Chod phowa and lifespan

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AmidaB
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Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by AmidaB »

Tashi delek to y'all!
I would like to ask you that does the chöd phowa have a lifespan-shortening effect on the practicioner? If yes, are there special countermeasures such as long life practices? Forgive my ignorance and if it is possible and if there is a difference, please differentiate between the outcome of sambhogakaya and dharmakaya methods in this regard.
Many thanks.
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Könchok Thrinley
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by Könchok Thrinley »

AmidaB wrote: Sat Apr 25, 2020 12:39 pm Tashi delek to y'all!
I would like to ask you that does the chöd phowa have a lifespan-shortening effect on the practicioner? If yes, are there special countermeasures such as long life practices? Forgive my ignorance and if it is possible and if there is a difference, please differentiate between the outcome of sambhogakaya and dharmakaya methods in this regard.
Many thanks.
I don't believe there are any such effects of phowa on the lifespan. But doing long life practice always helps. Also living healthy.
“Observing samaya involves to remain inseparable from the union of wisdom and compassion at all times, to sustain mindfulness, and to put into practice the guru’s instructions”. Garchen Rinpoche

For those who do virtuous actions,
goodness is what comes to pass.
For those who do non-virtuous actions,
that becomes suffering indeed.

- Arya Sanghata Sutra
Vasana
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by Vasana »

I don't know about Phowa, but chod can extend your life if practiced well but it would be irresponsible to say that there isn't also a chance of it being shortened. This all depends on many secondary conditions though, like your existing level of health, karma, merit, level of compassion,the types of beings you attract, other practices you do,how dharmic your life and mind is and so on.
'When thoughts arise, recognise them clearly as your teacher'— Gampopa
'When alone, examine your mind, when among others, examine your speech'.— Atisha
jet.urgyen
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by jet.urgyen »

AmidaB wrote: Sat Apr 25, 2020 12:39 pm Tashi delek to y'all!
I would like to ask you that does the chöd phowa have a lifespan-shortening effect on the practicioner? If yes, are there special countermeasures such as long life practices? Forgive my ignorance and if it is possible and if there is a difference, please differentiate between the outcome of sambhogakaya and dharmakaya methods in this regard.
Many thanks.
no problem at all if one haven't realized concrete phowa. most of us are just using imagination. Sometimes long life deity mantra is chanted because people are insecure of practicing it.
true dharma is inexpressible.

The bodhisattva nourishes from bodhicitta, through whatever method the Buddha has given him. Oh joy.
Malcolm
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by Malcolm »

AmidaB wrote: Sat Apr 25, 2020 12:39 pm
I would like to ask you that does the chöd phowa have a lifespan-shortening effect on the practicioner?
No, because it is not that kind of transference.
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lelopa
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by lelopa »

ChNN said:
"Some people are afraid of Phowa because the transferring one's own conciousness out of the body,
but it is only when one is dying that one can do the real transference.
When one is alive & well the transference will not function, even if you want it to."

When doing Chod you do phowa not with the intention to die
Lost In Transmission
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AmidaB
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by AmidaB »

Malcolm wrote: Sun Apr 26, 2020 10:20 pm
AmidaB wrote: Sat Apr 25, 2020 12:39 pm
I would like to ask you that does the chöd phowa have a lifespan-shortening effect on the practicioner?
No, because it is not that kind of transference.
Thanks Malcolm la. May I ask what cause the difference, or what are the mechanisms behind the lifespan sorthening effect in the other case(s)?
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AmidaB
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by AmidaB »

I try to rephrase and expand the question (in this time not excluding other forum members). So, what makes the difference between the lifespan shortening and non-lifespan-shortening versions of phowa? Thanks.
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lelopa
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by lelopa »

:?: :?: :?:
When I read this thread it seems for me the question is already answered :shrug:
What do I not understand? :spy:
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Malcolm
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by Malcolm »

AmidaB wrote: Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:28 am I try to rephrase and expand the question (in this time not excluding other forum members). So, what makes the difference between the lifespan shortening and non-lifespan-shortening versions of phowa? Thanks.
Well, for one thing, in phowa, you are using the energy of your vayu, sometimes called wind, to forcibly eject your consciousness. In cho, it’s just visualization.
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AmidaB
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by AmidaB »

Clear. Many thanks.
Toenail
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by Toenail »

I am not the dharma police etc., but maybe it is better to not say things like this on the internet. Better to take advice from ones own teacher about how life is shortened and extended etc and not read on the internet about it. If I would be new to the dharma and read people warning about life shortening effects of Phowa, I would be really put off the practice. I think it is probably very bad to make broad statements like that and broadcast them to many people one does not know. This will stay on the internet forever and people will probably read it 10 years from now.

For example, Ayang Rinpoche if I remember correctly said during the Phowa course in Bodhgaya some 6-7 years back that it will never shorten ones life and people who say that gather very bad karma and can go to hell. He said it is secterian. Even if there were textual references about it, they should be seen in context and in perspective to their intended audiences and not broadcasted out to a random audience and confuse them.
Malcolm
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by Malcolm »

Toenail wrote: Wed Apr 29, 2020 2:44 pm I am not the dharma police etc., but maybe it is better to not say things like this on the internet. Better to take advice from ones own teacher about how life is shortened and extended etc and not read on the internet about it. If I would be new to the dharma and read people warning about life shortening effects of Phowa, I would be really put off the practice. I think it is probably very bad to make broad statements like that and broadcast them to many people one does not know. This will stay on the internet forever and people will probably read it 10 years from now.

For example, Ayang Rinpoche if I remember correctly said during the Phowa course in Bodhgaya some 6-7 years back that it will never shorten ones life and people who say that gather very bad karma and can go to hell. He said it is secterian. Even if there were textual references about it, they should be seen in context and in perspective to their intended audiences and not broadcasted out to a random audience and confuse them.
The horse has already left the barn. It is a little late to be closing the door now.
Toenail
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by Toenail »

Sentient beings are engaging in non virtuous behaviour since beginningless times. It is happening everywhere. So it is OK for us now to steal, kill etc? I get what you are saying, but that kind of reasoning is not really logical, a personal feeling of responsibility seems appropriate. Anyways, my intention was not to point out someones individual behaviour, I just wanted to add that "Phowa is bad for ones life span" is not the general teaching or the essence on that topic.
Malcolm
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by Malcolm »

Toenail wrote: Wed Apr 29, 2020 3:03 pm I just wanted to add that "Phowa is bad for ones life span" is not the general teaching or the essence on that topic.
It can be, unless proper care is taken. That is why, after training in transference, we supplement our life force with long life mantras and recitations. It is in fact the general teaching, do you require proof?
Danny
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by Danny »

All paths lead to the same point. Eventually.
Phowa is good for practice and good preperation. Supplemented with long life, or as I would say death ransom practices, also a good benefit for all round balance of health, no problems there either. Malcom is correct that it's visualization, working with mind, the long life works with energy of body and speech, another plus. Familiarizing yourself with the practice You gain understanding of the kayas, so all in all a terrific complete path in itself.

Regards
Danny
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Re: Chod phowa and lifespan

Post by Danny »

One last thing, would also be an added bonus if you can receive a vajrasattva empowerment, even if it's just a vase.

Regards
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