The Relationship between Nirvana and Buddhahood: what constitutes a true extinction?

[Budai]

I have a question based on the Teachings of the Lotus Sutra, by which Nichiren Buddhists believe all beings come to Enlightenment, according to Gautama’s words within it’s pages. My question is about the relationship between Buddhahood and Nirvana, and how they tie in together, and also what both are to a large degree, as it must be understood. So here is the excerpt from the Second Chapter of the Lotus Sutra: Expedient Means, and it talks a lot about the Ekayana but also mentions the importance of entering into a true extinction as well as gives us a glimpse of Buddhahood, and the duties of a Buddha. Namaste. Nam Myoho Renge Kyo:

.....

They stray into the dense forest of mistaken views,
debating as to what exists and what does not,
and in the end cling to such views,
embracing all sixty-two of them.
They are profoundly committed to false and empty doctrines,
holding firmly to them, unable to set them aside.
Arrogant and puffed up with self-importance,
fawning and envious, insincere in mind,
for a thousand, ten thousand, a million kalpas
they will not hear the Buddha's name,
nor will they hear the correct Law--
such people are difficult to save.
For these reasons, Shariputra,
I have for their sake established expedient means,
preaching the way that ends all suffering.
And showing them nirvana.
But although I preach nirvana,
this is not a true extinction.
All phenomena from the very first
have of themselves constantly borne the marks of
tranquil extinction.
Once the sons of the Buddha have carried out this path,
then in a future existence they will be able to become Buddhas.
I have employed the power of expedient means
to unfold and demonstrate this doctrine of three vehicles,
but the World-Honored Ones, every one of them,
all preach the single vehicle way.
Now before this great assembly
I must clear away all doubts and perplexities.
There is no discrepancy in the words of the Buddhas,
there is only the one vehicle, not two.
For numberless kalpas in the past
countless Buddhas who have now entered extinction,
a hundred, thousand, ten thousand, million types
in numbers incapable of calculation-
such World-Honored Ones,
using different types of causes, similes, and parables,
the power of countless expedient means,
have expounded the characteristics of teachings.
These World-Honored Ones
have all preached the doctrine of the single vehicle,
converting countless living beings
and causing them to enter the Buddha way.

-Chapter 2, Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means.

So from what the Buddha expounds here in the Law, is that the Single Vehicle, the Ekayana, is always explained by the Buddhas to their adherents. More importantly however, and this is where my question lies, is between the relationship of Buddhahood and Nirvana. In previous times the Buddha has stated that an Arhat who has reached Nirvana has attained perfection, then He has stated there is a step beyond that, that Buddhahood is something more. What is the difference between a mere Stream Entry, such as putting your foot into the river of Nirvana, and a full Entrance into it’s waters? And what is the true extinction that the Buddha is talking about, beyond Nirvana, the Buddhahood that is meant that is Transcendental to Nirvana?

He speaks of many Buddhas who have attained this extinction, so we are all capable of it. Buddha also says that these Buddhas have expounded the doctrine in such various ways that there are countless Teachings that come from these Buddhas, but they are all part of the single Vehicle, the Ekayana.

Most importantly it is said: “All phenomena from the very first have of themselves constantly born the marks of tranquil extinction.” What does this mean? Once the Path is carried out in this manner, we shall be able to become Buddhas. Therefore, we should see the Buddha-Nature of all phenomena? Is that the only way to Buddhahood? I am sure if one ignores someone else’s Buddha-Nature at a necessary time, they may not perceive a part of their own. And if they do not help others awaken their Buddha-Nature, and help them come to Buddhahood, not activating their own Bodhicitta and their own Buddha-Nature in the process, they will not be Bodhisattvas. And one must first become a Bodhisattva in all circumstances in order to become a Buddha, as the very term Bodhisattva implies that it is someone who has a determination to become a Buddha.

But back to my primary question: what is the relationship between Nirvana and Buddhahood? Can one achieve Nirvana, even fully, and not be a full Buddha yet? As Buddha says here in this Chapter of the Lotus Sutra that although He preaches Nirvana, “this is not a true extinction.” So what is the true extinction then? And is Nirvana necessary for a full Buddhahood, even though it is not a true extinction? These are my questions on this matter.

And what I would like to say is that the subject matter of what Nirvana is aught to be understood as well. Because I think it is more than just a full understanding of emptiness and an emptying of the kleshas and just a blowing out of material life. There is also involved there a full adherence to the Noble Eightfold Path and an understanding of the Four Noble Truths that brought one there, so that Spirit of devotion to the Buddha’s Teachings has to continue on. I do ask, can a Bodhisattva enter Nirvana fully—would they still be considered a Bodhisattva? And what makes an Arhat dwelling in the Stream different from the Bodhisattva on the Path to liberate all sentient beings? Can they not all dwell in Nirvana? And where does Maitri come from, does it come from somewhere in Nirvana too? If we all have Buddha Nature, does that mean we all have Nirvana Nature as well? What is Nirvana and what is Buddhahood, and what is the relationship between the two, and are they One?

Once someone achieves Buddhahood, they will continue to expound the Law and devote themselves to the Mystic Law of the Lotus Sutra, as that is the key to Enlightenment, and so importantly that is the Way to their Buddhahood. Buddha mentions the Way to Supreme Perfect Enlightenment is the Lotus Sutra, so it is found in all Enlightening Buddhist Teachings. So how does Buddhahood and Nirvana fit into the Mystic Law? As it is the Mystic Law of Supreme Perfect Enlightenment. Om.

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo!

[LastLegend]

You’ve already known the answer why ask? The bolded text is your answer...

[Budai]

This is actually been a topic that has been on my mind for a long time and I think it is a very important one, so I just wanted to clarify it.

Thank you for your confidence and waves of Metta.

May we both find complete and unsurpassed Enlightenment soon .

If anyone has any answers to go in depth about this subject, or would like to add their own understanding, I would be happy. Thank you.

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo.

[LastLegend]

I like extinguished better than extinction...because extinguished is like a candle that’s blown out but can be relit with causes and conditions.

[Budai]

I like extinguished better than extinction...because extinguished is like a candle that’s blown out but can be relit with causes and conditions.

But extinction implies a non-regressive Buddhahood, where the candle cannot be relit for any reason, and is therefore not hampered by the Saha world ever again. This does not imply that life does not go on, however. It is a word used in the Buddhist sense of attaining Supreme Perfect Enlightenment, as you know.

.

Om.

[SilenceMonkey]

It's the difference between hinayana enlightenment and mahayana enlightenment.

[Budai]

It's the difference between hinayana enlightenment and mahayana enlightenment.

But isn’t Shakyamuni’s Enlightenment the model for Hinayana Enlightenment as well? In the early days they came to the level of Arhat, and revered Shakyamuni as the Buddha because He had attained the Way on His own, and they were the learners, but even they called Him a special kind of Arhat, the kind that was a Buddha. This may come to a question of the difference between an Arhat and a Buddha, and there is the difference in Hinayana and Mahayana, many of the early Arhats we would consider Buddhas as well, but out of reverence for the World-Honored Ones they called themselves Arhats and Him as the Buddha. But I understand in what you are saying there is also some difference, so if you want you can explain. I am interested.

Om Mani Padme Hum.

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo.

[SilenceMonkey]

It's the difference between hinayana enlightenment and mahayana enlightenment.

But isn’t Shakyamuni’s Enlightenment the model for Hinayana Enlightenment as well? In the early days they came to the level of Arhat, and revered Shakyamuni as the Buddha because He had attained the Way on His own, and they were the learners, but even they called Him a special kind of Arhat, the kind that was a Buddha. This may come to a question of the difference between an Arhat and a Buddha, and there is the difference in Hinayana and Mahayana, many of the early Arhats we would consider Buddhas as well, but out of reverence for the World-Honored Ones they called themselves Arhats and Him as the Buddha. But I understand in what you are saying there is also some difference, so if you want you can explain. I am interested.

Om Mani Padme Hum.

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo.

I'm not sure I can say much on this... Maybe someone might be able to point you in a direction where you can learn more about this difference. It is crucial to understanding the Mahayana Dharma.

As far as I understand, when Mahayana talks about "extinction" and "nirvana," it is generally referring to the hinayana enlightenment of an arhat. Such enlightenment is said to be like the blowing out of a flame. Once the flame is blown out, the arhat (or Buddha in the case of Hinayana) will no longer reincarnate at all. That's it, poof. Gone. They no longer have to bear the sufferings of Samsara.

In the Mahayana, one makes bodhisattva vows so one will not fall into the trap of a Hinayana enlightenment. Once one sees emptiness directly (thus entering the path of seeing and becoming a first bhumi bodhisattva), one will no longer be subject to suffering, which is brought by the afflictions. But one will still need to traverse the 10 bhumis to gradually purify one's cognitive obscurations which are the obstacle to omniscience. And Bodhisattvas will continue to reincarnate for the benefit of all beings in the universe, in order to liberate them all from suffering.

Anyway... the Mahayana enlightenment is said to be a non-abiding nirvana. One that abides in neither of the extremes of samsara nor nirvana. (Nirvana being the peace of extinction, which is the goal of the Hinayanist.)

There is a huge difference in the respective views of the Hinayana and the Mahayana about the nature of enlightenment and what is a Buddha, among many other subjects.

[Budai]

I see. So it is a question of whether one stays Emanated into the Saha world after achieving Nirvana? Is this so the case however? Because one can still help the Saha world while taking no part in it’s sufferings, even provisionally as the Buddha did and does in an Emanation Body. For example in Mahaparinirvana a Buddha can still help the Saha world by guidance and Meditation toward those still in the Saha world, without Themselves entering it in any way, or even descending into it. But that would mean there is still some interaction, so I get your point. However, I think you explain the purport of the bolded text very clearly: we are to help those in Samsara until tranquil extinction is completed for all. I think this is the premise of the Mahayana in Siddhartha’s mission, and the foundations of the Hinayana drew from this truth, knowingly or quietly in meditation, or even unknowingly in silence, until they came to a true extinction of what we Mahayanists would call Buddhahood.

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo.

[SilenceMonkey]

Sometimes people say “the Saha world” to mean Earth, sometimes to mean the three realms (all realms within our universe)... not sure which you’re referring to.

But yes, in the shravakayana, their enlightenment is to disappear entirely from the universe itself. Not merely abiding in another realm such as a heaven to help from there, but going poof. And this is what the Mahayana rejects. Celestial Buddhas and bodhisattvas often abide in heavens and pure lands, and are able to spiritually help beings here on earth. But this is not how shravakayana does it. They don’t choose to return to save humanity and the rest of the inhabitants of samsara. They just enter nirvana, and that seems to be the end of it.

Although I heard recently in a teaching that from a Mahayana perspective, the shravakayana arhats will abide in nirvana for something like 500 kalpas. But one day, they will be awoken by a Buddha telling them to come back because their work is not yet finished.

[PadmaVonSamba]

The difference between nirvana and Buddhahood may seem like it is two words for the same thing, but there is a difference.
Nirvana refers to the complete removal of everything that obscured the mind’s true nature.
Buddhahood refers to that which exists after that complete removal, which was always there to begin with.

As an analogy, suppose you are cleaning the dirt from a very dirty window. The window is so dirty that very little light can pass through it. Nirvana is like having washed away all the dirt. It was the dirt blocking the light.
But after you washed away all the dirt, is the window still there or is the window gone?
The window is still there. It is now perfectly clear. Light passes through it without any distortion or shadows. That’s like Buddhahood. What Buddhahood refers to is the mind’s true, original nature, just as ‘perfectly clear’ is the window’s true, original nature.

The next question that might arise has to do with what seems to be a conflict: nirvana removes all traces, but Buddhahood seems to imply a person still there being a Buddha, or experiencing Buddhahood. In other words, there is still some kind of experiencing mind at work.
How to resolve this?

It’s important to remember that what the Buddha taught was the means to escape samsaric rebirth. Getting off the treadmill doesn’t mean you cease to exist. The Dharma teachings point out all of the causes for beings to be stuck in samsara, and how to practice in order to not be stuck any more.
When the teachings suggest complete extinguishing, yes, this is correct, even according to the Hinayana principle of arahat. But what is extinguished isn’t the being who was wallowing in confusion and ignorance. What is extinguished is the illusory experience of a being, which is actually the result or product of ignorance and confusion.
This is what people tend to get backwards. It’s not that first, there is a being, and that second, that being is confused and thus trapped in samsara. Such a view would imply atman, or an intrinsically existing self, which Buddhism rejects.
Instead, confusion and ignorance (and various links of causation) is what produces the being. Or rather, the experience of “me”, of the being that we grasp.

The perfect, clear awareness of buddhahood, without the production of an illusory “me” experience, is like the clear window once the dirt of samsaric confusion and ignorance has been “nirvanatized” or completely removed.

[LastLegend]

The last paragraph is good...that’s also called oringal consciousness lol .

[illarraza]

I have a question based on the Teachings of the Lotus Sutra, by which Nichiren Buddhists believe all beings come to Enlightenment, according to Gautama’s words within it’s pages. My question is about the relationship between Buddhahood and Nirvana, and how they tie in together, and also what both are to a large degree, as it must be understood. So here is the excerpt from the Second Chapter of the Lotus Sutra: Expedient Means, and it talks a lot about the Ekayana but also mentions the importance of entering into a true extinction as well as gives us a glimpse of Buddhahood, and the duties of a Buddha. Namaste. Nam Myoho Renge Kyo:

.....

They stray into the dense forest of mistaken views,
debating as to what exists and what does not,
and in the end cling to such views,
embracing all sixty-two of them.
They are profoundly committed to false and empty doctrines,
holding firmly to them, unable to set them aside.
Arrogant and puffed up with self-importance,
fawning and envious, insincere in mind,
for a thousand, ten thousand, a million kalpas
they will not hear the Buddha's name,
nor will they hear the correct Law--
such people are difficult to save.
For these reasons, Shariputra,
I have for their sake established expedient means,
preaching the way that ends all suffering.
And showing them nirvana.
But although I preach nirvana,
this is not a true extinction.
All phenomena from the very first
have of themselves constantly borne the marks of
tranquil extinction.
Once the sons of the Buddha have carried out this path,
then in a future existence they will be able to become Buddhas.
I have employed the power of expedient means
to unfold and demonstrate this doctrine of three vehicles,
but the World-Honored Ones, every one of them,
all preach the single vehicle way.
Now before this great assembly
I must clear away all doubts and perplexities.
There is no discrepancy in the words of the Buddhas,
there is only the one vehicle, not two.
For numberless kalpas in the past
countless Buddhas who have now entered extinction,
a hundred, thousand, ten thousand, million types
in numbers incapable of calculation-
such World-Honored Ones,
using different types of causes, similes, and parables,
the power of countless expedient means,
have expounded the characteristics of teachings.
These World-Honored Ones
have all preached the doctrine of the single vehicle,
converting countless living beings
and causing them to enter the Buddha way.

-Chapter 2, Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means.

So from what the Buddha expounds here in the Law, is that the Single Vehicle, the Ekayana, is always explained by the Buddhas to their adherents. More importantly however, and this is where my question lies, is between the relationship of Buddhahood and Nirvana. In previous times the Buddha has stated that an Arhat who has reached Nirvana has attained perfection, then He has stated there is a step beyond that, that Buddhahood is something more. What is the difference between a mere Stream Entry, such as putting your foot into the river of Nirvana, and a full Entrance into it’s waters? And what is the true extinction that the Buddha is talking about, beyond Nirvana, the Buddhahood that is meant that is Transcendental to Nirvana?

He speaks of many Buddhas who have attained this extinction, so we are all capable of it. Buddha also says that these Buddhas have expounded the doctrine in such various ways that there are countless Teachings that come from these Buddhas, but they are all part of the single Vehicle, the Ekayana.

Most importantly it is said: “All phenomena from the very first have of themselves constantly born the marks of tranquil extinction.” What does this mean? Once the Path is carried out in this manner, we shall be able to become Buddhas. Therefore, we should see the Buddha-Nature of all phenomena? Is that the only way to Buddhahood? I am sure if one ignores someone else’s Buddha-Nature at a necessary time, they may not perceive a part of their own. And if they do not help others awaken their Buddha-Nature, and help them come to Buddhahood, not activating their own Bodhicitta and their own Buddha-Nature in the process, they will not be Bodhisattvas. And one must first become a Bodhisattva in all circumstances in order to become a Buddha, as the very term Bodhisattva implies that it is someone who has a determination to become a Buddha.

But back to my primary question: what is the relationship between Nirvana and Buddhahood? Can one achieve Nirvana, even fully, and not be a full Buddha yet? As Buddha says here in this Chapter of the Lotus Sutra that although He preaches Nirvana, “this is not a true extinction.” So what is the true extinction then? And is Nirvana necessary for a full Buddhahood, even though it is not a true extinction? These are my questions on this matter.

And what I would like to say is that the subject matter of what Nirvana is aught to be understood as well. Because I think it is more than just a full understanding of emptiness and an emptying of the kleshas and just a blowing out of material life. There is also involved there a full adherence to the Noble Eightfold Path and an understanding of the Four Noble Truths that brought one there, so that Spirit of devotion to the Buddha’s Teachings has to continue on. I do ask, can a Bodhisattva enter Nirvana fully—would they still be considered a Bodhisattva? And what makes an Arhat dwelling in the Stream different from the Bodhisattva on the Path to liberate all sentient beings? Can they not all dwell in Nirvana? And where does Maitri come from, does it come from somewhere in Nirvana too? If we all have Buddha Nature, does that mean we all have Nirvana Nature as well? What is Nirvana and what is Buddhahood, and what is the relationship between the two, and are they One?

Once someone achieves Buddhahood, they will continue to expound the Law and devote themselves to the Mystic Law of the Lotus Sutra, as that is the key to Enlightenment, and so importantly that is the Way to their Buddhahood. Buddha mentions the Way to Supreme Perfect Enlightenment is the Lotus Sutra, so it is found in all Enlightening Buddhist Teachings. So how does Buddhahood and Nirvana fit into the Mystic Law? As it is the Mystic Law of Supreme Perfect Enlightenment. Om.

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo!

Many of the answers to your questions can be found in Nichiren's Opening of the Eyes. Have you read it?

The Great Teacher T’ien-t’ai’s Great Concentration and Insight reads, “Earthly desires are enlightenment; the sufferings of birth and death are nirvana.” Nichiren explains how this is one reason the Lotus Sutra is superior to all other sutras which deny earthly desires. Of course, with the caveat that our earthly desires are all for saving the masses of beings. An adjunct to this is that, once one realizes that one is a Bodhisattva of the Earth, he or she realizes that we have assummed the appropriate karma in order to save those in our particular situation, relationships, and environment.

I request also that you read The Story of Ohashi-no-Taro. I am sure you will be encouraged to continue to practice Namu myoho renge kyo with an ever stronger faith after reading this fairly short Gosho: https://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/wnd-1/Content/85

[SilenceMonkey]

The Great Teacher T’ien-t’ai’s Great Concentration and Insight reads, “Earthly desires are enlightenment; the sufferings of birth and death are nirvana.” Nichiren explains how this is one reason the Lotus Sutra is superior to all other sutras which deny earthly desires. Of course, with the caveat that our earthly desires are all for saving the masses of beings.

Just as an aside... we should understand desires as poison (ie. one of the three poisons) before we understand them as shunyata. Otherwise, there is a great danger of attachment and identification with them.

[LastLegend]

“The Great Teacher T’ien-t’ai’s Great Concentration and Insight reads, “Earthly desires are enlightenment; the sufferings of birth and death are nirvana.” Nichiren explains how this is one reason the Lotus Sutra is superior to all other sutras which deny earthly desires. Of course, with the caveat that our earthly desires are all for saving the masses of beings. An adjunct to this is that, once one realizes that one is a Bodhisattva of the Earth, he or she realizes that we have assummed the appropriate karma in order to save those in our particular situation, relationships, and environment.”

Rightly so but 1) we aren’t really there to handle karma as it’s Nirvana 2) it’s not unique to Thiên Thai’s Teaching. It’s found amongst various Chan texts.

[illarraza]

“The Great Teacher T’ien-t’ai’s Great Concentration and Insight reads, “Earthly desires are enlightenment; the sufferings of birth and death are nirvana.” Nichiren explains how this is one reason the Lotus Sutra is superior to all other sutras which deny earthly desires. Of course, with the caveat that our earthly desires are all for saving the masses of beings. An adjunct to this is that, once one realizes that one is a Bodhisattva of the Earth, he or she realizes that we have assummed the appropriate karma in order to save those in our particular situation, relationships, and environment.”

Rightly so but 1) we aren’t really there to handle karma as it’s Nirvana 2) it’s not unique to Thiên Thai’s Teaching. It’s found amongst various Chan texts.

As the Lotus Sutra teaches in its most important chapter, Chapter 16, The Lifespan of the Tathagata, verse section:

The masses of beings see the kalpas exhausted,
When they are burned by the great fires;
This land of mine is peaceful and secure;
Gods and humans ever fill it. Gardens
and forests and various halls and pavilions,
With various types of jewels adorned; On the
jewelled trees many flowers and fruit, Wherein
the masses of beings take their pleasure
and rejoice. The gods strike the celestial drums,
Ever making instrumental music.
Raining mandara flowers. Scattering them
Over the Buddha and the great assemblies.
Though My Pure Land is not destroyed,
Yet the masses see it burned up,
Worrisome fears and agonizing sufferings
And such things all filling it up. These
beings of various sins, Because of the causes
and conditions of their evil karma, Though
they pass through asemkheyas of kalpas,
Do not hear the name of the Three Jewels.
Those who have performed merit,
Who are gentle and pliant, simple and upright,
Then all see my body.

I disagree that we aren't able to handle karma or the Three Poisons as it was, Nirvana.

There is a concept in Nagarjuna's, Tientai's, and Nichiren Buddhism of changing poison into medicine.

"Bodhisattva Nāgārjuna in his Treatise on the Great Perfection of Wisdom says, “[The Lotus Sutra is] like a great physician who can change poison into medicine.” This quotation occurs in a passage in Great Perfection of Wisdom that explains the virtues inherent in the character myō of the Lotus Sutra. The Great Teacher Miao-lo remarks, “Because it can cure what is thought to be incurable, it is called myō, or wonderful.”

In another writing of Nichiren, also quoting The Treatise on the Great Perfection of Wisdom state that, "if one’s illness is caused by fixed karma, even excellent medicine will turn to poison, but that, if one believes in the Lotus Sutra, poison will change into medicine.

Nichiren also quotes the great teacher Miao-le: "How can one seek the Land of Eternally Tranquil Light anywhere apart from Buddhagayā? This sahā world does not exist anywhere outside the Land of Eternally Tranquil Light.”

It really depends on one's enlightened or unenlightened perspective. Here are a few personal examples. When I used to get angry at this or that, after chanting Namu Myoho renge kyo for 15 minutes, I felt fantastic. I have a bunch of life threatening illnesses causing a lot of pain. Out of the 156 other patients in my particular situation where I live, I'm the only one working and despite my pain, weakness, and fatigue, thanks to Namu myoho renge kyo, Shakyamuni Buddha and Nichiren Daishonin, I see and experience this land as the Eternal Pure Land (most of the time). The reason is that, wherever the Lotus Sutra is practiced and preached, one experiences and turns their environment into The Buddha's Pure Land. This is the raison d'etre of Kosen Rufu (spreading the teachings of the Lotus Sutra). When billions of people believe in the Lotus Sutra and chant its title, then our personal sphere of Buddha Land will become a great ocean of Nirvana.

[illarraza]

The Great Teacher T’ien-t’ai’s Great Concentration and Insight reads, “Earthly desires are enlightenment; the sufferings of birth and death are nirvana.” Nichiren explains how this is one reason the Lotus Sutra is superior to all other sutras which deny earthly desires. Of course, with the caveat that our earthly desires are all for saving the masses of beings.

Just as an aside... we should understand desires as poison (ie. one of the three poisons) before we understand them as shunyata. Otherwise, there is a great danger of attachment and identification with them.

Not to be fliipant, whenever you manifest the desire to eat or drink and refuse to eat or drink because desires are poison, how long will it be before you die? Anyway, Nichiren's viewpoint is the following from his thesis, The Opening of the Eyes:

"Evil means “wicked.” Therefore we must know that only the engyo (perfect teaching) among the Four Teachings is correct. But it has two meanings. First, it means that following the “perfect teaching” (engyo) while rejecting the remaining three is correct, and rejecting the “perfect teaching” while following the three is erroneous. THIS IS A RELATIVE POINT OF VIEW (caps me).

"Secondly it means that attachment to the “perfect teaching” is considered erroneous while detachment from it is correct. This is an absolute point of view in which there is no difference in the eyes of the Buddha between the “perfect teaching” and the remaining three of the so-called Four Teachings. Either way, we have to stay away from error. It is bad to attach ourselves to the “perfect teaching,” how much worse it is to attach ourselves to the Three Teachings!” (The Opening of the Eyes).

Desires in and of themselves are not bad. It is ATTACHMENT to desires that is bad.

Mark

[illarraza]

The Great Teacher T’ien-t’ai’s Great Concentration and Insight reads, “Earthly desires are enlightenment; the sufferings of birth and death are nirvana.” Nichiren explains how this is one reason the Lotus Sutra is superior to all other sutras which deny earthly desires. Of course, with the caveat that our earthly desires are all for saving the masses of beings.

Just as an aside... we should understand desires as poison (ie. one of the three poisons) before we understand them as shunyata. Otherwise, there is a great danger of attachment and identification with them.

Scriptural proof that it is "attachment" to desires that should be eradicated, it is found in Chapter 3 of the Lotus Sutra which Nichiren cites as one of the "14 Slanders":

"...There are fourteen evil causes: (1) arrogance, (2) negligence, (3) wrong views of the self, (4) shallow understanding, (5) ATTACHMENT TO EARTHLY DESIRES, (6) not understanding, (7) not believing, (8) scowling with knitted brows, (9) harboring doubts, (10) slandering, (11) despising, (12) hating, (13) envying, and (14) bearing grudges.’” Since these fourteen slanders apply equally to priesthood and laity, you must be on guard against them.

Mark

[tkp67]

Nichiren teaches the following seeming contradiction from the Lotus.

“enjoy peace and security in their present existence.” + “Since hatred and jealousy toward this sutra abound even when the Thus Come One is in the world, how much more will this be so after his passing?”

When one has reached the stage of buddhahood in present form one enjoys peace and security while encountering hated and jealousy.

The precept of the diamond chalice is the precept that is impossible to break, like the diamond chalice. It is mentioned in the Brahmā Net Sutra, and Dengyō interprets the Buddha nature or the true aspect of all phenomena as the diamond chalice; this precept thus means to embrace the Lotus Sutra. In Nichiren Daishonin’s Buddhism, it means to embrace the Gohonzon.

You should tell them so and reproach them by citing the “Treasure Tower” chapter’s explanation of what “observing the precepts and practicing [the rules of discipline]”35 truly means. Then, pausing briefly, tell them that the five characters of Myoho-renge-kyo, the heart of the essential teaching of the Lotus Sutra, contain the benefit amassed through the countless practices and meritorious deeds of all Buddhas throughout the three existences. Then, how can these five characters not include the benefits obtained by observing all of the Buddhas’ precepts? Once the practitioner embraces this perfectly endowed wonderful precept, he cannot break it, even if he should try. It is therefore called the precept of the diamond chalice.36 Only by p.482observing this wonderful precept have the Buddhas of the three existences become Buddhas endowed with the three bodies—the Dharma body, the reward body, and the manifested body, which are each without beginning or end. The Great Teacher T’ien-t’ai wrote of this, “In the various teachings, he [the Buddha] kept this secret and did not transmit it.”37 Now in the Latter Day of the Law, any person—whether wise or ignorant, priest or lay believer, or of high or low position—who embraces Myoho-renge-kyo and practices it in accordance with the Buddha’s teaching, cannot fail to gain the fruit of Buddhahood. For precisely this reason, in reference to the votary of the Lotus Sutra in the impure and evil age after the Buddha’s passing, the sutra declares, “Such a person assuredly and without doubt will attain the Buddha way.”

https://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/wnd- ... 57#para-74

The Teaching, Practice, and Proof

[SilenceMonkey]

...

Yeah, I agree the issue is attachment. What I meant was that at first we should understand how desire is a poison, why it has so much power over our minds... (That’s why they call it the three poisons.) Then, the Mahayana training is to practice nonattachment with desire (ie. Seeing our desires and their objects as Shunyata).

You’re absolutely right about attachment. And learning to see the negative force of desire (why they call it poison) will help to recognize what is attachment and what is untainted by attachment. Learning to discern is very important. If we don’t have this wisdom, we start embracing our desires before we have the power of non-attachment