Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Mr.Charles
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Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Mr.Charles »

I am looking for someone with a lot of experience when it comes to meditation and the chöd method, if possible a buddist who has a lifetime of experience. I have tried many forms of meditation and few have helped for me, I have lost a lot of time trying to find a good method, the chöd is only one of many I tried that have given me a littel bit of improvement.

I have a severe form of ptss. (it holds control over me: headaches, numbness in the head, fear, muscle pain, intestinal problems, ect)
I am working with the Chöd method, which helped me a bit. Later I discovered that that demon was not gone at all, far from it actually. I discoverd that the demon can change it's shape.

The problem I have is that I do not seem to be able to make contact with my subconcious. meaning I do not get any answers to the questions I ask.
Strangely this is not discussed in the book, "feeding your demons". It only says to ask, but what if you don't get any answers back?
Before I had some luck that I got some answers back but not too much. Know, I don't get any.

I tried a method called "theta meditation" to help get answers from the subconcious. But also this seems to fail.

I know that with severe traumas, emotions have a shield formed around them to protect them form happening again. So I expect that this is what's happening here and that access is blocked. My question is how do I gain access to the subconcious and to my trauma's to be able to ask questions and get answers to resolve these emotions that have control over me.

Thank you in advance, Mr.Charles.
Fortyeightvows
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Fortyeightvows »

It is highly unlikely that anyone on this site will be able to help you.
I would kindly suggest to seek help of an expert in your local area.
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Ayu
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Ayu »

Many teach chöd all over the world. In Europe it's a center in Swiss for example. You have to find out where is a center nearest to your place.
Check out Tsultrim Allione Tara Mandala in USA.
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Johnny Dangerous
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

I am skeptical that the material in Feeding Your Demons would be particularly effective without a few solid years of meditation practice personally. I feel like it is the kind of technique that requires a base level of stability and ability to be with one's own trauma. There are similar techniques used in, for example Gestalt Psychology, but those would typically be used under supervision.

That being the case, I'd seek out a professional that is willing to work with your using the stuff in Feeding Your Demons, instead of trying on your own. There are Buddhist therapists out there that would do just that, some even do video sessions.

Not trying to discourage you from Chod, but Chod is typically for people who are Vajrayana practitioners and are already on board with all that, it requires dedication to a Guru and a particular sadhana etc. if that is not the case for you, you might be better suited looking for a Buddhist-oriented clinical practitioner. The stuff in Feeding Your Demons is not Chod, it is Chod-inspired.

Of course, it also might just be that time to jump straight into the teachings too, your call.
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when afflicted by disease

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when sad

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when suffering occurs

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when you are scared

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Mr.Charles
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Mr.Charles »

Thank you for all your insights. I will look into finding a buddhist therapist. In the mean while, Maybe there are some good books about basic meditation and chöd?
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

Mr.Charles wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2019 9:03 pm Thank you for all your insights. I will look into finding a buddhist therapist. In the mean while, Maybe there are some good books about basic meditation and chöd?
Chod is a Vajrayana practice requiring empowerment and teaching from a Guru with whom you establish a connection, the connection can take a variety of forms, but Chod is not a great thing to just read about casually or to undertake on one's own. The instructions in Feeding Your Demons are Chod inspired, but Chod is a far more elaborate practice, and requires a lot more dedication on the part of the practitioner. You could always trying writing to Lama Tsultrim Allione and see if she knows practitioners who go in depth with the Feeding Your Demons practice in clinical environments, I know they were offering classes for professionals in therapy/counseling world for a while.

As to basic meditation and Buddhism, oh yeah, a million and one books on that. A lot of people I know new to Buddhism liked The Heart of The Buddhas Teaching by Thich Nhat Hanh, but the list of recommendations here could go on forever.
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when afflicted by disease

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when sad

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when suffering occurs

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when you are scared

-Khunu Lama
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by LastLegend »

Mr. Charles,

Have you tried to pray for a practice that suits you?
It’s eye blinking.
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Ayu
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Ayu »

Mr.Charles wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2019 9:03 pm Thank you for all your insights. I will look into finding a buddhist therapist. In the mean while, Maybe there are some good books about basic meditation and chöd?
Tsultrim Allione wrote a book about "Feeding your demons". It is a method coming from Chöd practice and it is influenced by western methods of psychotherapy.
Explained in this article:
https://www.lionsroar.com/how-to-practi ... ur-demons/

But I recommend the book. I work with it (on my own) since years. Very helpful.
https://www.amazon.com/Feeding-Your-Dem ... 0316013137

Edit: It's available in other languages as well. I read it in German.
TrimePema
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by TrimePema »

Mr.Charles wrote: Tue Oct 01, 2019 12:05 pm I am looking for someone with a lot of experience when it comes to meditation and the chöd method, if possible a buddist who has a lifetime of experience. I have tried many forms of meditation and few have helped for me, I have lost a lot of time trying to find a good method, the chöd is only one of many I tried that have given me a littel bit of improvement.

I have a severe form of ptss. (it holds control over me: headaches, numbness in the head, fear, muscle pain, intestinal problems, ect)
I am working with the Chöd method, which helped me a bit. Later I discovered that that demon was not gone at all, far from it actually. I discoverd that the demon can change it's shape.

The problem I have is that I do not seem to be able to make contact with my subconcious. meaning I do not get any answers to the questions I ask.
Strangely this is not discussed in the book, "feeding your demons". It only says to ask, but what if you don't get any answers back?
Before I had some luck that I got some answers back but not too much. Know, I don't get any.

I tried a method called "theta meditation" to help get answers from the subconcious. But also this seems to fail.

I know that with severe traumas, emotions have a shield formed around them to protect them form happening again. So I expect that this is what's happening here and that access is blocked. My question is how do I gain access to the subconcious and to my trauma's to be able to ask questions and get answers to resolve these emotions that have control over me.

Thank you in advance, Mr.Charles.
Lama Tsultrim sounds like a good fit, if you like her. Have you taken her class on chod?

Speaking from many years experiencing and having ptss myself...


Are you familiar with the term pure vision?
Mr.Charles
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Mr.Charles »

"Are you familiar with the term pure vision?"
No I have not heard of this.

Feeding your demons is the book I have read.

I did find a few good books that I am going to read. They where recommended by someone at amazon who wrote a review on the book "machik's complete explanation".

1) The Dark Red Amulet by Khenpo Palden Sherab (with instructions)
2) Machig Labdron and the Foundations of Chod by Jerome Edou


I did already have success with the chöd method by myself, but the more detail you have of basic meditation and the chöd method, the better it will work. I feel that most books lack this detailed information and need to be compressed in detail and truly useful (practical) information.

A teacher can be a very helpful aspect, but in my experience it is difficult to find good help and most of the time I have lost lots of money and gained nothing or worse. If there is someone I would be glad to go to a teacher. I am from Europe/Belgium.

Thank you for all your advice, Mr.Charles
Simon E.
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Simon E. »

Johnny Dangerous wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2019 5:47 pm I am skeptical that the material in Feeding Your Demons would be particularly effective without a few solid years of meditation practice personally. I feel like it is the kind of technique that requires a base level of stability and ability to be with one's own trauma. There are similar techniques used in, for example Gestalt Psychology, but those would typically be used under supervision.

That being the case, I'd seek out a professional that is willing to work with your using the stuff in Feeding Your Demons, instead of trying on your own. There are Buddhist therapists out there that would do just that, some even do video sessions.

Not trying to discourage you from Chod, but Chod is typically for people who are Vajrayana practitioners and are already on board with all that, it requires dedication to a Guru and a particular sadhana etc. if that is not the case for you, you might be better suited looking for a Buddhist-oriented clinical practitioner. The stuff in Feeding Your Demons is not Chod, it is Chod-inspired.

Of course, it also might just be that time to jump straight into the teachings too, your call.
I agree 100%. There is a lot of Chod-Lite out there. The real thing is not to be approached without a good grounding in HIgher Yoga Tantra and/ or Dzogchen. This is heavy duty stuff and frankly the only thing keeping Chod -Lite practitioners from harm is their naivety and the superficiality of their practise.
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”

Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by jet.urgyen »

Mr.Charles wrote: Tue Oct 01, 2019 12:05 pm I am looking for someone with a lot of experience when it comes to meditation and the chöd method, if possible a buddist who has a lifetime of experience. I have tried many forms of meditation and few have helped for me, I have lost a lot of time trying to find a good method, the chöd is only one of many I tried that have given me a littel bit of improvement.

I have a severe form of ptss. (it holds control over me: headaches, numbness in the head, fear, muscle pain, intestinal problems, ect)
I am working with the Chöd method, which helped me a bit. Later I discovered that that demon was not gone at all, far from it actually. I discoverd that the demon can change it's shape.

The problem I have is that I do not seem to be able to make contact with my subconcious. meaning I do not get any answers to the questions I ask.
Strangely this is not discussed in the book, "feeding your demons". It only says to ask, but what if you don't get any answers back?
Before I had some luck that I got some answers back but not too much. Know, I don't get any.

I tried a method called "theta meditation" to help get answers from the subconcious. But also this seems to fail.

I know that with severe traumas, emotions have a shield formed around them to protect them form happening again. So I expect that this is what's happening here and that access is blocked. My question is how do I gain access to the subconcious and to my trauma's to be able to ask questions and get answers to resolve these emotions that have control over me.

Thank you in advance, Mr.Charles.
it's a good idea to go to a tibetan doctor, if you can find one near you.
true dharma is inexpressible.

The bodhisattva nourishes from bodhicitta, through whatever method the Buddha has given him. Oh joy.
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Ayu »

Simon E. wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2019 12:46 pm
Johnny Dangerous wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2019 5:47 pm I am skeptical that the material in Feeding Your Demons would be particularly effective without a few solid years of meditation practice personally. I feel like it is the kind of technique that requires a base level of stability and ability to be with one's own trauma. There are similar techniques used in, for example Gestalt Psychology, but those would typically be used under supervision.

That being the case, I'd seek out a professional that is willing to work with your using the stuff in Feeding Your Demons, instead of trying on your own. There are Buddhist therapists out there that would do just that, some even do video sessions.

Not trying to discourage you from Chod, but Chod is typically for people who are Vajrayana practitioners and are already on board with all that, it requires dedication to a Guru and a particular sadhana etc. if that is not the case for you, you might be better suited looking for a Buddhist-oriented clinical practitioner. The stuff in Feeding Your Demons is not Chod, it is Chod-inspired.

Of course, it also might just be that time to jump straight into the teachings too, your call.
I agree 100%. There is a lot of Chod-Lite out there. The real thing is not to be approached without a good grounding in HIgher Yoga Tantra and/ or Dzogchen. This is heavy duty stuff and frankly the only thing keeping Chod -Lite practitioners from harm is their naivety and the superficiality of their practise.
I think, JD gives a wise advice here.
But I disagree with the assumption that all "Chöd-Lite" practicioners are endangered. How do you know that people who like "Demon Feeding" did not pass some years of solid meditation practice?
IMO, good solid ability to meditate is the foundation for Demon Feeding. If an aspirant lacks this base, they would be unable to practice Demonfeeding. Such people would simply say 'It doesn't work'.

So, there is no danger at all. IMHO.
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by TrimePema »

Mr.Charles wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2019 12:23 pm "Are you familiar with the term pure vision?"
No I have not heard of this.

Feeding your demons is the book I have read.

I did find a few good books that I am going to read. They where recommended by someone at amazon who wrote a review on the book "machik's complete explanation".

1) The Dark Red Amulet by Khenpo Palden Sherab (with instructions)
2) Machig Labdron and the Foundations of Chod by Jerome Edou


I did already have success with the chöd method by myself, but the more detail you have of basic meditation and the chöd method, the better it will work. I feel that most books lack this detailed information and need to be compressed in detail and truly useful (practical) information.

A teacher can be a very helpful aspect, but in my experience it is difficult to find good help and most of the time I have lost lots of money and gained nothing or worse. If there is someone I would be glad to go to a teacher. I am from Europe/Belgium.

Thank you for all your advice, Mr.Charles
learn about pure vision... that's the basis of all vajrayana.
Simon E.
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Simon E. »

Ayu wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:11 pm
Simon E. wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2019 12:46 pm
Johnny Dangerous wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2019 5:47 pm I am skeptical that the material in Feeding Your Demons would be particularly effective without a few solid years of meditation practice personally. I feel like it is the kind of technique that requires a base level of stability and ability to be with one's own trauma. There are similar techniques used in, for example Gestalt Psychology, but those would typically be used under supervision.

That being the case, I'd seek out a professional that is willing to work with your using the stuff in Feeding Your Demons, instead of trying on your own. There are Buddhist therapists out there that would do just that, some even do video sessions.

Not trying to discourage you from Chod, but Chod is typically for people who are Vajrayana practitioners and are already on board with all that, it requires dedication to a Guru and a particular sadhana etc. if that is not the case for you, you might be better suited looking for a Buddhist-oriented clinical practitioner. The stuff in Feeding Your Demons is not Chod, it is Chod-inspired.

Of course, it also might just be that time to jump straight into the teachings too, your call.
I agree 100%. There is a lot of Chod-Lite out there. The real thing is not to be approached without a good grounding in HIgher Yoga Tantra and/ or Dzogchen. This is heavy duty stuff and frankly the only thing keeping Chod -Lite practitioners from harm is their naivety and the superficiality of their practise.
I think, JD gives a wise advice here.
But I disagree with the assumption that all "Chöd-Lite" practicioners are endangered. How do you know that people who like "Demon Feeding" did not pass some years of solid meditation practice?
IMO, good solid ability to meditate is the foundation for Demon Feeding. If an aspirant lacks this base, they would be unable to practice Demonfeeding. Such people would simply say 'It doesn't work'.

So, there is no danger at all. IMHO.
But as JD says populist “Demon Feeding” is not Chod. Which is why I called Chod-Lite. I was referring to people, and they exist, who move on to attempting real Chod, including visiting cemeteries, without proper instruction and without Refuge. Usually they just give up and go home slightly damp..But some of them persist..The late Lama Akong dealt with several such cases. They were in a bad way. It is not necessary to assume that they had exposed themselves to actual demons, although we must also assume that possibility, but it is more likely that they had exposed themselves to their shadow persona without preparation or support.
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”

Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Fortyeightvows
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Fortyeightvows »

exposed themselves to actual demons, although we must also assume that possibility
A bit surprised to hear that coming from Simon
Simon E.
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Simon E. »

Fortyeightvows wrote: Sun Oct 06, 2019 1:57 am
exposed themselves to actual demons, although we must also assume that possibility
A bit surprised to hear that coming from Simon
Then you haven’t been reading my posts carefully enough.. :smile: No reason why you should of course. I’m just a guy shootin’ his mouth off.
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”

Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Fortyeightvows
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Fortyeightvows »

Simon E. wrote: Sun Oct 06, 2019 7:28 am Then you haven’t been reading my posts carefully enough.. :smile: No reason why you should of course. I’m just a guy shootin’ his mouth off.
Same like me
:tongue:
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Ayu »

Simon E. wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:54 pm ...

But as JD says populist “Demon Feeding” is not Chod. Which is why I called Chod-Lite. I was referring to people, and they exist, who move on to attempting real Chod, including visiting cemeteries, without proper instruction and without Refuge. Usually they just give up and go home slightly damp..But some of them persist..The late Lama Akong dealt with several such cases. They were in a bad way. It is not necessary to assume that they had exposed themselves to actual demons, although we must also assume that possibility, but it is more likely that they had exposed themselves to their shadow persona without preparation or support.
I'm sure, you wrote this in complete benevolent motivation, trying to help people to avoid wrong paths.

But for the sake of not comparing oranges and apples we have to be clear that you are not talking about the real method "Feeding Your Demons" here.
I'd like to politely point out, that you never tried demonfeeding and never read that book either. So, we are not talking about the same topic here.

In demonfeeding we are not dealing with demons which are outside of us. It's not about outer enemies or exposing oneself wildly to anything. It is about internal obstacles and it is very beneficial to meet them in this ritualised form. It is no free meeting where anything can happen.
Please read the book without prejudice. I bet, you'll agree to that method.
Simon E.
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Re: Experienced help with chöd method and meditation

Post by Simon E. »

Thank you for bringing clarification to the issue Ayu.

:namaste:
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”

Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
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