Mileage varies. You misunderstand the basic teachings and so of course you misunderstand these teachings on the Sudden and Perfect.If they weren't substantive even for a moment in time, even in light of impermanence, there would be not benefit to this cause.
If there is no benefit what is the purpose?
Unbreakable joy while it can't be put on a cup and sold in the deli is substantive enough for some. YMMV.
The problem I always had with Nichiren Buddhism as it is taught, especially in the Shoshu and its offshoots like SG, is that the basic teachings are ignored. Have any of you actually been taught the Four Noble Truths? No. Because you wave it off as Hinayana. Have any of you actually been taught Madhyamaka? No. Because that's provisional Mahayana. Have any of you been taught anything about Tiantai? No, because that's Buddhism for the Middle Day. Have you been taught anything about Mikkyo, even though its blatantly obvious that the Gohonzon invokes Mikkyo in the way its constructed? No, because Nichiren criticized Mikkyo. So all you are taught really is Nembutsu - recollection of the Buddha. Which is fine - that is an excellent practice that is very easy to undertake. But then you have been taught this is all you need. Its a willful ignorance. This ignorance is justified by the triumphalist claim that those teachings have expired. Its preposterous.
Nichiren was extremely well learned, and his disciples were also well learned, familiar with the underlying teachings of Buddhism. So when he was writing, he was writing to people who shared a common body of learning. These days, people pick up Nichiren's writings and without any significant learning of basic Buddhism, think they can interpret this stuff and derive a correct understanding of it. I'm not claiming any such understanding, but I at least know, I have a whole lot more learning to do.