Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Malcolm
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Malcolm »

treehuggingoctopus wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:56 pm The thing is, part of the DC is a cult
There, fixed it for you.
krodha
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by krodha »

Malcolm wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 11:10 pm
treehuggingoctopus wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:56 pm The thing is, part of the DC is a cult
There, fixed it for you.
It is rumored this general sentiment is shared by the aforementioned prodigal son.
PeterC
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by PeterC »

krodha wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 6:17 pm
Dorje Shedrub wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:02 pm Does anyone know why Yeshe would require a non-disclosure agreement? I don't understand this.
Perhaps he has been advised by counsel to try and conceal his statements and activities with the DC so that it does not have some sort of potentially negative effect on his professional life.

He’s always seemed to have a conflicted relationship with his father’s legacy and community.

He may find that much to his dismay, in some countries NDA’s aren’t all that enforceable.
If so, he needs better counsel. NDAs do not prevent disclosure, they just give you remedies after disclosure has happened, and those remedies are only useful if you’re willing and (financially) able to enforce them in court.

Im sure have all many times been instructed by a lama not to disclose teachings. But I personally have never been asked to sign something to that effect, and would be extremely suspicious of anyone that asked me to.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Dorje Shedrub »

Malcolm wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 8:40 pm
Kurp wrote: Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:18 pmMaybe Rinpoche saw how the community couldn’t collaborate well and he was okay with things dying out over time. 🤷🏼‍♀️
He actually said it would be like Buddha's original sangha of monks, which broke into eighteen divisions. And that division was foretold by a dream of King Kṛkin, during the time of Buddha Kāśyapa. Kṛkin had a dream where he saw eighteen men tugging on one sheet of cloth, but the Buddha Kāśyapa interpreted the dream for him, saying it represented the sangha of Buddha Śākyamuni splitting into eighteen divisions, but the cloth itself would remain whole.
Then maybe the DC will disappear but the lineage will continue through various means.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Virgo »

Dorje Shedrub wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:45 am
Then maybe the DC will disappear but the lineage will continue through various means.
Rinpoche used it as an analogy for the DC, but I think he was mainly focused on the splitting up part. I don't know how much he was thinking of the cloth remaining in tact, but maybe.

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Virgo »

Malcolm wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:09 pm
Now, there are certain natural limitations, like for example the one that says that one has to have a living teacher to enter secret mantra, and so on. That's one teacher has to measure up to certain qualifications to be a teacher. And the fact that these days, a perfect teacher is almost impossible to find.
Yes, fully agreed. :thumbsup:

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by PeterC »

tinylocusta wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 7:09 pm Moreover, He is a holder of long and short lineages and has a large number of qualities that make Him unique as a person and as a teacher. Specifically, He is one of very few people who can guide modern people in an authentic way, without mixing teachings with modern inventions or making anything up. He has very deep knowledge of tantras and various methods of practice, especially the three series of Dzogchen, but also Vajrayana. I won't elaborate more as everybody knows He doesn't like when one speaks of Him in this way and I want to respect that, but seriously, people need to realize how extremely lucky we are to have such a person alive, and how fantastic it is that He agreed to give the Direct Introduction to interested individuals and to continue this process in the future.
You should be aware that 'unique' refers to one example. Are you seriously asserting that none of the other lamas who are teaching Dzogchen regularly today - which would include the entire family of TUR, all the Dudjom Tersar people, the Bonpos, etc. - just don't measure up to Yeshi? You've studied with and experienced all of them?

We all know the importance of examining the teacher. You're the one who has initiated that discussion. So please offer support for the statements you are making.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by treehuggingoctopus »

krodha wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 11:48 pm
Malcolm wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 11:10 pm
treehuggingoctopus wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:56 pm The thing is, part of the DC is a cult
There, fixed it for you.
It is rumored this general sentiment is shared by the aforementioned prodigal son.
So it is. But I am afraid that while the prodigal son would share the general sentiment, he would violently disagree when it comes to the details.
PeterC wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:32 am
tinylocusta wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 7:09 pm Moreover, He is a holder of long and short lineages and has a large number of qualities that make Him unique as a person and as a teacher. Specifically, He is one of very few people who can guide modern people in an authentic way, without mixing teachings with modern inventions or making anything up. He has very deep knowledge of tantras and various methods of practice, especially the three series of Dzogchen, but also Vajrayana. I won't elaborate more as everybody knows He doesn't like when one speaks of Him in this way and I want to respect that, but seriously, people need to realize how extremely lucky we are to have such a person alive, and how fantastic it is that He agreed to give the Direct Introduction to interested individuals and to continue this process in the future.
You should be aware that 'unique' refers to one example. Are you seriously asserting that none of the other lamas who are teaching Dzogchen regularly today - which would include the entire family of TUR, all the Dudjom Tersar people, the Bonpos, etc. - just don't measure up to Yeshi? You've studied with and experienced all of them?
My point precisely.

Anyway, it is particularly interesting that Yeshi is said to be "one of very few people who can guide modern people in an authentic way, without mixing teachings with modern inventions or making anything up." Colour me vexed. Are we speaking of the same person who has denounced the Tibetan superstition and the medieval mentality, and who used to teach Dzogchen by lifting it out of its historical framework, and re-telling its main stories in the context of notions drawn from contemporary mathematics and physics?

To clarify: there certainly are people for whom teaching Dzogchen in the framework of vectors etc. is useful, and who are convinced that in this way they get the point (which previously, when presented differently, eluded them). I am certainly not one of them, but I also believe them, and do not dispute the value of such revisionings. But a revisioning it most definitely is, and a fairly radical one. If this is not "mixing teachings with modern inventions," I do not know what is.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Kelwin »

Malcolm wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 8:40 pm
Kurp wrote: Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:18 pmMaybe Rinpoche saw how the community couldn’t collaborate well and he was okay with things dying out over time. 🤷🏼‍♀️
He actually said it would be like Buddha's original sangha of monks, which broke into eighteen divisions. And that division was foretold by a dream of King Kṛkin, during the time of Buddha Kāśyapa. Kṛkin had a dream where he saw eighteen men tugging on one sheet of cloth, but the Buddha Kāśyapa interpreted the dream for him, saying it represented the sangha of Buddha Śākyamuni splitting into eighteen divisions, but the cloth itself would remain whole.
Isn't there a scene in 'My Reincarnation' where he mentions that after his death the community will fall apart and/or go different ways?
Lurking this thread made me remember him saying that.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by tinylocusta »

PeterC wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:32 am You're the one who has initiated that discussion. So please offer support for the statements you are making.
I'm sorry, I should be more clear. People have a general ideas that the main characteristic of Rinpoche was teaching Dzogchen, or maybe teaching it without asking to do Ngondro first. This is not really true as there are many other teachers that do both of these. The unique approach of Rinpoche that stems from His meeting with Changchub Dorje is the presentation of Dzogchen as a complete path. Other teachers have never done that. They were focused on preserving the totality of Buddha's teaching as presented in their tradition, starting with Vinaya (+presenting Tibetan "folklore", seeing it being destroyed and dying out). I have received various Dzogchen teachings from different teachers but they were always presented in the context of Vajrayana, especially the three inner tantras. The traditional explanation is that building up your visualization skills through Mahayoga, it makes it very easy to you to practice the instant transformation of Anuyoga as the mandalas appear clearly and with little effort. And through the practice of Anuyoga, it is easier to understand the meaning of self-perfection when you are introduced to it in Atiyoga. But we know it's not the only way. And Rinpoche was doing just that: presenting Dzogchen as an independent path that can be practiced together with others, but not as a requirement.

When I wrote "*one* of very few people who can guide *modern* people in an authentic way" I meant that He is not the only one, and that I specifically mean modern people, that is, not people like us. I've been practicing Mahayoga for decades, I feel joy when I think of Guru Padmasambhava and dakinis, I feel a strong connection with the Copper Mountain and deep satisfaction when doing my Kagye practice. But modern people are the opposite of that, they believe mostly in science. You probably have young friends etc. so probably you have some idea. Religion is blamed for everything and ridiculed (sometimes for good reasons). People don't feel connection with any deities, and especially for Westerners Hindu-style deities feel alien. Why would you insist on that if you know they can discover their nature through other methods? Of course if you believe that without visualizing deities there is no liberation, then there is no chance for them. But is it so?
Once after an initiation a teacher told us that Buddha was literally 7 times taller than humans and that scientists found traces confirming that. It was a large initiation and only Westerners were present (apart from that teacher's entourage). Of course you can make a huge effort to convince yourself it is true and be fine with the fact you deceive yourself but I doubt it would work for most people. You need to teach people the language they understand and can relate to. Do you think people in Oddiyana and India visualized Tibetan seed syllables, for example? That the lungs were given in Tibetan?

So the first unique aspect of Rinpoche was to present Dzogchen as an independent path. The second - related - was aiming not only at "spiritual people", but the general population. This was not the case in Tibet: Dzogchen was often closely guarded and not taught openly, given only after a long training etc. Giving it openly is a recent phenomenon. People realized what is essential and that they have very little time. Some other teachers also understood that. as it's evident from Kalu Rinpoche's famous words "Today people need to realize Mahamudra between the time they get back from work and turn on the TV." Many others don't.

Someone mentioned the concept of reincarnation. When you realize the nature of mind, you discover reincarnation doesn't exist, that you have never transmigrated. What you experience is a kind of shift of vision. I remember an article in The Mirror when Yeshi was trying to explain this to a journalist but they couldn't understand, they were so focused on the idea of reincarnation. In any case, this is clearly explained in various Dzogchen texts, including Longsal 4. It is the very reason why the phowa of dharmakaya exists and why it is superior to the nirmanakaya one.

Then there is the idea of "empowerments." It is a bit confusing because the same term dbang is used for different things in general Vajrayana and Dzogchen. In the Upadesha, 4 kinds of dbangs are taught so the number corresponds to tantric dbangs, but their nature is very different. And especially Rinpoche was focused on shin tu spros med and rab tu spros med as they correspond more to the current situation. In any case, right from the very beginning, what He was explaining was a difference between an initiation (= Vajrayana dbangs) and an introduction (ngo sprod) connected to the three kinds of transmission, and that an introduction may involve mor or less formal initiation but does not have to. Sometimes Rinpoche would combine direct introduction with don dbang. Very, very often He would do rab tu spros med especially in close situations. So I see no conflict here: you could say that dbangs are necessary in order to practice Dzogchen and I can say they are not, and we're both right depending on semantics. It's just like presenting Dzogchen like completion stage or even neutral tantra by some scholars - one can argue forever about these things without any side being convinced.

The third unique aspect of Rinpoche's teaching was going back to the roots. When I was receiving the Guhyagarbha the teacher jokingly said that he prefers to give terma initiations because the ones from the kama take so long (he was not just giving the initiation but was also precisely explaining each aspect). It's not because it was always so, but so many things have been added over centuries. Rinpoche would often mention the samatog as a symbol of how things used to be in the past in the context of Vajrayana. As for Dzogchen, the revival of the first two series today is mainly thanks to him. I'm not aware of many masters teaching Semde and Longde today.

Now, if I can allow myself to make a personal opinion. It seems to me that the problem of DC is only in some people's heads. For me not only it's not "dying" but the opposite: it's finally in the stage of maturing. You can no longer deceive yourself that you practice by going to retreats or listening webcast, you have no choice but to practice. Without the master being around, you have no choice but to finally become your own guide just like He was teaching use for 40 years. It is a wonderful time for practicing. If there are no obstacles, each year at least 300 new people will be able to join the Community and practice together, we can collaborate and exchange our energies. I understand some people are very pessimistic, but that's just a projection of their minds. When you read different namthars, normally after a master dies the students are upset but double their efforts and in the end gain the result. This is the end of personal opinion.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Giovanni »

Dorje Shedrub wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:45 am
Malcolm wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 8:40 pm
Kurp wrote: Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:18 pmMaybe Rinpoche saw how the community couldn’t collaborate well and he was okay with things dying out over time. 🤷🏼‍♀️
He actually said it would be like Buddha's original sangha of monks, which broke into eighteen divisions. And that division was foretold by a dream of King Kṛkin, during the time of Buddha Kāśyapa. Kṛkin had a dream where he saw eighteen men tugging on one sheet of cloth, but the Buddha Kāśyapa interpreted the dream for him, saying it represented the sangha of Buddha Śākyamuni splitting into eighteen divisions, but the cloth itself would remain whole.
Then maybe the DC will disappear but the lineage will continue through various means.
I think this is exactly what is happening and that it a good thing. The DC has become unfit for its purpose. But we need to stand back to see it clearly.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by dharmafootsteps »

tinylocusta wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:02 am
PeterC wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:32 am You're the one who has initiated that discussion. So please offer support for the statements you are making.
I'm sorry, I should be more clear...
tinylocusta, I’m interested to understand your perspective on Yeshi. I don’t have any experience of him from back when he was teaching in the community, other than a few old recordings, but I was in one of the meetings with him last year, and heard reports from people who were at the other. I have no ill will towards Yeshi at all, in fact I’m trying to show him the respect of taking him at his own word, and believing what he says rather than what someone else says about him, or my own projections of him.

Your posts about Yeshi seem incongruent with his own words about himself. Were you at either of the meetings last year? I presume you’ve taken teachings from him in the past and that’s what your opinion is mostly based on, or you have been a participant in his more recent workshops perhaps?
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by treehuggingoctopus »

tinylocusta wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:02 amThe unique approach of Rinpoche that stems from His meeting with Changchub Dorje is the presentation of Dzogchen as a complete path. Other teachers have never done that. They were focused on preserving the totality of Buddha's teaching as presented in their tradition, starting with Vinaya (+presenting Tibetan "folklore", seeing it being destroyed and dying out). I have received various Dzogchen teachings from different teachers but they were always presented in the context of Vajrayana, especially the three inner tantras.


I do not think that it is correct to say that Rinpoche presented Dzogchen as a complete self-contained path, fullstop. He taught it like this, true, but he also taught according to the traditional approach (in which the three inner tantras are inseparable), and indeed it is the traditional approach that is the framework of SMS. And Longsal, come to think of it.

Anyway, he was not the only teacher to teach Dzogchen as a separate complete path. Actually, Bonpo lamas do so much more consistently.
tinylocusta wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:02 amThe traditional explanation is that building up your visualization skills through Mahayoga, it makes it very easy to you to practice the instant transformation of Anuyoga as the mandalas appear clearly and with little effort. And through the practice of Anuyoga, it is easier to understand the meaning of self-perfection when you are introduced to it in Atiyoga. But we know it's not the only way.


I have yet to meet a Nyingma lama who would teach it this way. In my experience, all transformation in Nyingma is Anu, according to Rinpoche's terminology, even if they call it Maha.
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Malcolm
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Malcolm »

tinylocusta wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:02 amThe unique approach of Rinpoche that stems from His meeting with Changchub Dorje is the presentation of Dzogchen as a complete path.
False. This was not unique to Changchub Dorje, etc.
Other teachers have never done that. They were focused on preserving the totality of Buddha's teaching as presented in their tradition, starting with Vinaya (+presenting Tibetan "folklore", seeing it being destroyed and dying out). I have received various Dzogchen teachings from different teachers but they were always presented in the context of Vajrayana, especially the three inner tantras.
This was also ChNN’s approach. It’s unavoidable.
So the first unique aspect of Rinpoche was to present Dzogchen as an independent path.
False. Not unique to ChNN. This has been in Nyinthig teachings since the 12th century, and before.
The second - related - was aiming not only at "spiritual people", but the general population. This was not the case in Tibet: Dzogchen was often closely guarded and not taught openly, given only after a long training etc. Giving it openly is a recent phenomenon.
False, it was one of the most widespread and easily available teachings in Tibet. There are more manuals on Dzogchen than any other single teaching.
Someone mentioned the concept of reincarnation. When you realize the nature of mind, you discover reincarnation doesn't exist, that you have never transmigrated.
False. Many people have discovered the nature of their mind, and yet they still continue to take rebirth. Thus is why most dzogchen practitioners, as ChNN stated many times, awaken in the bardo of dharmata after their minds separate from their bodies. You should really properly educate yourself before you continue to make yourself look ignorant.
. So I see no conflict here: you could say that dbangs are necessary in order to practice Dzogchen and I can say they are not, and we're both right depending on semantics.
No, you would be wrong to say Dzogchen does not require empowerment, period.
The third unique aspect of Rinpoche's teaching was going back to the roots.
Not in the manner you imply.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by PeterC »

tinylocusta wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:02 am
PeterC wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:32 am You're the one who has initiated that discussion. So please offer support for the statements you are making.
I'm sorry, I should be more clear. People have a general ideas that the main characteristic of Rinpoche was teaching Dzogchen, or maybe teaching it without asking to do Ngondro first. This is not really true as there are many other teachers that do both of these. The unique approach of Rinpoche that stems from His meeting with Changchub Dorje is the presentation of Dzogchen as a complete path. Other teachers have never done that.
This is flat out wrong. You need to meet more teachers.

Also I asked you to back up your assertions about Yeshi. I note that you have not done so.
This is the end of personal opinion.
Thanks.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Malcolm »

dharmafootsteps wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:51 am I have no ill will towards Yeshi at all...
None of us do. We just want him to shit or get off the pot so the DC can get on with its life.
Your posts about Yeshi seem incongruent with his own words about himself.
Highly.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by dharmafootsteps »

Malcolm wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:53 pm
dharmafootsteps wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:51 am I have no ill will towards Yeshi at all...
None of us do. We just want him to shit or get off the pot so the DC can get on with its life.
Your posts about Yeshi seem incongruent with his own words about himself.
Highly.
Indeed, I don’t think anyone does either. There’s just been a few posts that seem to interpret not seeing Yeshi as a viable leader/teacher for the community as being hostile towards him. I’m just clarifying for those people. Some of us sat and listened to him explain at length that he’s not a teacher, why he’s not, why he has no interest in being one etc. For my part at least I’m simply taking him at his word.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Malcolm »

dharmafootsteps wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:07 pm There’s just been a few posts that seem to interpret not seeing Yeshi as a viable leader/teacher for the community as being hostile towards him.
It's the opposite. Yeshi has done nothing but express hostility towards the DC since his father's passing (and for several years prior), blaming people like the D'Angelo brothers for stealing his father from him, when it fact, it was his father's choice with whom he spent time. Rather than being angry at the students his father surrounded himself with and to whom he dedicated his life, Yeshe should direct his unhappiness at its true source. If he wants to left alone, the DC should leave him alone. But he should also get out of the way, and stop this unhealthy tango.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Malcolm »

treehuggingoctopus wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:16 pm I do not think that it is correct to say that Rinpoche presented Dzogchen as a complete self-contained path, fullstop.
If he did, he would have only presented trekcho and thogal, following empowerment. In fact, he mostly focused on trekcho, and only _very_ rarely did he teach thogal.

What ChNN understood, finally, from Changchub Dorje was the meaning of the teaching on the basis (gzhi) a.k.a the primordial state a.k.a the nature of one's own mind, in Dzogchen. That was the topic that had eluded ChNN in his previous studies and teachings he had received. If one does not understand the Dzogchen teaching on the basis, one cannot understand the Dzogchen path.

This is why he taught the way _all_ Nyingma teachers do, extensively teaching on gzhi khregs chod combined with anuyoga transformation practices until people are ready to practice the path, lhun grub thogal, which almost no one does seriously. In this respect he was very traditional. He also tried to explain to people that the unelaborate path of Dzogchen, of the Nyinthig teachings, the utterly secret unsurpassed cycle, was beyond the nine yānas, a fact stated in the seventeen tantras themselves as well as all major Nyinthig cycles, and countless commentaries. In fact, ChNN taught Dzogchen in an utterly traditional way, as anyone who has extensively studied the length and breadth of Dzogchen teachings knows, and has not fallen for the bullshit propaganda some people in DC repeatedly drone, which mainly derives from an incorrect understanding of the Kun byed rGyal po and other sems sde texts. ChNN repeatedly stated that sems sde concerned the teaching on the basis, and that in essence, it was about khregs chod. If one does not understand that basis, one can do Ati guru yoga and sing the SOV until the cows come home, but it isn't really Dzogchen practice. Authentic teachers of Dzogchen spend years emphasizing the teaching on the basis to their students until they get it right. ChNN was exactly that kind of teacher.
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by tinylocusta »

treehuggingoctopus wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:16 pm
tinylocusta wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:02 amThe traditional explanation is that building up your visualization skills through Mahayoga, it makes it very easy to you to practice the instant transformation of Anuyoga as the mandalas appear clearly and with little effort. And through the practice of Anuyoga, it is easier to understand the meaning of self-perfection when you are introduced to it in Atiyoga. But we know it's not the only way.


I have yet to meet a Nyingma lama who would teach it this way. In my experience, all transformation in Nyingma is Anu, according to Rinpoche's terminology, even if they call it Maha.
They seem quite distinct to me, even though they are not labelled as such. Whenever there is a mandala built gradually from the elements etc., you have Mahayoga. Some sadhanas even speak of "Mahamudra" at the end. When you have instant manifestation, usually it means Anuyoga.

As to the tradition of practicing the three inner tantras together, it is omnipresent in Nyingma. Yes, the Nyinghtigs exist, but they are always being practiced in the context of Vajrayana, and some of them have more Mahayoga than Anuyoga.

To give you an example, here's a fragment of Dudjom Rinpoche's and Beru Khyentse Rinpoche's commentary to Longchenpa's chos bzhi rin chen phreng ba:
The reason why a maha-yoga development stage must be conjoined with an anu- or ati-yoga practice is as follows. If you have not meditated to at least a certain extent on visualizing Guru Rinpoche or some other deity and reciting his mantra, you will have nothing upon which to base your practice of an anu-yoga completing stage. You will lack a context within which to meditate upon the energy-system and voidness. Likewise if you have not trained yourself with a development stage practice of deliberately visualizing a deity and reciting a mantra, you will have no background or basis enabling you in ati-yoga to experience everything spontaneously as a perfect mandala, deity and so forth. Thus the three inner tantras are not practiced separately. (p. 22)
As for Yeshi, I'd prefer not to speculate about Him or His intentions. What I wrote is based on my contact with Him earlier and more recently. My aim writing here was to ask people to reflect before using offensive words against Him. I had honestly thought these were accidental and that people would reflect and adjust their attitude. But it is obvious now that at least in some cases it was not intentional but done on purpose so basically all that I wrote was in vain. Or worse, maybe provoked even more slander. I prefer to follow the advice of my teachers and be careful about the consequences of my actions and I feel it will be better if I don't post here anymore because the result seem to be more negative than positive. Again, I'm very sorry if I gave rise to any negative emotions. We are all Vajra brothers and sisters, and I sincerely apologize to all of you.
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