Social interactions

General discussion, particularly exploring the Dharma in the modern world.
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SaaZ
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Social interactions

Post by SaaZ »

Hello,

I struggle with social interactions with my colleagues and by struggle, I actually mean that I feel really stressed about it. I thought that by being a researcher I could have avoided the situation, but it is actually even worse than my previous job. I've long tried to understand why it is so and sometimes I think has to do with being a "Buddhist"; that would explain why monks spend (theoretically) a lot of time in silence. Sometimes I think is because I don't share the same values as my peers. Moreover, when I try to don't force myself to fit I feel that the social situation with my coworkers gets even worse because then I tend to avoid 90% of the beers after works, etc. I'm good with strangers and occasionally I'm able to get closer to someone, although I think is more because they are interested in something more than friendship...

There is no way things are like that and I have some kind of social anxiety? Someone in the same boat? Any comment?

Thanks :)
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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: Social interactions

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

That is generally described as an introverted personality. There is nothing particularly wrong with it. It just seems at odds with how others are, who are more extroverted. I grew up without siblings my own age, and most of my school mates lived on other parts of town, so I spent a lot of time entertaining myself, and am quite used to that, and as a result I also prefer being by myself, or with people I have known a long time. I hate “small talk” and casual socializing. My point is, there are a lot of reasons why one may be more introverted. It’s perfectly okay.
I don’t think it is a particularly Buddhist trait. Most practitioners I know are eager to socialize with others. But if you flip that around, yes, I think that people who are more introverted may tend to be more introspective too, and introverts may likely be drawn to Buddhism and to monastic life in particular.
EMPTIFUL.
An inward outlook produces outward insight.
SaaZ
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Re: Social interactions

Post by SaaZ »

Thank you, Padma!

Interesting fact. I work in Switzerland and I have a Japanese colleague. Upon asking him what he likes and doesn't of western culture, was answer was: the only thing that I don't like is that you treat solitude as a bad thing.
SaaZ
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Re: Social interactions

Post by SaaZ »

Found some interesting opinions, for whoever is interested:

Last edited by SaaZ on Mon Mar 29, 2021 11:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Johnny Dangerous
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Re: Social interactions

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

I think if you practice Dharma earnestly you will often find yourself going against the grain socially.

That said, this is a separate issue than social anxiety. If you are suffering with that, there are concrete ways to approach it.

For me it helps to just accept that my take on things will simply be at odds with the views of plenty of people. I try to take it as a challenge to learn something from them regardless, and that helps.
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when afflicted by disease

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when sad

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when suffering occurs

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when you are scared

-Khunu Lama
cjdevries
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Re: Social interactions

Post by cjdevries »

I had pretty bad social anxiety, then I found a couple different forms of qigong that worked for me. The qigong transformed my social anxiety. I'm not saying qigong is a full proof solution, just that it helped in my case. I really like Master Robert Peng's Qigong Master Key Series; it's simple, easy to do, and has good results. It literally gave me my health back. I would recommend Master Peng to anyone.
"Please call me by my true names so I can wake up; so the door of my heart can be left open: the door of compassion." -Thich Nhat Hanh

"Ask: what's needed of you" -Akong Rinpoche

"Love never claims, it ever gives. Love ever suffers, never resents, never revenges itself." -Gandhi
SaaZ
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Re: Social interactions

Post by SaaZ »

Another interesting perspective:

cjdevries
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Re: Social interactions

Post by cjdevries »

Great video; I found it very helpful.
"Please call me by my true names so I can wake up; so the door of my heart can be left open: the door of compassion." -Thich Nhat Hanh

"Ask: what's needed of you" -Akong Rinpoche

"Love never claims, it ever gives. Love ever suffers, never resents, never revenges itself." -Gandhi
reiun
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Re: Social interactions

Post by reiun »

A potential pitfall here would be the failure to face crucial developmental or life tasks head on in favor of avoiding them in the name of spirituality or enlightenment (Jack Engler paraphrase). For introverts, inward-looking practices may actually exacerbate a symptom related to social interactions, or create a new one. A relationship with an informed teacher aware of this condition may be helpful, but also, perhaps, one with an expert psychotherapist, if the condition warrants.

(Disclaimer: I am a retired psychotherapist, and held an LCSW-C in Maryland and an LCSW in Virginia. I am sharing information only in this post, or any other future post on this or other pscyhology-related topics.)
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Johnny Dangerous
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Re: Social interactions

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

reiun wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 5:02 pm A potential pitfall here would be the failure to face crucial developmental or life tasks head on in favor of avoiding them in the name of spirituality or enlightenment (Jack Engler paraphrase). For introverts, inward-looking practices may actually exacerbate a symptom related to social interactions, or create a new one. A relationship with an informed teacher aware of this condition may be helpful, but also, perhaps, one with an expert psychotherapist, if the condition warrants.

(Disclaimer: I am a retired psychotherapist, and held an LCSW-C in Maryland and an LCSW in Virginia. I am sharing information only in this post, or any other future post on this or other pscyhology-related topics.)
:good:

Beyond that, the development of what's often called 'emotional intelligence' in secular terms could be said to be part and parcel of a Mahayana practice.

As an introverted person who at one time suffered from severe social anxiety (and Covid has brought a little of it back), I'd highly recommend working with a problem like that, rather than trying to somehow "escape" it or design a life that involves minimal interaction.

There is of course a very respectable path of becoming a renunciate in retreat, but like anything, intention matters. If the intention is to escape what is ultimately inescapable (as our anxiety is our own, the other people/objects do not create it), the results might not be great.
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when afflicted by disease

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when sad

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when suffering occurs

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when you are scared

-Khunu Lama
SaaZ
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Re: Social interactions

Post by SaaZ »

I can definitely see this risk. However, I don't find it that easy to discern between personality traits, Buddhist practice, social anxiety, social expectations. On a personal level, I always pushed my self to avoid escape problems, but now that I'm reaching my 30s I'm keener to believe that this is how I am... Nevertheless, I'll soon join a monastery to spend an extended period there :smile: I'll see how it goes, then, eventually, I'll go to talk to a therapist.

Thanks for the comments!
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Kim O'Hara
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Re: Social interactions

Post by Kim O'Hara »

Johnny Dangerous wrote: Sat Apr 03, 2021 3:12 am
reiun wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 5:02 pm A potential pitfall here would be the failure to face crucial developmental or life tasks head on in favor of avoiding them in the name of spirituality or enlightenment (Jack Engler paraphrase). For introverts, inward-looking practices may actually exacerbate a symptom related to social interactions, or create a new one. A relationship with an informed teacher aware of this condition may be helpful, but also, perhaps, one with an expert psychotherapist, if the condition warrants.

(Disclaimer: I am a retired psychotherapist, and held an LCSW-C in Maryland and an LCSW in Virginia. I am sharing information only in this post, or any other future post on this or other pscyhology-related topics.)
:good:

Beyond that, the development of what's often called 'emotional intelligence' in secular terms could be said to be part and parcel of a Mahayana practice.

As an introverted person who at one time suffered from severe social anxiety (and Covid has brought a little of it back), I'd highly recommend working with a problem like that, rather than trying to somehow "escape" it or design a life that involves minimal interaction.

There is of course a very respectable path of becoming a renunciate in retreat, but like anything, intention matters. If the intention is to escape what is ultimately inescapable (as our anxiety is our own, the other people/objects do not create it), the results might not be great.
Yes - it does work in both directions. In fact, my first reaction when I read the OP was that the difficulties with social interaction might be driving the Buddhism as much as vice versa.
It's always a balancing act, of course, but my experience is that people who are truly at home in mainstream society rarely stray far enough from it to engage deeply with Buddhism or any of the other eastern traditions except, perhaps, hatha yoga. [Holds up mirror.] And yes, I've been hanging around DW for ... years. :smile:

:namaste:
Kim
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