ichinen sanzen not a view

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Minobu
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ichinen sanzen not a view

Post by Minobu »

I have been really pondering the concept of ichinen sanzen, 3000 worlds in a moment of existance.

First lets look at Sunyata.

It's not a thing but a view. A look into the nature of all that is.
Ichinen sanzen is according to Nichiren , The Eternal Buddha.

I read that in one of His many gosho i just read.

I never read gosho, except in the olden days of a chapter or district meeting with some passage as study material..

so it is all new to me. Weird huh...after all this 40 + years of practice on again off again.....

Hence my total lack of seeing that Nichiren was into TenDai big time...so i put my mind towards it and came up with this.

First lets think about stuff i read here at DW....

Malcolm's Buddhas only see other Buddhas ..

We are living in the palm of MahaVairocana Buddha .

This is the Buddha's pure land.

The saying from Nichiren this is neither pure or unpure land we dwell in...

So here we go....
"
The Buddha , during the Latter Day of the Law "Tweeks" Samsara.

This is after the Fromer and middle days are done.

The Buddha purifies Samsara and somehow gathers up all these ....this word was used in a derogatory way towards Lord Sakyamuni and i am now going to use it to describe us ...all sentients trapped in the Latter Day of the Law in Samsara and all it's six realms... "JUNK BUDDHAS ....

SO HE PURIFIES SAMSARA , AND INSERTS ICHINEN SANZEN ...into the mix.

Not necessarily creating a world where Ichinen Sanzen becomes the way sentients dwell in Samsara...But designs it with Ichinen Sanzen.....Where Sunyata is view ...Ichinen Sanzen is reworking , so to speak, how we dwell in Samsara.....

The dwelling place of all these junk buddhas gathered to be fully liberated through the " Way of Ichinen Sanzen "


this is what i got when i read Nichiren saying Ichinen Sanzen is Buddha.

The Lotus sutra reveals this somehow through ssges like Tien Tai The Great ....

Ichinen Sanzen is not some observation of Samsara and what sentients live in and react in....

It is placed into the mix by Buddha...it is the way He allows us to unravel ourselves and our karma..

due to our karma hell and anger and the other lower worlds are played out by some...

same with compassion and learning and the world of heaven....


We have karma and retribution is spontanious as we all know...No Buddha can eradicate other sentients Karma....

They have to do this themselves....

these are Buddha's works and how He liberates and has sentient junk buddhas work through their karma and become liberated...

This is the key to Buddhism...

this is why the Lotus sutra and the legacy it produced through various sages is Prime Time Living in the Latter Day of The Law...

all previous methods no longer are needed....for this is the deal.....This fits the capacity of the people of the latter day of the law...


like i said i learn through slander...
ronnymarsh
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Re: ichinen sanzen not a view

Post by ronnymarsh »

There are two approaches to Ichinen Sanzen. In Japanese they are "Ji no Ichinen Sanzen" and "Ri no Ichinen Sanzen". That is, "Ichinen Sanzen as an activity" and "Ichinen Sanzen as a principle".

The Ichinen Sanzen expounded by the great Tendai master in the Maka Shikan is "Ri no Ichinen Sanzen", the "principle".

Nichiren Daishonin, in turn, exhibited "Ji no Ichinen Sanzen", that is, "Ichinen Sanzen as an activity", the "Real Ichinen Sanzen".

The first is just a theory that even the lowest beings in the Jigoku world possess the Buddha nature and can attain Anuktara Samyaksam Boddhi, however, it does not demonstrate it in real terms.

The second, in turn, is demonstrated by Nichiren Daishonin's own life, and by us when we recite daimoku in front of the gohonzon with full faith.

Nichiren was a human being, ordinary mortal, without any of the sublime marks of a great man, without the blessings and tranquility that one in the higher realms should have for their accumulated merits. Yet he revealed the Object of Devotion for contemplation and proper invocation, showing himself to be the Buddha of the original cause.

While in Tendai the Ichinen Sanzen is just a theory, in Nichiren it is the practical realization that shows that an ordinary mortal has the Buddha innate in his own life. This is the meaning from the point of view of "Ji": Ji no ichinen sanzen is Nichiren's life manifested as Buddha of the original cause
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Minobu
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Re: ichinen sanzen not a view

Post by Minobu »

My point is the reality that ichinen sanzen was woven into the fabric of our Saha world by Buddha. This is what makes the Lotus Sutra the way of the Latter Day of the Law.
narhwal90
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Re: ichinen sanzen not a view

Post by narhwal90 »

Not sure sbout your causality minobu, Buddha never claimed to have created the world, or ichinen sanzen.
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Minobu
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Re: ichinen sanzen not a view

Post by Minobu »

Where did I say Buddha created the world?
Does the Lotus not tell of the Buddha purifying the Saha world?
The Buddha is the father teacher and sovereign of the Saha world. Not the creator

The Lotus Sutra starts to happen once the Bofhdisatvas of the Earth emerge.


There is a preparatory awareness spoken in The Lotus Sutra.
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Minobu
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Re: ichinen sanzen not a view

Post by Minobu »

Let me put it another way.....
We are living the Lotus sutra...this is a particular time according to the Lotus Sutra....

so....

when you use the Lotus Sutra, via ODaimoku , to cure someone or to elevate one's life condition ....are you not tweeking the Saha World..

Before the Lotus Sutra no one practiced Ichinen sanzen...

It was not part and parcel to the way people attained Buddhahood...

So we now have Nichiren explaining how these practices are moot due to the people's capacity and time.

People have these huge egos and intellect...and they think they are practicing Buddhism...

only if you do the practice appropriate for the time and capacity of the people,are you actually practicing with The Buddha of our time.

Hence the way of Ichinen sanzen and ODaimoku...

it teaches Lord Sakyamuni Buddha is inside us...we have all the power and wisdom at our disposal....

It's not a view but a way of harnessing all those sentients who are of this defiled time....regardless of their Karma...and liberating them ....

This is What we live in ...The Lotus Sutra...
illarraza
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Re: ichinen sanzen not a view

Post by illarraza »

Minobu wrote: Wed Jul 14, 2021 4:57 pm Let me put it another way.....
We are living the Lotus sutra...this is a particular time according to the Lotus Sutra....

so....

when you use the Lotus Sutra, via ODaimoku , to cure someone or to elevate one's life condition ....are you not tweeking the Saha World..

Before the Lotus Sutra no one practiced Ichinen sanzen...

It was not part and parcel to the way people attained Buddhahood...

So we now have Nichiren explaining how these practices are moot due to the people's capacity and time.

People have these huge egos and intellect...and they think they are practicing Buddhism...

only if you do the practice appropriate for the time and capacity of the people,are you actually practicing with The Buddha of our time.

Hence the way of Ichinen sanzen and ODaimoku...

it teaches Lord Sakyamuni Buddha is inside us...we have all the power and wisdom at our disposal....

It's not a view but a way of harnessing all those sentients who are of this defiled time....regardless of their Karma...and liberating them ....

This is What we live in ...The Lotus Sutra...
Sound about right to me.

M
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Lotomístico
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Re: ichinen sanzen not a view

Post by Lotomístico »

Minobu wrote: Wed Jul 14, 2021 4:57 pm Let me put it another way.....
We are living the Lotus sutra...this is a particular time according to the Lotus Sutra....

so....

when you use the Lotus Sutra, via ODaimoku , to cure someone or to elevate one's life condition ....are you not tweeking the Saha World..

Before the Lotus Sutra no one practiced Ichinen sanzen...

It was not part and parcel to the way people attained Buddhahood...

So we now have Nichiren explaining how these practices are moot due to the people's capacity and time.

People have these huge egos and intellect...and they think they are practicing Buddhism...

only if you do the practice appropriate for the time and capacity of the people,are you actually practicing with The Buddha of our time.

Hence the way of Ichinen sanzen and ODaimoku...

it teaches Lord Sakyamuni Buddha is inside us...we have all the power and wisdom at our disposal....

It's not a view but a way of harnessing all those sentients who are of this defiled time....regardless of their Karma...and liberating them ....

This is What we live in ...The Lotus Sutra...
I really enjoyed this, thank you
One should become the master of one’s mind rather than let one’s mind master oneself.
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Minobu
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Re: ichinen sanzen not a view

Post by Minobu »

from another thread i cherry picked this from a rather long post.

it's relevant and i would like to know if my conclusion is correct.

ronnymarsh wrote: ↑Thu Jul 15, 2021 10:34 am
This is not really a problem from a "Buddhist" point of view.
The validity of a writing is not in the person who wrote it, but in the fact that it contains, something that can only be judged according to the actual experience of what is written.

If we simply adopt a "Protestant"-type critical stance towards Buddhism, then we should all abandon Nichiren Buddhism.

The reason for this is that its entire logic stems from the theory of Ichinen Sanzen, developed by Chi-i, patriarch of the Tiantai school.

The problem is that Ichinen Sanzen can only be discerned from Kumarajiva's translation of the Lotus Sutra, where he expounds "Jyu Nyo Ze", the ten "thussness".

This section "jyu nyo ze" does not exist in the other earlier and later translations of the Sutra into Chinese or in the Sanskrit text. There are five statements of the Buddhas' wisdom that are expressed twice, but there is nothing related to what exists in Kumarajiva's version.


We as Nichiren followers i believe we believe the Kumarajiva version is but one further step in revealing Lotus Buddhism to the world. yes / no ?

As per the post....
I believe that this is but one aspect of ichinen sanzen...because everything is viewed from this nature of suchness.

There are other means to come to the ichinen sanzen from the sutra. such as the devadatta stuff and other entities such as asuras and so on mentioned in the Lotus sutra. It does not just evolve from nyo ze so etc.

the suchness is there to emphasise the the sunyata aspect is all...but ichinen sanzen comes from different parts of the Sutra...

yes hell has the the whole suchness about it.... so does humanity ...these worlds are mentioned in the Lotus...The ten worlds all can be seen to be derived from the Lotus Sutra.

so i don't know if you understand the depth of the teaching but it is not solely based on nyo ze so.....

if it was it would be like something other than the ten worlds which leads into the the ten factors and so on...
I'm sure Zhiyi knew of emptiness and suchness from just being a Buddhist master and going to school...lol....

there is more to this teaching than just suchness or emptiness...not that two are one and the same...
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Lotomístico
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Re: ichinen sanzen not a view

Post by Lotomístico »

Minobu wrote: Fri Jul 16, 2021 4:12 pm from another thread i cherry picked this from a rather long post.

it's relevant and i would like to know if my conclusion is correct.

ronnymarsh wrote: ↑Thu Jul 15, 2021 10:34 am
This is not really a problem from a "Buddhist" point of view.
The validity of a writing is not in the person who wrote it, but in the fact that it contains, something that can only be judged according to the actual experience of what is written.

If we simply adopt a "Protestant"-type critical stance towards Buddhism, then we should all abandon Nichiren Buddhism.

The reason for this is that its entire logic stems from the theory of Ichinen Sanzen, developed by Chi-i, patriarch of the Tiantai school.

The problem is that Ichinen Sanzen can only be discerned from Kumarajiva's translation of the Lotus Sutra, where he expounds "Jyu Nyo Ze", the ten "thussness".

This section "jyu nyo ze" does not exist in the other earlier and later translations of the Sutra into Chinese or in the Sanskrit text. There are five statements of the Buddhas' wisdom that are expressed twice, but there is nothing related to what exists in Kumarajiva's version.


We as Nichiren followers i believe we believe the Kumarajiva version is but one further step in revealing Lotus Buddhism to the world. yes / no ?

As per the post....
I believe that this is but one aspect of ichinen sanzen...because everything is viewed from this nature of suchness.

There are other means to come to the ichinen sanzen from the sutra. such as the devadatta stuff and other entities such as asuras and so on mentioned in the Lotus sutra. It does not just evolve from nyo ze so etc.

the suchness is there to emphasise the the sunyata aspect is all...but ichinen sanzen comes from different parts of the Sutra...

yes hell has the the whole suchness about it.... so does humanity ...these worlds are mentioned in the Lotus...The ten worlds all can be seen to be derived from the Lotus Sutra.

so i don't know if you understand the depth of the teaching but it is not solely based on nyo ze so.....

if it was it would be like something other than the ten worlds which leads into the the ten factors and so on...
I'm sure Zhiyi knew of emptiness and suchness from just being a Buddhist master and going to school...lol....

there is more to this teaching than just suchness or emptiness...not that two are one and the same...
I really don't have anything to add, just to say great topic, I enjoy your insights.
One should become the master of one’s mind rather than let one’s mind master oneself.
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