Malcolm wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 12:18 am
Crazywisdom wrote: ↑Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:32 pm
Malcolm wrote: ↑Mon Apr 12, 2021 7:50 pm
Sure it is. The Lanka states that tathāgatgarbha is the natural luminosity of the mind. What more does one need to know?
There is the nonmaterial appearance of wisdom.
That's beyond the scope of Karl B's talk.
I'm sorry I thought we were discussing tathatagarbha sutras. Remind me where he mentions the Madhyamaka contribution.
Remember the bit about the Buddhas appearing within lotuses withering instantly from Buddha's emanation of light?
If one wants to understand this it helps to rely on Lord Jigten Sumgon's Gongchig where he asserts the Buddha seeds the next wheel in the previous wheel. The TGS wheel lays out an introduction to something more clearly elucidated in the mantra wheel.
The Madhyamaka especially Nagarjuna, is a commentary on the Hinayana, later expositors on the Prajnaparamita. So in relation to TGS only help in removing a notion of a permanent self. Whereas, TGS present a new vision of an innate functional nonmaterial buddha within everyone.
The mantra wheel, especially Kalachakra, clarifies the Madhyamaka as relating with a material reality. So to understand the Tathatagarbha Sutras one must contend with the analogies. With due respect, Lankavatara is not, IMO, properly a TGS. It's sort of a collage and an asterix. At least, it does not stand for the principle of Tathatagarbha as say the Tathatagarbha Sutra.
Why this is important is a term like clear light is formless and static and easily confused with a notion like Atman. We do not need pages of refutations to understand the distinction Buddha realized which is that emptiness is form as in Heart Sutra and as innumerable manifestations as in TGS through mantra.
PS Those thread is in the Kagyu forum, not the Mahayana, Nyingma or Saiyan forum. At least Vajrayana is in issue here, if not the contributions of the Kagyu lineage, rather than slanted toward those prominent proponents of minority views.