Dzogchen in Germany

Donny
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Dzogchen in Germany

Post by Donny »

Can anyone recommend trustworthy Dzogchen related teachers or sanghas in Germany?

:namaste:
"To the sharp weapons of the demons, you offered delicate flowers in return. When the enraged Devadatta pushed down a boulder to kill you, you practiced silence. Son of the Sakyas, incapable of casting even an angry glance at your enemy, what intelligent person would honor you as a friend for protection from the great enemy, fearful samsara?"
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philji
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

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Karma_Yeshe
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

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lelopa
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by lelopa »

Karma_Yeshe wrote: Sat Oct 24, 2020 3:59 pm https://yeshekhorlo.de/
:shock:
they translate Dzogchen as "Große Vollendung"
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Lingpupa
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by Lingpupa »

lelopa wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:26 am
Karma_Yeshe wrote: Sat Oct 24, 2020 3:59 pm https://yeshekhorlo.de/
:shock:
they translate Dzogchen as "Große Vollendung"
If I avoid using any preference of my own (which I don't really have), and pretend I have no background in Buddhism, a plain translation of that into English would be "great completion". That may not be your favourite, but it's reasonably common. Do you see a problem with it?
All best wishes

"The profundity of your devotion to your lama is not measured by your ability to turn a blind eye."
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lelopa
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by lelopa »

Lingpupa wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:39 am
lelopa wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:26 am
Karma_Yeshe wrote: Sat Oct 24, 2020 3:59 pm https://yeshekhorlo.de/
:shock:
they translate Dzogchen as "Große Vollendung"
If I avoid using any preference of my own (which I don't really have), and pretend I have no background in Buddhism, a plain translation of that into English would be "great completion". That may not be your favourite, but it's reasonably common. Do you see a problem with it?
[Maybe problem is not the right word]

What is the Small Completion then?!?
Sometimes in higher teachings chenpo (maha) is better translated as total - and there is nothing to complete it is perfect right from the beginning.
So "Total Completeness" seems a better hint - or "Absolute Completeness"
in german: "Totale Vollkommenheit"

Sincerely yours,
Ngakpa Nitpicker
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Karma_Yeshe
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by Karma_Yeshe »

I think it comes from translating "Dzogrim" as "Vollendungsstufe" and Kyerim as "Erzeugungsstufe". So "Dzog" is translated as "Vollendung", thus Dzogchen (Santi Maha) is translated as "Grosse Vollendung". Since "Maha" means "great", I think "Grosse Vollendung" is not that bad.
"Totale Vollkommenheit" could be critisised as leading to an understanding of "oneness" because of using "totale". I therefore prefer "grosse" over "totale". But this is really not that important. Important is that Gangteng Tulku is an authentic master who is transmitting Dzogchen teachings.

KY

P.S.: It is really a shame that there is no serious troll-free Board where it is possible to discuss such matters in german.
Donny
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by Donny »

Thanks a lot for the great tips! Gomde was already on my list. And I even attend a program Gagngten Tulku many years a ago, but i didn't have much undestanding about Tibetan Buddhism then. Great to see that his Sangha is this active in Germany.

:namaste:
"To the sharp weapons of the demons, you offered delicate flowers in return. When the enraged Devadatta pushed down a boulder to kill you, you practiced silence. Son of the Sakyas, incapable of casting even an angry glance at your enemy, what intelligent person would honor you as a friend for protection from the great enemy, fearful samsara?"
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by Lingpupa »

lelopa wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:53 am What is the Small Completion then?!?
Dzogchung. Obvs. :tongue:
All best wishes

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lelopa
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by lelopa »

Karma_Yeshe wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 8:47 am
...........

P.S.: It is really a shame that there is no serious troll-free Board where it is possible to discuss such matters in german.
Oh yes!
:cheers:
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lelopa
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by lelopa »

Lingpupa wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 10:41 am
lelopa wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:53 am What is the Small Completion then?!?
Dzogchung. Obvs. :tongue:
Total Rightness
;)
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Ayu
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by Ayu »

Karma_Yeshe wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 8:47 am ...

P.S.: It is really a shame that there is no serious troll-free Board where it is possible to discuss such matters in german.
The Tibetan-Buddhists-only group on Buddhaland.de is troll-free. But it isn't public either.

To me it seems, Germans just don't have that much Dzogchen human resources like e.g. Americans.
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lelopa
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by lelopa »

Ayu wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 1:48 pm
Karma_Yeshe wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 8:47 am ...

P.S.: It is really a shame that there is no serious troll-free Board where it is possible to discuss such matters in german.
The Tibetan-Buddhists-only group on Buddhaland.de is troll-free. But it isn't public either.

To me it seems, Germans just don't have that much Dzogchen human resources like e.g. Americans.
The answers you could get in the tibetan forum in buddhaland are 80% odd, weird & strange
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Ayu
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by Ayu »

lelopa wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:47 pm
Ayu wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 1:48 pm
Karma_Yeshe wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 8:47 am ...

P.S.: It is really a shame that there is no serious troll-free Board where it is possible to discuss such matters in german.
The Tibetan-Buddhists-only group on Buddhaland.de is troll-free. But it isn't public either.

To me it seems, Germans just don't have that much Dzogchen human resources like e.g. Americans.
The answers you could get in the tibetan forum in buddhaland are 80% odd, weird & strange
This was the case for long years. But some time ago the moderation changed, other people and one Tibetan buddhist as moderator who managed to structure the dos and don'ts. He keeps the place clean now.
But more conversation takes place in the "geschlossene Gruppe für tibetisch Praktizierende" there. Anyhow there are only very few Dzogchen connoisseurs.
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lelopa
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by lelopa »

Ayu wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 5:29 pm
lelopa wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:47 pm
Ayu wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 1:48 pm
The Tibetan-Buddhists-only group on Buddhaland.de is troll-free. But it isn't public either.

To me it seems, Germans just don't have that much Dzogchen human resources like e.g. Americans.
The answers you could get in the tibetan forum in buddhaland are 80% odd, weird & strange
This was the case for long years. But some time ago the moderation changed, other people and one Tibetan buddhist as moderator who managed to structure the dos and don'ts. He keeps the place clean now.
But more conversation takes place in the "geschlossene Gruppe für tibetisch Praktizierende" there. Anyhow there are only very few Dzogchen connoisseurs.

Ok,
:thanks:

I don't know the recent closed group, but once in a year I take a look what's new since they banned the worst users -
but can't find much "lions roar"
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TRoeder
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by TRoeder »

Hey.

James Low (simplybeing.co.uk) is not Germany based, but he usually visits at least 4 or 5 times a year (or used to - pre-corona), p.e. in Freiburg, Berlin, Frankfurt, Kamalashila (Eifel) and is highly recommended.

He gives free zoom sessions every now and then - some with german translation. Check out his website. There are some loose practice groups as far as I know (Berlin, Cologne).

LG T
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Tendzin Mingyur
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by Tendzin Mingyur »

lelopa wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:26 am
Karma_Yeshe wrote: Sat Oct 24, 2020 3:59 pm https://yeshekhorlo.de/
:shock:
they translate Dzogchen as "Große Vollendung"
Berzin translates it the same way https://studybuddhism.com/de/tibetische ... t-dzogchen

The point here is not the translation, but what teachings are given. At least in my humble opinion. Gangteng Tulku Rinpoche offers Dzogchen teachings coming from the Pema Lingpa lineage. He will teach students everything from Khorde Ruzhen, Thregchöd, Thögal and Bardo, after you finished a good amount of Ngöndro (min. 10%). And he will give these teachings on a regular basis in closed retreats. If you are interested in Maha- or Anuyoga practices like Tsalung, Thrulkhor, Tummo or other things these are also given. This year he gave teachings on what Padmakara translates as 'Finding Rest in Illusion', which is one famous text of Longchenpa (due to corona it was an online teaching). We also invited Khenchen Pema Sherab, who is the teacher of our resident lama in Europe to give lungs for the 17 Dzogchen tantras and other teachings. At the moment our European resident lama Khenpo Karma Wangyal is giving a teaching cycle via zoom on Jigme Lingpa's Yönten Dzö.

We don't do much advertisement, because our group is small and we all have jobs, but it exists for over 24 years now.
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lelopa
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by lelopa »

Tendzin Mingyur wrote: Tue Jul 27, 2021 11:10 pm
lelopa wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:26 am
Karma_Yeshe wrote: Sat Oct 24, 2020 3:59 pm https://yeshekhorlo.de/
:shock:
they translate Dzogchen as "Große Vollendung"
Berzin translates it the same way https://studybuddhism.com/de/tibetische ... t-dzogchen

The point here is not the translation, but what teachings are given. At least in my humble opinion. Gangteng Tulku Rinpoche offers Dzogchen teachings coming from the Pema Lingpa lineage. He will teach students everything from Khorde Ruzhen, Thregchöd, Thögal and Bardo, after you finished a good amount of Ngöndro (min. 10%). And he will give these teachings on a regular basis in closed retreats. If you are interested in Maha- or Anuyoga practices like Tsalung, Thrulkhor, Tummo or other things these are also given. This year he gave teachings on what Padmakara translates as 'Finding Rest in Illusion', which is one famous text of Longchenpa (due to corona it was an online teaching). We also invited Khenchen Pema Sherab, who is the teacher of our resident lama in Europe to give lungs for the 17 Dzogchen tantras and other teachings. At the moment our European resident lama Khenpo Karma Wangyal is giving a teaching cycle via zoom on Jigme Lingpa's Yönten Dzö.

We don't do much advertisement, because our group is small and we all have jobs, but it exists for over 24 years now.
Berzin is not the number 1 lotsawa of my choice
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PeterC
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by PeterC »

Might not be what the OP is looking for but: the Shenten guys have a sangha in Germany, if Bon Dzogchen is an option, they are definitely worth looking at.
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Tendzin Mingyur
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Re: Dzogchen in Germany

Post by Tendzin Mingyur »

lelopa wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 6:35 am
Tendzin Mingyur wrote: Tue Jul 27, 2021 11:10 pm
lelopa wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:26 am

:shock:
they translate Dzogchen as "Große Vollendung"
Berzin translates it the same way https://studybuddhism.com/de/tibetische ... t-dzogchen

The point here is not the translation, but what teachings are given. At least in my humble opinion. Gangteng Tulku Rinpoche offers Dzogchen teachings coming from the Pema Lingpa lineage. He will teach students everything from Khorde Ruzhen, Thregchöd, Thögal and Bardo, after you finished a good amount of Ngöndro (min. 10%). And he will give these teachings on a regular basis in closed retreats. If you are interested in Maha- or Anuyoga practices like Tsalung, Thrulkhor, Tummo or other things these are also given. This year he gave teachings on what Padmakara translates as 'Finding Rest in Illusion', which is one famous text of Longchenpa (due to corona it was an online teaching). We also invited Khenchen Pema Sherab, who is the teacher of our resident lama in Europe to give lungs for the 17 Dzogchen tantras and other teachings. At the moment our European resident lama Khenpo Karma Wangyal is giving a teaching cycle via zoom on Jigme Lingpa's Yönten Dzö.

We don't do much advertisement, because our group is small and we all have jobs, but it exists for over 24 years now.
Berzin is not the number 1 lotsawa of my choice
Well Padmakara translation group uses Great Perfection in the translation of the Zintri of Kunzang Lamai Shelung, Lama Chönam and Sangye Khandro in the Ambrosia Ocean of Sublime Explanations as well as in the translation of the Tsig Dön Dzö, Eric Pema Kunzang uses the same in Blazing Splendor, it is also used this way in the translation of Dudjom Rinpoche's History and Fundamentals of the Nyingma School as Richard Barron does it in the translation of Dudjom Lingpa's Nang Jang. Bob Thurman translated Mahasandhi as Great Connection in his recent teachings with Dr. Nida, reffering to Sandhi as connection, but translates the tibetan term Dzogchen as Great Perfection. Even Keith Dowman, known to invent his own translation like Pixels, Matrix and stuff, uses it in his translation of Longchenpas Chöying Dzö. Maybe it is just me, but I feel that this is quite a well established term for the translation of Dzogchen/Mahasandhi.

Sorry for the off topic discussion. :focus:
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