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Kurp
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Questions

Post by Kurp »

The following thread / post inspired me to create my own today:

https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=36967

Jesse wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 8:27 pm Like many others have said, intellect or perceived intellect has nothing to do with ability to learn dharma. In fact it can get in the way. Those who over rely on intellect tend to be proud (guilty) (which is a hindrance), dharma relies on a sort of letting go, and intellect is a rigid monster that naturally tends to shun ideas like non-intellectual understanding.

There are many places you can learn technical terms, as many said finding a place in real life is a good idea. I learned most technical terms between this forum and a book by TNH. Which may or may not be suitable for beginners. It will give you information on much of the terminology though.

This is the one: https://plumvillage.org/books/understanding-our-mind/

Be aware though, different schools use different terms, and you should probably choose a school of Buddhism, and learn the basics before learning the complicated stuff.

I’m posting under the Dzogchen forum because I will be using dzogchen terminology mostly.

Here are some question that, as someone who still doesn’t “get it” yet after many years, has on their mind. Maybe asking these questions could help others out, too.

Note: A senior practitioner looked over my questions and said they were okay to ask on a public forum.

1. Is there a difference between “compassion” and “bodhicitta?” If so, please define each term.

2. Is it rare for a being to realize / recognize their Buddha nature (i.e. primordial state)? Or does the rarity lie more so within trying to stabilize it?

3. When you are acting within your primordial state, do all concepts go out the window— even concepts like bodhicitta?

4. Why would some beings not want you to realize your own primordial state by creating obstacles for you? Or are these obstacles just a projection of one’s own mind that is resisting an ego death?

5. Is it even possible for a being who has realized their own primordial state to wish for you to not realize your own primordial state?

6. Can only Buddhists realize their primordial state? If not, then what is the underlying “thing” that causes non-Buddhists to realize their primordial state as well?

7. On that note, please define each term: rigpa, primordial state, emptiness, (lineage) transmission, ego death, and contemplation.

8. What would cause transmission not to “take” for an individual?

9. Can recreational drugs cause you to realize your primordial state and/or emptiness?

10. Are experiences less “reliable” or “legitimate” from drug induced states than from meditative practices?

11. Can siddhis be “activated” from recreational drug use, or even sex?

12. If you don’t have siddhis, does that mean you are doing something “wrong” with your practice or just in your life in general?

13. What is the difference between rainbow body and the great transference into rainbow body?

14. Are those who obtain rainbow body completely omniscient?

15. Are reincarnated masters and teachers completely aware and remember everything when they are born into the world? Or do they have to forget and then remember everything all over again at a certain time in order to better help beings?

16. Let’s end this one a fun one! Because I just got done watching THE CHILLING ADVENTURES OF SABRINA, I have to ask this whacky “dualistic” themed question: Let’s say for a moment that Satan is a real being, as is the Christian God. Would it be safe to assume that both beings, not just God, have realized their primordial state, but they just lean more towards one end of the duality spectrum? My underlying question therewithin: is it safe to assume that realizing your primordial state means that you have fully integrated everything, and you no longer lean to one side or the other of any type of duality? Or does being nondualistic ALSO mean that you can STILL have duality and be “God” or “Satan,” etc.? OOoooorrrrrr… are God and Satan not truly enlightened beings, but rather just some alien devas / asuras and, sadly, haven’t realized their primordial nature and just cause lots of wars and stuff because of it?


That’s all I can think of at the moment. Thanks.
Danny
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Re: Questions

Post by Danny »

Kurp wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 5:16 pm
Note: A senior practitioner looked over my questions and said they were okay to ask on a public forum.
I think this is all that stuck out to me.
Anyway good luck 🍀
avatamsaka3
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Re: Questions

Post by avatamsaka3 »

I'm not a practitioner or scholar of Dzogchen. But, I may have something to add in reply to these questions. So, here goes nothing. Feel free to ignore these if you're looking for replies from your tradition only.
1. Is there a difference between “compassion” and “bodhicitta?” If so, please define each term.
This seems like it's mainly a semantic issue. There are tons of places where you could find an adequate definition of bodhicitta. Compassion can be defined in different specific ways, and it can mean different things depending on the practitioner, their inclinations, etc.
2. Is it rare for a being to realize / recognize their Buddha nature (i.e. primordial state)? Or does the rarity lie more so within trying to stabilize it?
It seems there are going to be different levels of recognizing it. When Person X realizes they can make changes to not continue being a jerk, then this could be some kind of recognition. It's not a full blown thing, but it counts in some way.
4. Why would some beings not want you to realize your own primordial state by creating obstacles for you? Or are these obstacles just a projection of one’s own mind that is resisting an ego death?
Defilements.
5. Is it even possible for a being who has realized their own primordial state to wish for you to not realize your own primordial state?
People can wish whatever they want. So what.
6. Can only Buddhists realize their primordial state? If not, then what is the underlying “thing” that causes non-Buddhists to realize their primordial state as well?
Process, not a thing. And what is a "Buddhist"?
7. On that note, please define each term: rigpa, primordial state, emptiness, (lineage) transmission, ego death, and contemplation.
:rolling:
12. If you don’t have siddhis, does that mean you are doing something “wrong” with your practice or just in your life in general?
No and no. Power is something to be careful about.
16. Let’s end this one a fun one! Because I just got done watching THE CHILLING ADVENTURES OF SABRINA, I have to ask this whacky “dualistic” themed question: Let’s say for a moment that Satan is a real being, as is the Christian God. Would it be safe to assume that both beings, not just God, have realized their primordial state, but they just lean more towards one end of the duality spectrum? My underlying question therewithin: is it safe to assume that realizing your primordial state means that you have fully integrated everything, and you no longer lean to one side or the other of any type of duality? Or does being nondualistic ALSO mean that you can STILL have duality and be “God” or “Satan,” etc.? OOoooorrrrrr… are God and Satan not truly enlightened beings, but rather just some alien devas / asuras and, sadly, haven’t realized their primordial nature and just cause lots of wars and stuff because of it?
It's not possible to answer this as there are too many aspects of the Christian God that violate Buddhist teachings.
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Johnny Dangerous
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Re: Questions

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

I'll do my best for the heck of it, butI could be off on any of these. It's best to get definitive answers from a Dzogchen teacher or subject matter expert.

1. Is there a difference between “compassion” and “bodhicitta?” If so, please define each term.
Compassion is the wish that others be free from suffering and the causes of suffering, Bodhicitta is the wish to attain enlightenment for all sentient beings, but is a very layered term in Buddhism and should be studied specifically in a Dzogchen context if that is your interest, preferably with the help of a structured lineage(s), teacher)s), etc.
2. Is it rare for a being to realize / recognize their Buddha nature (i.e. primordial state)? Or does the rarity lie more so within trying to stabilize it?
Probably rare on the larger level, because the number of people practicing Dharma is reasonably small in terms of "all beings", and even smaller for Dzogchen.
3. When you are acting within your primordial state, do all concepts go out the window— even concepts like bodhicitta?
They are just expressions or play of the primordial state.
4. Why would some beings not want you to realize your own primordial state by creating obstacles for you? Or are these obstacles just a projection of one’s own mind that is resisting an ego death?
No idea, and ego death is not a Buddhist or Dzogchen term that I have ever heard.
5. Is it even possible for a being who has realized their own primordial state to wish for you to not realize your own primordial state?
Pretty sure the answer is no, see Bodhicitta of the Mahayana variety, which is a prerequisite for Dzogchen.
6. Can only Buddhists realize their primordial state? If not, then what is the underlying “thing” that causes non-Buddhists to realize their primordial state as well?
According to Buddhism, probably yes, so no need to answer the second bit.
7. On that note, please define each term: rigpa, primordial state, emptiness, (lineage) transmission, ego death, and contemplation.
As far as I know rigpa is synonymous with "primordial state", emptiness is shunyata at the level of the Mahayana teachings and describes the lack of inherent existence of phenomena, ego death is not a Buddhist term, and sounds like something from online neo-advaita. Contemplation is the practice of stabilizing, removing doubt around, and resting in the primordial state.
8. What would cause transmission not to “take” for an individual?
Obscurations and obstacles of body, speech and mind I suspect.
9. Can recreational drugs cause you to realize your primordial state and/or emptiness?
I imagine some teachers could use them to point it out to a student, but no, the drug does nothing special.
10. Are experiences less “reliable” or “legitimate” from drug induced states than from meditative practices?
Probably depends entirely on context, but if one is using drugs all the time then I imagine the "stabilizing" part of practice will likely be out of reach.
11. Can siddhis be “activated” from recreational drug use, or even sex?
Just from those things? C'mon man...the answer is pretty self evident, no.
12. If you don’t have siddhis, does that mean you are doing something “wrong” with your practice or just in your life in general?
From sex and drugs? It just means you are doing drugs and screwing.

16. Let’s end this one a fun one! Because I just got done watching THE CHILLING ADVENTURES OF SABRINA, I have to ask this whacky “dualistic” themed question: Let’s say for a moment that Satan is a real being, as is the Christian God. Would it be safe to assume that both beings, not just God, have realized their primordial state, but they just lean more towards one end of the duality spectrum? My underlying question therewithin: is it safe to assume that realizing your primordial state means that you have fully integrated everything, and you no longer lean to one side or the other of any type of duality? Or does being nondualistic ALSO mean that you can STILL have duality and be “God” or “Satan,” etc.? OOoooorrrrrr… are God and Satan not truly enlightened beings, but rather just some alien devas / asuras and, sadly, haven’t realized their primordial nature and just cause lots of wars and stuff because of it?
This is so outside the context and worldview of Dzogchen it is impossible to answer I think.
Don’t you see what’s wrong with the world today? Oh Everybody wants somebody to be their own piece of clay.

-Marvin Gaye
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Kurp
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Re: Questions

Post by Kurp »

Johnny Dangerous wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 2:00 am I'll do my best for the heck of it, butI could be off on any of these. It's best to get definitive answers from a Dzogchen teacher or subject matter expert.

1. Is there a difference between “compassion” and “bodhicitta?” If so, please define each term.
Compassion is the wish that others be free from suffering and the causes of suffering, Bodhicitta is the wish to attain enlightenment for all sentient beings, but is a very layered term in Buddhism and should be studied specifically in a Dzogchen context if that is your interest, preferably with the help of a structured lineage(s), teacher)s), etc.
2. Is it rare for a being to realize / recognize their Buddha nature (i.e. primordial state)? Or does the rarity lie more so within trying to stabilize it?
Probably rare on the larger level, because the number of people practicing Dharma is reasonably small in terms of "all beings", and even smaller for Dzogchen.
3. When you are acting within your primordial state, do all concepts go out the window— even concepts like bodhicitta?
They are just expressions or play of the primordial state.
4. Why would some beings not want you to realize your own primordial state by creating obstacles for you? Or are these obstacles just a projection of one’s own mind that is resisting an ego death?
No idea, and ego death is not a Buddhist or Dzogchen term that I have ever heard.
5. Is it even possible for a being who has realized their own primordial state to wish for you to not realize your own primordial state?
Pretty sure the answer is no, see Bodhicitta of the Mahayana variety, which is a prerequisite for Dzogchen.
6. Can only Buddhists realize their primordial state? If not, then what is the underlying “thing” that causes non-Buddhists to realize their primordial state as well?
According to Buddhism, probably yes, so no need to answer the second bit.
7. On that note, please define each term: rigpa, primordial state, emptiness, (lineage) transmission, ego death, and contemplation.
As far as I know rigpa is synonymous with "primordial state", emptiness is shunyata at the level of the Mahayana teachings and describes the lack of inherent existence of phenomena, ego death is not a Buddhist term, and sounds like something from online neo-advaita. Contemplation is the practice of stabilizing, removing doubt around, and resting in the primordial state.
8. What would cause transmission not to “take” for an individual?
Obscurations and obstacles of body, speech and mind I suspect.
9. Can recreational drugs cause you to realize your primordial state and/or emptiness?
I imagine some teachers could use them to point it out to a student, but no, the drug does nothing special.
10. Are experiences less “reliable” or “legitimate” from drug induced states than from meditative practices?
Probably depends entirely on context, but if one is using drugs all the time then I imagine the "stabilizing" part of practice will likely be out of reach.
11. Can siddhis be “activated” from recreational drug use, or even sex?
Just from those things? C'mon man...the answer is pretty self evident, no.
12. If you don’t have siddhis, does that mean you are doing something “wrong” with your practice or just in your life in general?
From sex and drugs? It just means you are doing drugs and screwing.

16. Let’s end this one a fun one! Because I just got done watching THE CHILLING ADVENTURES OF SABRINA, I have to ask this whacky “dualistic” themed question: Let’s say for a moment that Satan is a real being, as is the Christian God. Would it be safe to assume that both beings, not just God, have realized their primordial state, but they just lean more towards one end of the duality spectrum? My underlying question therewithin: is it safe to assume that realizing your primordial state means that you have fully integrated everything, and you no longer lean to one side or the other of any type of duality? Or does being nondualistic ALSO mean that you can STILL have duality and be “God” or “Satan,” etc.? OOoooorrrrrr… are God and Satan not truly enlightened beings, but rather just some alien devas / asuras and, sadly, haven’t realized their primordial nature and just cause lots of wars and stuff because of it?
This is so outside the context and worldview of Dzogchen it is impossible to answer I think.
Thank you. You get a cookie. 🍪 👏🏻

Bonus cookie for you for one more answered question:
4. Why would some beings not want you to realize your own primordial state by creating obstacles for you? Or are these obstacles just a projection of one’s own mind that is resisting an ego death?
No idea, and ego death is not a Buddhist or Dzogchen term that I have ever heard.
What benefit would other beings get from preventing someone from trying to realize their primordial state? Why don’t they just focus their energy into realizing their own Buddha nature? Do they not want to be liberated? Do they like samsara a lot? Can’t give up the Taylor Swift music and Cheetos and rather play on Twitter all day? What gives?
Last edited by Kurp on Thu Jul 08, 2021 2:24 am, edited 2 times in total.
cjdevries
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Re: Questions

Post by cjdevries »

Compassion is sympathy for the suffering of others and the desire to free them from it. It's more than loving kindness, because beyond being kind to a person, there is an additional wish to be able to alleviate their suffering in a concrete way. From what I understand, there is an active element in compassion that makes it different from basic kindness or respect toward others.

Bodhicitta can be defined as the mind that is open, generous and caring for others and not obstructed by self-consciousness or embarrassment or anger and craving.
"Please call me by my true names so I can wake up; so the door of my heart can be left open: the door of compassion." -Thich Nhat Hanh

"Ask: what's needed of you" -Akong Rinpoche

"Love never claims, it ever gives. Love ever suffers, never resents, never revenges itself." -Gandhi
climb-up
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Re: Questions

Post by climb-up »

Kurp wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 5:16 pm
16. Let’s end this one a fun one! Because I just got done watching THE CHILLING ADVENTURES OF SABRINA, I have to ask this whacky “dualistic” themed question: Let’s say for a moment that Satan is a real being, as is the Christian God. Would it be safe to assume that both beings, not just God, have realized their primordial state, but they just lean more towards one end of the duality spectrum? My underlying question therewithin: is it safe to assume that realizing your primordial state means that you have fully integrated everything, and you no longer lean to one side or the other of any type of duality? Or does being nondualistic ALSO mean that you can STILL have duality and be “God” or “Satan,” etc.? OOoooorrrrrr… are God and Satan not truly enlightened beings, but rather just some alien devas / asuras and, sadly, haven’t realized their primordial nature and just cause lots of wars and stuff because of it?
That’s a lot of questions, some of which are asking a lot (eg “please define….” There are books and long teachings explains these, kind of hard to do on an online message board!)

But, since I liked Chilling adventures of Sabrina (season 1. Season 2 was alright till the end and I haven’t seen season 3):

No, it would not be safe to assume that both God and the Devil have recognized the primordial state.
You could it interpret it that they are, but you could also interpret it that they are simply God-realm beings (maybe
one god-realm and Asura?) who are playing at being ultimate entities (in the same way that Brahma is considered to be a god-realm being who either pretends to created the universe, or perhaps even thinks that he did).

It’s not enough to assume that they do exist, you would have to decide in what sense they exist. Since they are not part of traditional Buddhist teachings you would have to make an argument for any interpretation you give (or ask a fully enlightened being, or become one yourself).
Christianity being so very multifaceted in beliefs, practices and interpretations (not even counting all of the not-strictly-Christian esoteric interpretations of Christian mythology) that you’d have to narrow it down quite a bit.

It’s been a while but, unless something really changed in season 3, the Devil in the Chilling Adventures of Sabrina was not particularly wise, enlightened
PeterC
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Re: Questions

Post by PeterC »

Kurp wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 5:16 pm 1. Is there a difference between “compassion” and “bodhicitta?” If so, please define each term.
"Compassion" is a very inadequate translation of "bodhicitta". But your premise here is wrong. There's no point in trying to figure this out by defining words, because even if you knew the definition, so what? There are very extensive practices intended to cultivate the mind of enlightenment: that's what you should be doing.
Malcolm
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Re: Questions

Post by Malcolm »

Kurp wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 5:16 pm
9. Can recreational drugs cause you to realize your primordial state and/or emptiness?
No.
10. Are experiences less “reliable” or “legitimate” from drug induced states than from meditative practices?
Yes.
11. Can siddhis be “activated” from recreational drug use, or even sex?
No.
12. If you don’t have siddhis, does that mean you are doing something “wrong” with your practice or just in your life in general?
Probably.
My underlying question therewithin: is it safe to assume that realizing your primordial state means that you have fully integrated everything, and you no longer lean to one side or the other of any type of duality?
That depends on what you mean by "realization," which is very broad and ambiguous term.

Your other questions should learned at the feet of a teacher.
"Death stands before all who are born."
— Ācārya Aśvaghoṣa
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Kurp
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Re: Questions

Post by Kurp »

Malcolm wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 3:55 pm
Kurp wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 5:16 pm
9. Can recreational drugs cause you to realize your primordial state and/or emptiness?
No.
10. Are experiences less “reliable” or “legitimate” from drug induced states than from meditative practices?
Yes.
11. Can siddhis be “activated” from recreational drug use, or even sex?
No.
12. If you don’t have siddhis, does that mean you are doing something “wrong” with your practice or just in your life in general?
Probably.
My underlying question therewithin: is it safe to assume that realizing your primordial state means that you have fully integrated everything, and you no longer lean to one side or the other of any type of duality?
That depends on what you mean by "realization," which is very broad and ambiguous term.
Thanks for the responses. Much appreciated.
Your other questions should learned at the feet of a teacher.
Aren’t you a teacher? :hi:
Malcolm
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Re: Questions

Post by Malcolm »

Kurp wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 4:37 pm
Your other questions should learned at the feet of a teacher.
Aren’t you a teacher? :hi:
Yes, but not here.
"Death stands before all who are born."
— Ācārya Aśvaghoṣa
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