re inventing Nichiren

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Minobu
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re inventing Nichiren

Post by Minobu »

I seem to be re inventing Nichiren in order to maintain faith...

any noob reading my stuff should be well aware i know nothing...
Although in order for what i have come to terms with ...Nichiren Daishonin needs to actually be the Buddha of Kuon Ganjo or it doesn't work..

why ?

only a Buddha can appear to lie and leave something that leads to enlightenment and truth.
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Caoimhghín
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Caoimhghín »

Minobu wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 4:07 pmonly a Buddha can appear to lie and leave something that leads to enlightenment and truth.
Is that true though? Anyone lying who is accidentally correct can lie and leave something that might lead to enlightenment and truth.
Then, the monks uttered this gāthā:

These bodies are like foam.
Them being frail, who can rejoice in them?
The Buddha attained the vajra-body.
Still, it becomes inconstant and ruined.
The many Buddhas are vajra-entities.
All are also subject to inconstancy.
Quickly ended, like melting snow --
how could things be different?

The Buddha passed into parinirvāṇa afterward.
(T1.27b10 Mahāparinirvāṇasūtra DĀ 2)
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Minobu
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Minobu »

Caoimhghín wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 4:52 pm
Minobu wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 4:07 pmonly a Buddha can appear to lie and leave something that leads to enlightenment and truth.
Is that true though? Anyone lying who is accidentally correct can lie and leave something that might lead to enlightenment and truth.
read nichiren opening of the eyes...

he explains from the whole angle i have not yet revealed the truth...

so as He says some would say Sakyamuni is the great lier...and then goes on to defend Him...

i dunno...he cites different stuff in different sutras...
also there is a problem here at DW..
i don;t think i'm allowed to post enough of the gosho ..narwhal will delete the post saying it's too much...
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Caoimhghín »

If you actually say something about it of import, then it won't get deleted. The deletion rule is to stop the empty-headed from parroting things they don't understand and treating their incompetent realization (complete with irrelevant quotation!) as self-evident truth and a good substitute for semantically-rigorous conversation. If you have something to say about it, you can post it. I'm not a moderator, but I know that's the rule. If what you said above is what you wanted to say about it, you can edit your post to include the quotation you wanted to comment on.
Then, the monks uttered this gāthā:

These bodies are like foam.
Them being frail, who can rejoice in them?
The Buddha attained the vajra-body.
Still, it becomes inconstant and ruined.
The many Buddhas are vajra-entities.
All are also subject to inconstancy.
Quickly ended, like melting snow --
how could things be different?

The Buddha passed into parinirvāṇa afterward.
(T1.27b10 Mahāparinirvāṇasūtra DĀ 2)
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Minobu
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Minobu »

actually to come to the conclusion i posted one would really have to read the whole opening of the eyes..

i'm half way through part two...

it's what i gleemed from Nichiren's writing...ask others if i am correct in saying he defended Lord Skayamuni
Buddha who was called a lier due to what appears as complete turnarounds in sutra doctrine...

https://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/wnd- ... Part%20Two


i literally would have to post half the content mr.C
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Minobu
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Minobu »

Also MrC that gosho speaks about how different sutras describe different buddhas..the whole Nichiren talking about and defending Lord Skayamuni in the lier context might have blurred in from another gosho...

happy reading ! :)

i think nichiren is pointing to a different Buddha in the Lotus Sutra...I think He refers to "IT" as an entity...
when we chant we call upon that entity which is also a part of ourselves in some weird way...maybe not a part of ourselves but we have the same thing...so when we chant in front of gohonzon...due to the whole painted and wooden images thing being able to be a Buddha or a statue being able to be a buddha or Teacher...

so we chant and like the entity is right there and like a sort of camaraderie goes on between the two...

It's the only thing i think it can be...

but in the context of Nichiren being the Buddha...he had all this man made stuff taking for gospel at the time...like actual real historically correct Buddha taught the LS for 8 years and all that stuff actually took place not upaya...he knew it was upaya but he could get killed for saying so...so working from there he left us a practice where we can find out for ourselves...even the fact it's all made up...doesn't matter ..his hands were tied and he still had to straighten out the mess and do the wish of all sects...

do you know what the wish of every Buddhist sect is?

It's to be able to commune with that which we believe are higher beings and the highest sentient....

all wish that...

He brought that ...so He used false made up doctrine to save His ass and Voila !!!!

not necessarily false...but the whole implication that a being such as a Buddha is the author of these sutras....well.....it takes 2021 to even discuss the possibility they are man made stories.


anyway i found my happy place chanting with "The Entity "...going back to finish off my session...:)
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Caoimhghín »

Minobu wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:49 pmbut in the context of Nichiren being the Buddha...he had all this man made stuff taking for gospel at the time...like actual real historically correct Buddha taught the LS for 8 years and all that stuff actually took place not upaya...he knew it was upaya but he could get killed for saying so...
I have contrarian, possibly scandalous, opinions on what "upaya" actually is that I suspect many people on the forum would say are silly hokum and just plain wrong. Perhaps I will trot them out for a show on the forum one day. We will see. Suffice to say, I translate 方便 as "appropriate methodologies," not "skillfull means" or "skill-in-means," and this is a Sinocentric translation choice not informed by the Indian vocabulary used.
Then, the monks uttered this gāthā:

These bodies are like foam.
Them being frail, who can rejoice in them?
The Buddha attained the vajra-body.
Still, it becomes inconstant and ruined.
The many Buddhas are vajra-entities.
All are also subject to inconstancy.
Quickly ended, like melting snow --
how could things be different?

The Buddha passed into parinirvāṇa afterward.
(T1.27b10 Mahāparinirvāṇasūtra DĀ 2)
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Minobu
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Minobu »

Caoimhghín wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:58 pm
Minobu wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:49 pmbut in the context of Nichiren being the Buddha...he had all this man made stuff taking for gospel at the time...like actual real historically correct Buddha taught the LS for 8 years and all that stuff actually took place not upaya...he knew it was upaya but he could get killed for saying so...
I have contrarian, possibly scandalous, opinions on what "upaya" actually is that I suspect many people on the forum would say are silly hokum and just plain wrong. Perhaps I will trot them out for a show on the forum one day. We will see. Suffice to say, I translate 方便 as "appropriate methodologies," not "skillfull means" or "skill-in-means," and this is a Sinocentric translation choice not informed by the Indian vocabulary used.
yeah but it connotes the same ting mon !

upaya..who constructed Buddhist upaya..
i mean ...lets focus on what all sects really want ...to commune with a higher being ...

it's 2012...the curtain has been lifted...
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Shotenzenjin »

Minobu wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 6:04 pm
Caoimhghín wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:58 pm
Minobu wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:49 pmbut in the context of Nichiren being the Buddha...he had all this man made stuff taking for gospel at the time...like actual real historically correct Buddha taught the LS for 8 years and all that stuff actually took place not upaya...he knew it was upaya but he could get killed for saying so...
I have contrarian, possibly scandalous, opinions on what "upaya" actually is that I suspect many people on the forum would say are silly hokum and just plain wrong. Perhaps I will trot them out for a show on the forum one day. We will see. Suffice to say, I translate 方便 as "appropriate methodologies," not "skillfull means" or "skill-in-means," and this is a Sinocentric translation choice not informed by the Indian vocabulary used.
yeah but it connotes the same ting mon !

upaya..who constructed Buddhist upaya..
i mean ...lets focus on what all sects really want ...to commune with a higher being ...

it's 2012...the curtain has been lifted...
It's 2012? Scratches head.....
Generation's shall pass, our determination shall grow, at the foot of Mount Fuji
Like smoke that reaches far beyond the clouds.--nichimoku shonin. Third high priest of Nichiren Shoshu

Hokekko of true Buddhism https://nstny.org

Introduction to Nichiren Shoshu Buddhism
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... VKyEQ_cxK9
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Minobu
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Minobu »

So only thing left is for me to reinvent Nichiren DaiShonin.

Make like even Buddhism is so far from what it is all about....

but the Entity Who wishes you well and companionship is beyond all these what evers...

Meh i took it up in kamakura japan where like the whole zen and tend dai thing are at odds and what ever...they believe anything...

but it's all nonsense and they don't even think so...it's all high end intellectual stuff from China..




So comes the gohonzon ....lose yourself in it and forget the rest...

the man was in kamakura japan...land of the imported intellectual property of the time...


and left a gate way to the Entity everyone wants to meet...call "IT" what ever ....make a ritual from what ever means necessary....dig into Santa's bag of various trips around the going concern religions on said planets....Trip around and make connection...


Cause everything else on DW is just rhetoric...and dats what Da Man had to work with...this thing called the mahayana sutra shuffle....turns out it's a shell game....Which brings me to something bordering on lock him up it's nuts...

But this whole enchilada served up by Chef Malcolm...not me...i only eat of the Beast....

so like it is like me ole man...that carney fool , the phil silvers of the Canadian navy circa WWWII...who taught me...It's all a con...

years after me ole man died and my mom was wondering about the whole Gakki divorce and what not...she smiled and said something the ole man never did...

but she turned ....in discussion about Nichiren and the Gakki... she turned and went "AS your dad would say ..it's for the mooches...'mooches as in moujik as in russian term...


so like the whole thing like me ole mad said about everything from going to the doctors office to recieving the body and blood of jesus ...itsa all a con...it's like so ingrained in me....like it's all done for me to see itsa all a con...


thank you Father.
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Shotenzenjin »

Fascinating
Generation's shall pass, our determination shall grow, at the foot of Mount Fuji
Like smoke that reaches far beyond the clouds.--nichimoku shonin. Third high priest of Nichiren Shoshu

Hokekko of true Buddhism https://nstny.org

Introduction to Nichiren Shoshu Buddhism
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... VKyEQ_cxK9
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Minobu »

Shotenzenjin wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 12:24 am Fascinating
it's amazing...when i said father it was towards the entity...I chanted to know...and man did we get to see..

Never be afraid of the truth SZ , even if it shocks the beejevers outta ya.

What do you think is really going on...how does a Buddha go along with inaccuraccies beyound belief eh ?

and leave a thing that works..commune with who ever you want to put a label on it...commune with that ONE .
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by LastLegend »

Minobu wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:41 am
Shotenzenjin wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 12:24 am Fascinating
it's amazing...when i said father it was towards the entity...I chanted to know...and man did we get to see..

Never be afraid of the truth SZ , even if it shocks the beejevers outta ya.

What do you think is really going on...how does a Buddha go along with inaccuraccies beyound belief eh ?

and leave a thing that works..commune with who ever you want to put a label on it...commune with that ONE .
You should read the other post Lankavatara Sutra which you call a mess on the absolute non-arising as the true realization of the Buddha.
It’s eye blinking.
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by LastLegend »

Mahaprajna...non-dual Wisdom...Dharmakaya...it’s the One :lol: Been knocking on your door through Namo Renge Kyo.
It’s eye blinking.
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Minobu
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Minobu »

LastLegend wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:52 am
Minobu wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:41 am
Shotenzenjin wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 12:24 am Fascinating
it's amazing...when i said father it was towards the entity...I chanted to know...and man did we get to see..

Never be afraid of the truth SZ , even if it shocks the beejevers outta ya.

What do you think is really going on...how does a Buddha go along with inaccuraccies beyound belief eh ?

and leave a thing that works..commune with who ever you want to put a label on it...commune with that ONE .
You should read the other post Lankavatara Sutra which you call a mess on the absolute non-arising as the true realization of the Buddha.
iwas going to read it but it is gone...

the boss don't dig these dizzy heights....
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by narhwal90 »

The excerpt I think you're referencing was incomplete and out of context, so misleading and inappropriate. Here is a dharmwheel thread citing a number of translations of the sutra;

https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?t=76

Its a fairly old post so a number of the links are gone, but several are still working.
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Queequeg »

Minobu wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 4:07 pm I seem to be re inventing Nichiren in order to maintain faith...

any noob reading my stuff should be well aware i know nothing...
Although in order for what i have come to terms with ...Nichiren Daishonin needs to actually be the Buddha of Kuon Ganjo or it doesn't work..

why ?

only a Buddha can appear to lie and leave something that leads to enlightenment and truth.
Not sure why you think Nichiren is lying.

Also, Buddha does not lie.

If you're strung out on heroin and promising you that your fairy godmother will help you get through withdrawal gets you to go into detox, then it was an expedient to get you to do what is good for you. We can worry about the repercussions of the fairy godmother story later. Its better than being a junkie.

Buddha might be paternalistic, but he never lies about liberation.

Most people have never looked at their own mind and that ignorance directly contributes to their destructive behavior. To get people to a point where they can even begin to examine their mind, they need to first stop the destructive behavior. They don't even know the first thing about their mind so how would you tell someone in the throes of samsara that its their mind that is the source of all this suffering? The immediate suffering must be treated. Then we can treat the deeper causes. Until then, the suffering is just too distracting.
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Minobu »

Queequeg wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:49 pm
Minobu wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 4:07 pm I seem to be re inventing Nichiren in order to maintain faith...

any noob reading my stuff should be well aware i know nothing...
Although in order for what i have come to terms with ...Nichiren Daishonin needs to actually be the Buddha of Kuon Ganjo or it doesn't work..

why ?

only a Buddha can appear to lie and leave something that leads to enlightenment and truth.
Not sure why you think Nichiren is lying.

Also, Buddha does not lie.

If you're strung out on heroin and promising you that your fairy godmother will help you get through withdrawal gets you to go into detox, then it was an expedient to get you to do what is good for you. We can worry about the repercussions of the fairy godmother story later. Its better than being a junkie.

Buddha might be paternalistic, but he never lies about liberation.

Most people have never looked at their own mind and that ignorance directly contributes to their destructive behavior. To get people to a point where they can even begin to examine their mind, they need to first stop the destructive behavior. They don't even know the first thing about their mind so how would you tell someone in the throes of samsara that its their mind that is the source of all this suffering? The immediate suffering must be treated. Then we can treat the deeper causes. Until then, the suffering is just too distracting.
I said buddha's lie in the Nichiren section due to Nichiren trying to make it ok....like when he said people accuse Buddha of being a lier for he taught that people like voice hearers could never attain Buddhahood and people of other stuff can't attain enlightenment...Then the turn around in the Lotus Sutra where everyone gets in...


I think nichiren was preparing us for what we just went through here on DW...

all this jargon ended being viewed as holy , if you will and sacred and Nichiren annoyed people with His revealing certain flaws...

you know the whole Nichiren Thing ...upsetting the social fabric of the temple goers..and their social life...they did not care that the sutras are fraught with contradiction from apperently the same guy telling the stories...

but now we know...it was like i said a while back to someone that they are reading it all wrong...

It's like you with this ichinen sanzen thing...what you said Ten Tai the Great derived it from is a play on Sunyata ...nyo ze so ....

which yes if you show me where ten dai gets this concept from the Lotus Sutra then yes we can discuss wehter it meets the criteris for being empty...gauranteed it will...

but it is like a story thats made up from nothing...and thats not a pun on emtpiness..

there is no ichine sanzen to be gleemed from the Lotus Sutra....

so how does one deal with that and still follow something that actually works for me...

what i seen done...

the learning...i asked here for years about stuff...now it's out of the toothpaste tube...

i'm happy...i chanted yesterday with more faith in Nichirenism than ever...today i cannot wait to do so again...but i'm going for my secound shot in a few moments...

pfizer..

so now nichiren is like the guy that prepared me for what was to come in the modern age...

We've always been made fun of...the joke of Buddhist circles...Now all that is crumbled into like fables and stories made up and one has to lean on upaya...ot worse ..put a blind eye to the content and lack of....


sutra yana you call it...

look the tibetans do stuff unrelated to Sutra...There inititations are created from adepts...Yogis and yoginnis and stuff directly handed down from Manjushri Buddha...

yeah like first and 2nd stage Tantra in the various schools and inititations...


Gohonzon is the same...it leads one to this entity ...what ever you want to label it...

and there is enough teachings from Nichiren to be able to do away with the ichinen sanzen stuff and what ever and it still stand up...

why ?

because it was inevitable ...the house cards that was solid He Said this for 8 years...is gone...you have to go through upaya hoops to discover what ever trip you have been on Q.

For me ..it's finding the Entity and hanging out with the Entity ...

Nichren's hands were tied dude...He had no choice but to sort of cow tow to this man made nightmare imorted from China...uuuu look He brought this all the way from china...the emperor's ordered it and like they are all into this....and you end up with man made kamakura samurai nightmare for Nichiren to deal with....


so show me where ichinen sanzen is even alluded to ..besides it nature being on of emptiness..

nyo ze so is stickly about emptiness...there is no three thousand worlds upaya hidden deep within it as spoken in the hoben chapter...

and my nichiren had to go along with that or like ..it would be like pissing in the wind...He only went so far...now is the time in the modern era to learn as Chef Malcolm has and not be afraid.
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by tkp67 »

if you want to understand Nichiren position you need to contemplate the lotus as it appears in one's own life.

Understanding the ten realms is critical. Understanding mutual possession from the perspective of Shakyamuni, Nichiren and one's self is also of prime importance.

When a buddha preaches the true aspect how does it appear to those minds that manifest the lower realms?
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Re: re inventing Nichiren

Post by Minobu »

tkp67 wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 10:54 am if you want to understand Nichiren position you need to contemplate the lotus as it appears in one's own life.

Understanding the ten realms is critical. Understanding mutual possession from the perspective of Shakyamuni, Nichiren and one's self is also of prime importance.

When a buddha preaches the true aspect how does it appear to those minds that manifest the lower realms?
How do you think a christian feels when they finally wake up to the fact it is all a con....Something that got out of control and then used by Rome , after they made their top religion after Constantine..

nightmare...really bad stuff...

I don't know if you went over to the Ten Dai section but ichinen sanzen is on very thin ice right now.

It appears that a guy made it all up and hung the hidden in the Lotus sutra label on it for authenticity..

Then it travels to japan where they jump all over the New Chinese intellectual schools of Buddhism...

Do you recal when i was all on about signatures on Gohonzon of High Prisets and i did not want to bring them into my life...

well now it seems i got charletons to contend with ...

I believe in Nichiren and the entity He showed the Buddhist world...He was not afraid to dismiss bullshit..and stood up for what He knew...

So like maybe He knew that people would one day see as I have the past few days thanks to Loppon Malcolm...

It's a game changer dude...

So for me I have to place Tien Tai the Great and Dengyo the Great on gohonzon right up there with Devadatta...

something we need to learn from...kind of like changing poison into medicine only this is about people who fool p[eople with religion...

and destroy the Lotus Sutra in the process....If it isn't reality it isn't Buddhist.

hide your head in the sand...but Ichinen sanzen cannot be derived from the Lotus Sutra...

I've always had weird feeling towards it anyway...so it is easy for me to ditch...it just seemed childish ..the whole ten world psychology thing .


The Entity will teach you stuff dude...

I don't recall but it was like a year a year and half maybe ....before the NewYears announcement of the big Divorce..

I chanted towards east ..asked the Dai Gohonzon which i never visited and chanted to know what this religion is all about...

like die hard chanting dude...to an Entity that brought my father's dead bone marrow living off total blood transfusions for 2 and half years....come alive and no more blood transfusions...they had to take all his blood out with plasmapheresis and put someone's else in ...full tank regularly...


so the Entity shows me stuff...i saw the shenanigans , the power plays of gakki and shoshu...all the lies they produced about one another ...including me...they lied about me...like a lie dude....who are these people ?


So i'm not giving up on the entity of MyoHo RenGe Kyo ...It's the real deal...

Nichiren had no choice at the time...and He knew His practice would do all sorts for people...So when the time comes when all the boogyman and bullshit stuff is shown to be what it is.....


I'm still there dude..
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