Zen is zazen Is this true?

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master of puppets
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Zen is zazen Is this true?

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Zen is zazen Is this true?
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seeker242
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

Post by seeker242 »

It depends, what is zazen?
One should not kill any living being, nor cause it to be killed, nor should one incite any other to kill. Do never injure any being, whether strong or weak, in this entire universe!
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

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Good friends, the deluded speak with their mouths, but the wise practice with their minds. Furthermore, there are deluded people who empty their minds and sit in quietude without thinking of anything whatsoever, claiming that this is great. You can’t even speak to these people, because of their false views!
(Platform Sutra, ch 2, BDK ed, p 29)

The master addressed the assembly, “Good friends, what is seated meditation (zuochan)? In this teaching, there is no impediment and no hindrance. Externally, for the mind to refrain from activating thoughts with regard to all the good and bad realms is called ‘seated’ (zuo). Internally, to see the motionlessness of the self-nature is called ‘meditation’ (chan).”
(ch 4, p 45)

You can sit [in meditation] without lying down from the day you’re born,
But when you die you will lie down and not sit up.
One always has this putrid skeleton,
Why should one set such a task?

(ch 8, p 73)

Xie Jian said, “The virtuous Chan monks of the capital all say, ‘If you wish to understand the Way, you must sit in meditation and cultivate samādhi. It has never happened that anyone attained emancipation without relying on meditation.’ I wonder, what is the Dharma that you teach?”
The master said, “One is enlightened to the Way through the mind. How could it depend on sitting? A sutra says, ‘To say that the Tathāgata sits or lies down is to practice a false path. Why? Because he is without coming and without going.’ To be without birth and without extinction is the pure meditation of the Tathāgata. For the dharmas to be quiescent is the Tathāgata’s pure sitting. Ultimately there is no realization, so how could it possibly [depend on] sitting?”

(ch 9, p 79)
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

Post by friendly »

No, Zazen not only sitting. Zazen not limit by up or down. Zazen no limited by live or die. So, we sit Zazen each day beyond sitting, beyond up or down live or die. So we sit.

The Master [Hui-Neng], having finished his verse, then said to his disciples: "Good-by, all of you. I shall depart from you now. After I am gone [] Be the same as you would if I were here, and sit all together in meditation. If you are only peacefully calm and quiet, without rnotion, without stillness, without birth, without destruction, without coming, without going, without judgments of right and wrong, without staying and without going-this then is the Great Way. After I have gone just practice according to the Dharma in the same way that you did on the days that I was with you. Even though I were still to be in this world, if you went against the teachings, there would be no use in my having stayed here." [Platform Sutra, Yampolsky p. 181-2]
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

Post by Seishin »

Zazen literally means "seated dhyana" :thinking:
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

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Okay...Zazen means just sitting. Anyone can sit what so special about that!? But I respect people’s choice!
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

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LastLegend wrote: Fri May 01, 2020 9:32 pm Okay...Zazen means just sitting. Anyone can sit what so special about that!? But I respect people’s choice!
Anyone can sit. Can anyone just sit? What does it mean to "just sit"? Does it mean just with the body? Just the mind? Or both? Or neither? :meditate:
One should not kill any living being, nor cause it to be killed, nor should one incite any other to kill. Do never injure any being, whether strong or weak, in this entire universe!
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

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seeker242 wrote: Sat May 02, 2020 1:37 pm
LastLegend wrote: Fri May 01, 2020 9:32 pm Okay...Zazen means just sitting. Anyone can sit what so special about that!? But I respect people’s choice!
Anyone can sit. Can anyone just sit? What does it mean to "just sit"? Does it mean just with the body? Just the mind? Or both? Or neither? :meditate:
That’s the question right. The same argument can be made: a table just sit? I think we need a trip to Hue Neng.
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seeker242
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

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LastLegend wrote: Sat May 02, 2020 2:05 pm
seeker242 wrote: Sat May 02, 2020 1:37 pm
LastLegend wrote: Fri May 01, 2020 9:32 pm Okay...Zazen means just sitting. Anyone can sit what so special about that!? But I respect people’s choice!
Anyone can sit. Can anyone just sit? What does it mean to "just sit"? Does it mean just with the body? Just the mind? Or both? Or neither? :meditate:
That’s the question right. The same argument can be made: a table just sit? I think we need a trip to Hue Neng.
I don't see how a table is relevant since a table doesn't have ignorance, wrong idea, suffering, etc. Although, if everyone could be like a table, without ignorance, without wrong ideas, etc. then yea, they wouldn't need to practice or do anything. :smile:
One should not kill any living being, nor cause it to be killed, nor should one incite any other to kill. Do never injure any being, whether strong or weak, in this entire universe!
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

Post by LastLegend »

seeker242 wrote: Sun May 03, 2020 11:35 am
LastLegend wrote: Sat May 02, 2020 2:05 pm
seeker242 wrote: Sat May 02, 2020 1:37 pm

Anyone can sit. Can anyone just sit? What does it mean to "just sit"? Does it mean just with the body? Just the mind? Or both? Or neither? :meditate:
That’s the question right. The same argument can be made: a table just sit? I think we need a trip to Hue Neng.
I don't see how a table is relevant since a table doesn't have ignorance, wrong idea, suffering, etc. Although, if everyone could be like a table, without ignorance, without wrong ideas, etc. then yea, they wouldn't need to practice or do anything. :smile:
Meditation (I think) it’s like nurturing (helps us to full blown of) that wisdom like cooking rice we have to leave it on the stove with flame instead of keep taking it off. Now, I am not clear why realized Bodhisattva still sits in samadhi from times to times.
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

Post by master of puppets »

LastLegend wrote: Sun May 03, 2020 4:20 pm Now, I am not clear why realized Bodhisattva still sits in samadhi from times to times.
to refresh?
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

Post by LastLegend »

menver560 wrote: Sun May 03, 2020 5:38 pm
LastLegend wrote: Sun May 03, 2020 4:20 pm Now, I am not clear why realized Bodhisattva still sits in samadhi from times to times.
to refresh?
One reason.
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master of puppets
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

Post by master of puppets »

Refresh yourself by refraining the teachings.
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Re: Zen is zazen Is this true?

Post by LastLegend »

menver560 wrote: Sun May 03, 2020 8:23 pm Refresh yourself by refraining the teachings.
That Wisdom. Another reason is to help sentient beings in that samadhi they can understand someone’s karma or if they want to know who causes problems on their turf :lol: .
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