This is a very strange complaint. I am pretty sure Muni will not say that Buddhism is extreme or that "his" view is superior. He will say his view is that of the Buddha and, far from being extreme, I am quite sure he will say this view is superior. Do you not agree Buddha's view is superior?Simon E. wrote:Which ids of course a triumphalist position which sees itself as superior, and sees the advocacy of plain buddhism as 'extreme '.muni wrote:Thanks for the words about tolerance.
I feel discussions like these are a help in warning us for extremism and there is no buddhism possible which is extremist. If we exclude others, there is the independent self.
There is not so much need to examine the talk in a way of being right or wrong, so I wrote he is called spiritual master and not buddhist. Regarding "our own disturbed mind which is the real danger" I meant own mind. I don’t say your or their or his or her mind. This as clarification for my earlier post. Sorry for messy-ness.
Then those who have understood the meaning of the buddha can see teaching in all without any thing which need to be divided.
Peace.
Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
- padma norbu
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Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
I get the impression that Muni is a woman expressing opinions and not a man. I may be wrong of course...padma norbu wrote:
This is a very strange complaint. I am pretty sure Muni will not say that Buddhism is extreme or that "his" view is superior. He will say his view is that of the Buddha and, far from being extreme, I am quite sure he will say this view is superior. Do you not agree Buddha's view is superior?
Leave the polluted water of conceptual thoughts in its natural clarity. Without affirming or denying appearances, leave them as they are. When there is neither acceptance nor rejection, mind is liberated into mahāmudra.
~ Tilopa
~ Tilopa
- padma norbu
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Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
Probably right, but I just use grammatical conventions whenever sex is not known. Sadly, we live in a male-oriented society. Makes sense, too... because I tend to like women much more than men.Berry wrote:padma norbu wrote:
This is a very strange complaint. I am pretty sure Muni will not say that Buddhism is extreme or that "his" view is superior. He will say his view is that of the Buddha and, far from being extreme, I am quite sure he will say this view is superior. Do you not agree Buddha's view is superior?
I get the impression that Muni is a woman expressing opinions and not a man. I may be wrong of course...
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
A)I don't recognise your use of ' complaint ' in this context.
B) does who recognise the Buddhas superiority ?
.
B) does who recognise the Buddhas superiority ?
.
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
- padma norbu
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Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
A) is it not a complaint that you see this as a "triumphalist view" which subjugates Buddhism to an "extremist" position? Sure sounds like a complaint.Simon E. wrote:A)I don't recognise your use of ' complaint ' in this context.
B) does who recognise the Buddhas superiority ?
.
B) You. Do you recognize the Buddha's views as superior views?
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
So you admit that you have not read the Agama Sutra, ie you are quoting or using as proof a text that you have no idea about and have never read.padma norbu wrote:Am I the only one who needs to provide proof? Find it yourself with the aid of Google.
I'm going to humor you and give you three to start with to start with, from there on you can easily find more and benefit from reading them:No, you have made a statement that you have not backed with proof. You ask me for proof, I am asking you for proof. Prove it.
Ananda Sutta
Santaka Sutta
Upaddha Sutta
As part of the contemplation on the Brahma Viharas, yes. (Just in case you didn't notice, that's a fourth Dharma door right there). As a stand alone quality? I believe: No more so than any other of the wholesome states of mind.Here are a list of questions you have not answered:
1. Is compassion 1 of the 84,000 doors?
Being an ass? Sorry, but that is just a ridiculous question and completely irrelevant to our discussion.2. What is the method for teaching a donkey?...
The questions just gets worse...3. If the enlightening beings have mastered the 84,000 doors, why did enlightenment still escape them?
I see no grounds for disagreement.4. Is this teaching right or wrong and by what definitive grounds do you say so?:
"The 84,000 dharma doors mentioned in the Buddha Dharma are made available for the purpose of saving and taking across the 84,000 kinds of living beings. In reality, in the mind of any common person there exist these 84,000 kinds of living beings. Why is it so? This is because these 84,000 kinds of living beings dwell within one’s consciousness, constantly revolving around the 6 paths of rebirth." (which seems to agree with the Flower Ornament Scripture and the Nirvana Scripture)
- http://www.drbachinese.org/branch/CTTB/ ... rma161.htm
Anyway, I'm thoroughly bored with the meandering (and in most parts circular) nature of this discussion.
From me:
"My religion is not deceiving myself."
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE
"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE
"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
It's not a complaint.its an observation.padma norbu wrote:A) is it not a complaint that you see this as a "triumphalist view" which subjugates Buddhism to an "extremist" position? Sure sounds like a complaint.Simon E. wrote:A)I don't recognise your use of ' complaint ' in this context.
B) does who recognise the Buddhas superiority ?
.
B) You. Do you recognize the Buddha's views as superior views?
Superior to what ?
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
- padma norbu
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Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
No, I didn't admit that, did I? Gonna have to report you for the 5th time today. Surprised you survived the first three. Isn't it three strikes you're out?Sherab Dorje wrote:So you admit that you have not read the Agama Sutra, ie you are quoting or using as proof a text that you have no idea about and have never read.padma norbu wrote:Am I the only one who needs to provide proof? Find it yourself with the aid of Google.
I think it would be more fun to not read the rest of your post and just leave it at this.
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
- padma norbu
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- Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 1:10 am
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
- so you have no problem with it, just thought you would point it out because it's great?Simon E. wrote:It's not a complaint.its an observation.padma norbu wrote:A) is it not a complaint that you see this as a "triumphalist view" which subjugates Buddhism to an "extremist" position? Sure sounds like a complaint.Simon E. wrote:A)I don't recognise your use of ' complaint ' in this context.
B) does who recognise the Buddhas superiority ?
.
B) You. Do you recognize the Buddha's views as superior views?
Superior to what ?
- superior to all other views
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
So please quote the relevant passage from the Sutra.padma norbu wrote:No, I didn't admit that, did I?
Only if the reports have any sort of validity and are not just being used as a means to win a losing argument.Gonna have to report you for the 5th time today. Surprised you survived the first three. Isn't it three strikes you're out?
"My religion is not deceiving myself."
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE
"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE
"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde
- padma norbu
- Posts: 1999
- Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 1:10 am
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
I'll get right back to you on this as soon as you address my previous requests.Sherab Dorje wrote:So please quote the relevant passage from the Sutra.padma norbu wrote:No, I didn't admit that, did I?
Should be... you're pulling the same shit I got a warning for. Worse, actually. Since I have no other recourse, I've resorted to reporting you instead... FIVE TIMES! It's supposed to be THREE TIMES you're OUT. Kinda bullshit if you're getting away with being [the way you are] because you were once a mod, don't ya think?Sherab Dorje wrote:Only if the reports have any sort of validity and are not just being used as a means to win a losing argument.Gonna have to report you for the 5th time today. Surprised you survived the first three. Isn't it three strikes you're out?
Last edited by padma norbu on Wed Jan 01, 2014 10:43 am, edited 3 times in total.
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
I don't 'have a problem ' with it. I do think it's worth pointing out that it is not as tolerant as it first appears.
Universalism is the ultimate negation of the worth of any creed.
Buddhadharma does not reduce to views. Superior or otherwise.
Universalism is the ultimate negation of the worth of any creed.
Buddhadharma does not reduce to views. Superior or otherwise.
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
- padma norbu
- Posts: 1999
- Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 1:10 am
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
Simon E. wrote:I don't 'have a problem ' with it. I do think it's worth pointing out that it is not as tolerant as it first appears.
Universalism is the ultimate negation of the worth of any creed.
Buddhadharma does not reduce to views. Superior or otherwise.
Seemed very tolerant to me, especially on further inspection.
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
I have had my differences with Greg/SD..but that is an outrageous accusation.padma norbu wrote:I'll get right back to you on this as soon as you address my previous requests.Sherab Dorje wrote:So please quote the relevant passage from the Sutra.padma norbu wrote:No, I didn't admit that, did I?
Should be... same shit I got a warning for. I have no recourse to actually respond to you in kind, so I've resorted to reporting you instead. Kinda bullshit if you're getting away with being [the way you are] because you were once a mod, don't ya think?Sherab Dorje wrote:[Only if the reports have any sort of validity and are not just being used as a means to win a losing argument.Gonna have to report you for the 5th time today. Surprised you survived the first three. Isn't it three strikes you're out?
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
Well we differ then don't we ?padma norbu wrote:Simon E. wrote:I don't 'have a problem ' with it. I do think it's worth pointing out that it is not as tolerant as it first appears.
Universalism is the ultimate negation of the worth of any creed.
Buddhadharma does not reduce to views. Superior or otherwise.
Seemed very tolerant to me, especially on further inspection.
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
- padma norbu
- Posts: 1999
- Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 1:10 am
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
Simon E. wrote: I have had my differences with Greg/SD..but that is an outrageous accusation.
No it isn't... and I've seen your dialog with him on the V forum, so kudos to you on calling him out on all of that!
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
My exchanges with Greg have not been posited on a failure to understand his point...so your kudos are unwanted.
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
- padma norbu
- Posts: 1999
- Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 1:10 am
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
That does not seem to actually jibe with this particular exchange (in which you are WONDERFUL, by the way, and quite accurate)...Simon E. wrote:My exchanges with Greg have not been posited on a failure to understand his point...so your kudos are unwanted.
Simon E. wrote:
You have spent years, literally years, sowing the wind. You are reaping the whirlwind.
You are hoist with your own petard.
Sherab Dorje: Sorry dude, but I can't help you.
Simon E. wrote:
Clearly. More to the point you seem unable to help yourself.
^ QFT
Last edited by padma norbu on Wed Jan 01, 2014 11:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
- padma norbu
- Posts: 1999
- Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 1:10 am
Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
You should also realize that I banned myself from this website for a full year and I have no intentions of being unfairly treated. If I get 2 more warnings for this conversation and suspended, so be it. I will say my goodbyes in advance. There is no shame in that. I have already been vindicated. It is really just a matter of politics now since I am *possibly* not following the Terms of Service... but, what's the point if Sherab Dorje doesn't have to, right? Like I said: "kinda bullshit." I don't need to be in that environment of mediocrity where such bullshit reigns.
Happy New Year.
Happy New Year.
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
- dharmagoat
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Re: Eckart Tolle - master of the park bench
I'm bored. Can I join your squabble?