The karmic consequences of keeping pets

[Empty Cloud]

Dear Dharma friends,
It has been said that there are serious karmic consequences in keeping pets. It has been said that if you see them as family or are otherwise unduly attached to them, they will be reborn as your family members in future lives and therefore further bind you in samsara. Please share your perspectives. Thank you!
Empty Cloud

[Knotty Veneer]

I don't think karma works that way. A pet's rebirth is determined by it's own actions not by your attachment to it.

Keeping a pet may have many benefits for you karmically if you treat it well. And if you treat an animal badly you will have bad karmic outcomes.

There are some animals you should not keep as pets of course but rescuing a dog or cat from the pound, feeding it, caring for it, looking after it's health etc. can only be a good thing.

[fckw]

What if there are animals in your house you don't consider your pets, yet you are unduly attached to them karmically? Like, having ants that you hate? Will you end up with a huge family of hundreds of family members whom all you hate in a future life?

[Bristollad]

Dear Dharma friends,
It has been said that there are serious karmic consequences in keeping pets. It has been said that if you see them as family or are otherwise unduly attached to them, they will be reborn as your family members in future lives and therefore further bind you in samsara. Please share your perspectives. Thank you!
Empty Cloud

This is not a teaching I've heard in the almost forty years I've been Buddhist. As such, seeing as my teachers haven't even mentioned it, my perspective is to choose to disregard it.

I mean, thinking it through, this would also apply to parents, partners and children or any other beings you see as family - sounds like it comes from someone who regards the ideal Buddhist as a person living alone in a cave with no connections to anyone.

[Aemilius]

There are some related previous discussions:
On raising reptiles and the first precept https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=28850
Rescue pets https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.p ... 7&p=397716
Wisdom in animals? https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=66&t=27716

[seeker242]

What scriptures say these things?

[Malcolm]

Dear Dharma friends,
It has been said that there are serious karmic consequences in keeping pets.

Yes, you have to deal with their shit constantly.

[PadmaVonSamba]

Dear Dharma friends,
It has been said that there are serious karmic consequences in keeping pets.

Yes, you have to deal with their shit constantly.

[PadmaVonSamba]

This question also brings up a related issue.
Do the human realm and animal realm overlap?
Or, one might ask, do domesticated pets live in the human realm? (Or do we live in theirs?)

What about farm animals then, or animals such as raccoons, pigeons, and squirrels which are born and live in urban environments?

I think it can be determined that where you exist, your external environment, is not in itself the human realm or the animal realm, because for example, my dog and I both live in the same house.

What then determines a ‘realm’ (loka) and to what extent does the karma of a being in one realm affect the actions (and thus, the karma) of beings in another realm?

If I take in a stray and obviously homeless dog, two things can be assumed:
1. There were causes and conditions, some perhaps karmic, which led to the dog being

[Tlalok]

For another perspective, a Karma Kagyu lama told me that dogs are the most compassionate creatures of the animal realm. Because of this, the dogs of dharma practitioners are often the rebirths of lazy or ignorant monks, from this perspective it's a good thing to keep a dog to work on getting it another shot as a human in another lifetime. The "passive merit" of just being around dharma practitioners, text, rupas etc is considerable for a Good Dog.

[Aemilius]

What scriptures say these things?

There is a pali word for a pet, piyasatta, which would be priyasattva in sanskrit. Pets are mentioned in the Vinaya, and according to Sravasti Dhammika also in the Jatakas. You can try to figure out your self whether pets are allowed in the Vinaya or not. Here is what Guide to Buddhism A 2 Z says about pets:

"A pet (piyasatta) is an animal kept for companionship or pleasure. At the time of the Buddha, people kept parrots, baby monkeys and other animals as pets (J.II,184; III,97). Pets can be either domestic or wild animals. Domestic animals like dogs and cats prefer human company while others, like canaries and guinea pigs, cannot survive without being looked after or protected by humans. Wild animals kept as pets generally have to be caged to prevent them from escaping. Domestic animals often give their owners a great deal of comfort and joy and usually receive it in return. Wild animals, on the other hand, almost certainly prefer their natural environment and the company of their own kind.

Some people keep unusual or dangerous wild animals like large spiders, reptiles or even great apes, not to receive or give affection, but to enhance their ego and make themselves appear more interesting than they really are. It could be argued that keeping wild animals as pets is breaking the third Precept, in that it involves deriving pleasure at the expense of other sentient beings. Whatever the case, the desire for wild animals as pets means that the natural environment is stripped of its wildlife, which can only be detrimental to its long-term health and survival. A responsible Buddhist would probably not want to contribute to this problem."

"The Jàtakas contain numerous stories in which humans interact in a variety of ways with animals, including talking with them. The Tipitaka also included several such stories. Once Venerable Sàriputta was suffering from fever and Venerable Moggallàna offered to get him the medicine he required - lotus stalks. He went to a great lotus lake, an elephant saw him and asked him if he could help him. Moggallàna told him what he needed and the elephant instructed another elephant to get it. This second elephant uprooted a trunkful of lotus stalk, washed the mud off them, tied them into a bundle and then gave them to Moggallàna (Vin.I,214). Another story of animal helpfulness to humans is told in the Udàna. The Buddha left Kosambi in disgust at the quarrelsome monks there and went to a nearby forest where he spent a few days staying at the foot of a sal tree. The elephant who lived in the forest cropped the grass around the Buddha and brought him water in its trunk (Ud.41-2). The ancient commentary adds that a monkey also brought him fruit to eat (Dhp-a.59). Like the former story, this one is about animals being kindly and helpful. But it also adds the idea that noble beings (enlightened sages and great elephants) share a common appreciation for silence and solitude."


Vanijja Sutta, Business (Wrong Livelihood)
Translated from the Pali by Thanissaro Bhikkhu.

"Monks, a lay follower should not engage in five types of business. Which five? Business in weapons, business in living beings, business in meat, business in intoxicants, and business in poison.
These are the five types of business that a lay follower should not engage in."

[Johnny Dangerous]

Dear Dharma friends,
It has been said that there are serious karmic consequences in keeping pets. It has been said that if you see them as family or are otherwise unduly attached to them, they will be reborn as your family members in future lives and therefore further bind you in samsara. Please share your perspectives. Thank you!
Empty Cloud

Where has it been said, who said it, and it what context?

[Cinnabar]

I don’t know.

I have had dharma siblings over the years trash me for keeping pets. Strays by the way. Didn’t go looking for them.

But then at least a few teachers had pets themselves. Also strays.

[PadmaVonSamba]

Well, my friend who is an ajahn (Theravada forest monk tradition) and head monk at a small temple complex in a semi-rural area, he lets stray cats live there, and I guess they feed them, and there are many, and they’ve all been spayed or neutered.

[heart]

I don’t know.

I have had dharma siblings over the years trash me for keeping pets. Strays by the way. Didn’t go looking for them.

But then at least a few teachers had pets themselves. Also strays.

Do you think kindness have bad karmic consequences?

/magnus

[Cinnabar]

I don’t know.

I have had dharma siblings over the years trash me for keeping pets. Strays by the way. Didn’t go looking for them.

But then at least a few teachers had pets themselves. Also strays.

Do you think kindness have bad karmic consequences?

/magnus

I actually made no mention of what I think.

I just said my dharma siblings trashed me for keeping pets and that a few of my teachers kept pets.

I have no idea where your question comes from?????

I kept the animals. As did my teachers.

A stray shows up you feed it. Get it vet care. Let it in the house so it doesn’t kill other animals or get killed by other animals. Adopt it out or keep it.

[Konchog Thogme Jampa]

I don’t know.

I have had dharma siblings over the years trash me for keeping pets. Strays by the way. Didn’t go looking for them.

But then at least a few teachers had pets themselves. Also strays.

Animals can bring so much joy I remember climbing a mountain in Wales with my sister and her Staffordshire Bull Terrier think he slept for a week after that

[SilenceMonkey]

I think it might become difficult to travel or go into retreat... but an excellent source of bodhicitta!

[SilenceMonkey]

I don't think karma works that way. A pet's rebirth is determined by it's own actions not by your attachment to it.

I don't know... what about karmic connection or karmic debt?

[PadmaVonSamba]

I don't think karma works that way. A pet's rebirth is determined by it's own actions not by your attachment to it.

I don't know... what about karmic connection or karmic debt?

Well, what about them? They may occur due to circumstances, but how is that the same as karmic consequences?

My teacher says that the five ascetics that Siddhartha hung out with during his quest for realization had been the tiger cubs he gave his body to feed in a previous lifetime. Whether that is a fact or not, the statement suggests that our interactions with animals in one lifetime creates connections one way or another in future lifetimes.

It certainly could be the case that by taking in a stray animal, you are simply returning a favor.