Response to PadmaVonSamba

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Minobu
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by Minobu »

Malcolm wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 4:02 pm
Minobu wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 3:45 pm
Malcolm wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 3:37 pm

I see, so you are refusing to apologize. Figures, since you also,just admitted to being sectarian. Fruit never falls far from the Shugden tree.
now who is being sectarian...

what are you saying now...what does that even mean what i underlined
and i did apologize ..obviously you did not read the whole post...

maybe you need also to look in the mirror..
I read your whole post. A lot of waffling around, declarations of contempt for all other Buddhist schools, but no apology.
Malcolm i don't want to argue with you..i said i apologize to you and Norwegian ....

i cannot help what i think ...only work on it...

you want me to grovel and put more shame on myself...

well here you go grovel grovel grovel...


It's my comment on the pure land stuff..it rubs you the wrong way...you get very angry and start saying stuff that is not nice...maybe cause deep down you know on this point i'm right....you have to hang on to that bit of Elysium...i understand...
take care

i'm done here ..
narhwal90
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by narhwal90 »

OK, I think we're done here. Locking thread.
narhwal90
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by narhwal90 »

Thread re-opened by request, please keep to the topic at hand. Thanks.
Jeff H
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by Jeff H »

Minobu wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 4:13 pm
Malcolm wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 4:02 pm
Minobu wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 3:45 pm
now who is being sectarian...

what are you saying now...what does that even mean what i underlined
and i did apologize ..obviously you did not read the whole post...

maybe you need also to look in the mirror..
I read your whole post. A lot of waffling around, declarations of contempt for all other Buddhist schools, but no apology.
Malcolm i don't want to argue with you..i said i apologize to you and Norwegian ....

i cannot help what i think ...only work on it...

you want me to grovel and put more shame on myself...

well here you go grovel grovel grovel...


It's my comment on the pure land stuff..it rubs you the wrong way...you get very angry and start saying stuff that is not nice...maybe cause deep down you know on this point i'm right....you have to hang on to that bit of Elysium...i understand...
take care

i'm done here ..
Minobu, I have thoroughly enjoyed this thread. I do not reexamine the basics as often as I feel I ought to. Your obstinance wrung some really remarkable lessons from some of the most erudite forum regulars. I am not saying this in sarcasm but in gratitude. You owe no one an apology and many of us less erudite practitioners owe you thanks.
We who are like children shrink from pain but love its causes. - Shantideva
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Caoimhghín
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by Caoimhghín »

Caoimhghín wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 9:14 amCLAIM 1
T1564.34c14 Madhyamakaśāstra
XXV -- Regarding Nirvāṇa

24:4 [...]
I got the roman numeral right and then stupidly misread it. All the citations that specify chapter 24 should specify chapter 25.
Caoimhghín wrote: Sat Jan 09, 2021 9:22 pmWhat idiot blasphemy. Go do some repentance, Minobu. This might be the most ridiculous thing you have ever said on the Internet. It is so stupid it is dangerous for you. You've just lit your head on fire and you've bought an ax and are determined to split it into seven pieces, just like a branch of the arjaka tree.
I oughtn't have lost my temper here. Not only is it unbecoming, but it is against the TOS to bring karma into things excessively. I could have corrected you without implying that misunderstanding Ven Nagarjuna leads to hell. Sorry.
Then, the monks sang this gāthā:

These bodies are like foam.
Them being frail, who can rejoice in them?
The Buddha attained the vajra-body.
Still, it becomes inconstant and rots.
The many Buddhas are vajra-entities.
All are also subject to inconstancy.
Quickly ended, like melting snow --
how could things be different?

The Buddha passed into parinirvāṇa afterward.
(T1.27b10 Mahāparinirvāṇasūtra DĀ 2)
Malcolm
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by Malcolm »

Caoimhghín wrote: Mon Jan 18, 2021 7:30 pm I could have corrected you without implying that misunderstanding Ven Nagarjuna leads to hell. Sorry.
But indeed, it is a kind of Buddhist hell to misunderstand Nāgārjuna...
"Nonduality is merely a name;
that name does not exist."
—Kotalipa
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Caoimhghín
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by Caoimhghín »

Either way, I'm not rightly the holder of a ministry of rebuke to say that. My rebuke does not come from the mind of an Arya, is not pure and outflow-free and motivated only by what is good for Minobu. It is also me being egotistical and making a silly show of rebuke. There are tons of other ways he could have been corrected. If me loosing my temper did any benefit, it was only incidentally here. Like when a careless driver hits another driver with his car but it ends up fixing a crick in the other drivers' back incidentally.

I'm also concerned about setting a precedent. It only takes a little bit to have everyone threatening hell against each other for various frivolous reasons related to personal disputes.
Then, the monks sang this gāthā:

These bodies are like foam.
Them being frail, who can rejoice in them?
The Buddha attained the vajra-body.
Still, it becomes inconstant and rots.
The many Buddhas are vajra-entities.
All are also subject to inconstancy.
Quickly ended, like melting snow --
how could things be different?

The Buddha passed into parinirvāṇa afterward.
(T1.27b10 Mahāparinirvāṇasūtra DĀ 2)
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FiveSkandhas
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by FiveSkandhas »


A soldier named Nobushige came to Hakuin, and asked: "Is there really a paradise and a hell?"

"Who are you?" inquired Hakuin.

"I am a samurai," the warrior replied.

"You, a soldier!" exclaimed Hakuin. "What kind of ruler would have you as his guard? Your face looks like that of a beggar."

Nobushige became so angry that he began to draw his sword, but Hakuin continued: "So you have a sword! Your weapon is probably much too dull to cut off my head."

As Nobushige drew his sword Hakuin remarked: "Here open the gates of hell!"

At these words the samurai, perceiving the master's discipline, sheathed his sword and bowed.

"Here open the gates of paradise," said Hakuin.
"One should cultivate contemplation in one’s foibles. The foibles are like fish, and contemplation is like fishing hooks. If there are no fish, then the fishing hooks have no use. The bigger the fish is, the better the result we will get. As long as the fishing hooks keep at it, all foibles will eventually be contained and controlled at will." -Zhiyi
Malcolm
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by Malcolm »

Caoimhghín wrote: Mon Jan 18, 2021 7:55 pm
I'm also concerned about setting a precedent. It only takes a little bit to have everyone threatening hell against each other for various frivolous reasons related to personal disputes.
You know what they say: Heaven for the climate, hell for the company.
"Nonduality is merely a name;
that name does not exist."
—Kotalipa
illarraza
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by illarraza »

Caoimhghín wrote: Mon Jan 18, 2021 7:55 pm Either way, I'm not rightly the holder of a ministry of rebuke to say that. My rebuke does not come from the mind of an Arya, is not pure and outflow-free and motivated only by what is good for Minobu. It is also me being egotistical and making a silly show of rebuke. There are tons of other ways he could have been corrected. If me loosing my temper did any benefit, it was only incidentally here. Like when a careless driver hits another driver with his car but it ends up fixing a crick in the other drivers' back incidentally.

I'm also concerned about setting a precedent. It only takes a little bit to have everyone threatening hell against each other for various frivolous reasons related to personal disputes.
Before predicting hell for another, one need know the causes for falling into hell and have a general idea of the various Buddhist hells:

https://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/wnd- ... lgHidden=1

Generally speaking, it is slandering one or all of the Three Treasures.
Malcolm
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by Malcolm »

illarraza wrote: Sat Feb 06, 2021 9:27 am
Before predicting hell for another, one need know the causes for falling into hell and have a general idea of the various Buddhist hells:

Mainly hatred and splitting the Sangha (reserved for bhikṣus like Devadatta). Then there is killing one's parents, killing an arhat, or injuring a buddha.
"Nonduality is merely a name;
that name does not exist."
—Kotalipa
illarraza
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by illarraza »

Malcolm wrote: Sat Feb 06, 2021 2:13 pm
illarraza wrote: Sat Feb 06, 2021 9:27 am
Before predicting hell for another, one need know the causes for falling into hell and have a general idea of the various Buddhist hells:

Mainly hatred and splitting the Sangha (reserved for bhikṣus like Devadatta). Then there is killing one's parents, killing an arhat, or injuring a buddha.
Or mere disbelief in the superiority of the Lotus Sutra.

Mark
illarraza
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Re: Response to PadmaVonSamba

Post by illarraza »

Malcolm wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 6:23 pm
illarraza wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 3:57 am One significant difference between the Lotus Sutra and provisional Buddhism is that not only the Dharmakaya of the Eternal Buddha has no beginning and no end but also the Saṃbhogakāya, and the Nirmāṇakāya. This is one aspect that makes the Lotus Sutra difficult to believe and difficult to understand.

Thus the Appearance, thus the Nature, and thus the Essence of the common mortal also has no beginning and no end. The provisional Buddhists say we have no self but despite the vast differences in body, nature (mind), and essence between newborn baby Johnnie and elderly nursing home resident Johnnie, no one can say that newborn baby Johnnie is NOT elderly nursing home resident Johnnie. Life and death and life and death Johnnie, despite his even more vast differences in body, nature, and essence from lifetime to lifetime has an aspect of individuation thanks to Johnnie's Karma that is still "Johnnie". Even were Johnnie an unrepentent slanderer of the Lotus Sutra and he becomes a snake in his next lifetime, he is still "Johnnie" but now he is "Johnnie" the snake.
Just a view of self that the Buddha rejected completely. Sad.
"But in these more than forty years, I have not yet revealed the truth." - Immeasurable Meanings Sutra

Mark
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