Non-attachment, non-craving, that attitude of detachment from the world in general....

[Padmist]

In the Reddit forums, it's is a common daily thing where a poster would say or ask....

• I want to be a Buddhist but how can I detach or fight off craving or have no attachment?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I'm not sure I want to turn my back on the world, my career, and be like a monk?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I don't think I can let go of my attachment to wanting to have a family?

When I read this, I am getting an impression (and here I need your help by correcting if I get this one wrong) that they are learning one type of Buddhism which stresses this monk-like practice of the dharma. Am I right or wrong?

Is this view of Buddhism (being detached, almost separating from the world, thinking one must almost renounce everything) universal of all traditions? (including Mahayana/Vajrayana)?

Should we also be having the same attitude towards life in general?

[Hazel]

I suggest finding out for yourself by reading some dharma books and/or attending teachings.

[Konchog Thogme Jampa]

In the Reddit forums, it's is a common daily thing where a poster would say or ask....

• I want to be a Buddhist but how can I detach or fight off craving or have no attachment?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I'm not sure I want to turn my back on the world, my career, and be like a monk?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I don't think I can let go of my attachment to wanting to have a family?

When I read this, I am getting an impression (and here I need your help by correcting if I get this one wrong) that they are learning one type of Buddhism which stresses this monk-like practice of the dharma. Am I right or wrong?

Is this view of Buddhism (being detached, almost separating from the world, thinking one must almost renounce everything) universal of all traditions? (including Mahayana/Vajrayana)?

Should we also be having the same attitude towards life in general?

I’ve practiced Theravada as a Monk, Jodo Shinshu then Vajrayana both as lay and they are all very different.

[Padmist]

In the Reddit forums, it's is a common daily thing where a poster would say or ask....

• I want to be a Buddhist but how can I detach or fight off craving or have no attachment?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I'm not sure I want to turn my back on the world, my career, and be like a monk?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I don't think I can let go of my attachment to wanting to have a family?

When I read this, I am getting an impression (and here I need your help by correcting if I get this one wrong) that they are learning one type of Buddhism which stresses this monk-like practice of the dharma. Am I right or wrong?

Is this view of Buddhism (being detached, almost separating from the world, thinking one must almost renounce everything) universal of all traditions? (including Mahayana/Vajrayana)?

Should we also be having the same attitude towards life in general?

I’ve practiced Theravada as a Monk, Jodo Shinshu then Vajrayana both as lay and they are all very different.

You must have a lot of great knowledge and stories to tell. How was Theravada and Jodo Shunshu for you? How are they different from one another in your experience?

[PeterC]

In the Reddit forums, it's is a common daily thing where a poster would say or ask....

• I want to be a Buddhist but how can I detach or fight off craving or have no attachment?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I'm not sure I want to turn my back on the world, my career, and be like a monk?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I don't think I can let go of my attachment to wanting to have a family?

When I read this, I am getting an impression (and here I need your help by correcting if I get this one wrong) that they are learning one type of Buddhism which stresses this monk-like practice of the dharma. Am I right or wrong?

They're just not very knowledgeable or experienced. It's not a good idea to community-source ideas about the dharma from strangers on the internet. Nothing can replace the advice of a qualified teacher who knows you personally. The nature of these questions - 'I want to practice...but does that mean...' suggests they really don't have much knowledge of what the practice entails, and probably only a very vague idea of the actual objectives of practice.

Is this view of Buddhism (being detached, almost separating from the world, thinking one must almost renounce everything) universal of all traditions? (including Mahayana/Vajrayana)?

Should we also be having the same attitude towards life in general?

The form that renunciation takes, and the practices that achieve it, differs quite a lot by lineage. Vajrayana does not emphasize abnegation/denial. However there are very great vajrayana practitioners who also happened to be very observant monks.

Really, this is the sort of thing on which you should rely on texts and on qualified teachers. I don't mean to be dismissive but this is the correct answer to 99.99% of questions of this kind. The one thing every lineage agrees on is the need for a teacher.

[PadmaVonSamba]

In the Reddit forums, it's is a common daily thing where a poster would say or ask....

• I want to be a Buddhist but how can I detach or fight off craving or have no attachment?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I'm not sure I want to turn my back on the world, my career, and be like a monk?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I don't think I can let go of my attachment to wanting to have a family?

When I read this, I am getting an impression (and here I need your help by correcting if I get this one wrong) that they are learning one type of Buddhism which stresses this monk-like practice of the dharma. Am I right or wrong?

Is this view of Buddhism (being detached, almost separating from the world, thinking one must almost renounce everything) universal of all traditions? (including Mahayana/Vajrayana)?

Should we also be having the same attitude towards life in general?

In other words, you are trying to learn about Buddhism from people who admittedly aren’t Buddhists?

Don’t you think that approach is a bit strange?

These kinds of misunderstandings are unfortunate but that also make me laugh. It’s like saying, “I have thought about becoming a catholic but I don’t want to have to hit myself on the back with a leather whip every time I have sinned!”

People get all kinds of ideas from tv and movies, or from hearing about yogis living in caves. Obviously, millions of Buddhists around the world don’t do that.

[PadmaVonSamba]

If you read the story of the Buddha, after he left the palace, he became an ascetic, a Sadhu, perhaps, cut off from the world and only eating one grain of rice a day, until he almost died. Then he realized that such extremes are not the right path.

For ordained monks and nuns, there is a renunciation of material desire as well as the desire for intimate personal relationships. But that doesn’t mean one becomes a zombie or lives in some kind of constant severe state of deprivation. I think this is often portrayed in movies when the main character must undergo a lot of hardships. But of course, that’s what makes it an exciting movie, right??

The world’s most famous ‘simple monk’ is HH Dalai Lama. He certainly is not cut off from the world, is he?

[Konchog Thogme Jampa]

In the Reddit forums, it's is a common daily thing where a poster would say or ask....

• I want to be a Buddhist but how can I detach or fight off craving or have no attachment?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I'm not sure I want to turn my back on the world, my career, and be like a monk?

• I want to be a Buddhist but I don't think I can let go of my attachment to wanting to have a family?

When I read this, I am getting an impression (and here I need your help by correcting if I get this one wrong) that they are learning one type of Buddhism which stresses this monk-like practice of the dharma. Am I right or wrong?

Is this view of Buddhism (being detached, almost separating from the world, thinking one must almost renounce everything) universal of all traditions? (including Mahayana/Vajrayana)?

Should we also be having the same attitude towards life in general?

I’ve practiced Theravada as a Monk, Jodo Shinshu then Vajrayana both as lay and they are all very different.

You must have a lot of great knowledge and stories to tell. How was Theravada and Jodo Shunshu for you? How are they different from one another in your experience?

Theravada or the Thai Forest Tradition where I was a monk is the path of personal liberation and renunciation requiring daily intense effort to overcome all of ones kilesas or mental defilements through samadhi/samatha and insight/vipassana. It is best practiced in a monastic setting.

Jodo Shinshu is only practiced as a lay person was taught to me a path of reintegration and relies on Other Power namely Amida Buddha and his Vows more specifically his 18th Vow.

[Padmist]

I’ve practiced Theravada as a Monk, Jodo Shinshu then Vajrayana both as lay and they are all very different.

You must have a lot of great knowledge and stories to tell. How was Theravada and Jodo Shunshu for you? How are they different from one another in your experience?

Theravada or the Thai Forest Tradition where I was a monk is the path of personal liberation and renunciation requiring daily intense effort to overcome all of ones kilesas or mental defilements through samadhi/samatha and insight/vipassana. It is best practiced in a monastic setting.

Jodo Shinshu is only practiced as a lay person was taught to me a path of reintegration and relies on Other Power namely Amida Buddha and his Vows more specifically his 18th Vow.

Thanks. I should read more about Jodo Shinshu.

How would you characterize Vajrayana in comparison with the strong focus on renunciation from other traditions?

[Konchog Thogme Jampa]

You must have a lot of great knowledge and stories to tell. How was Theravada and Jodo Shunshu for you? How are they different from one another in your experience?

Theravada or the Thai Forest Tradition where I was a monk is the path of personal liberation and renunciation requiring daily intense effort to overcome all of ones kilesas or mental defilements through samadhi/samatha and insight/vipassana. It is best practiced in a monastic setting.

Jodo Shinshu is only practiced as a lay person was taught to me a path of reintegration and relies on Other Power namely Amida Buddha and his Vows more specifically his 18th Vow.

Thanks. I should read more about Jodo Shinshu.

How would you characterize Vajrayana in comparison with the strong focus on renunciation from other traditions?

I’ll defer to someone with more Vajrayana experience to answer

[Konchog Thogme Jampa]

Theravada or the Thai Forest Tradition where I was a monk is the path of personal liberation and renunciation requiring daily intense effort to overcome all of ones kilesas or mental defilements through samadhi/samatha and insight/vipassana. It is best practiced in a monastic setting.

Jodo Shinshu is only practiced as a lay person was taught to me a path of reintegration and relies on Other Power namely Amida Buddha and his Vows more specifically his 18th Vow.

Thanks. I should read more about Jodo Shinshu.

How would you characterize Vajrayana in comparison with the strong focus on renunciation from other traditions?

I’ll defer to someone with more Vajrayana experience to answer

[Konchog Thogme Jampa]

Theravada or the Thai Forest Tradition where I was a monk is the path of personal liberation and renunciation requiring daily intense effort to overcome all of ones kilesas or mental defilements through samadhi/samatha and insight/vipassana. It is best practiced in a monastic setting.

Jodo Shinshu is only practiced as a lay person was taught to me a path of reintegration and relies on Other Power namely Amida Buddha and his Vows more specifically his 18th Vow.

Thanks. I should read more about Jodo Shinshu.

How would you characterize Vajrayana in comparison with the strong focus on renunciation from other traditions?

I’ll defer to someone with more Vajrayana experience to answer

[Konchog Thogme Jampa]

Post published three times because the post wouldn’t submit so I refreshed a few times just delete the last two posts thanks

[Varis]

If you want to practice Vajrayana you're better off being a householder than you are being a monk.

[Sādhaka]

If you want to practice Vajrayana you're better off being a householder than you are being a monk.

“...in the Western lifestyle we have many free periods in which we can practice, so sometimes it may be even better than being a monk, because a monk has so many different duties and rituals to perform.” — Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche

Keyword being ‘sometimes’.

I.e. some people who want to be practitioners, are pretty bogged down by karma, e.g. many bills to pay, having to work many hours just to get by, or child-support payments, etc.

As for becoming a monk, in the USA anyway, it seems that there are only like two small Tibetan monasteries, that I’m guessing may not even be functional anymore.

And to take off to Nepal, Tibet, or India, requires jumping through all kinds of hoops, and even more-so if you’re trying to stay there longer than six months or a year. Then you’d have to also have enough money saved up, to pay for your stay for however many years you’re planning on....

[Varis]

Keyword being ‘sometimes’.

I.e. some people who want to be practitioners, are pretty bogged down by karma, e.g. many bills to pay, having to work many hours just to get by, or child-support payments, etc.

It goes beyond that, there are practices that only a householder or non-monastic yogi could feasibly do.

[PadmaVonSamba]

How would you characterize Vajrayana in comparison with the strong focus on renunciation from other traditions?

I don’t know that I’d make a ”comparison”
But the whole point of Vajrayana is that everything is path. Strict monasticism, renunciation in that sense, is observed during retreats, or for full time monastics, and the purpose for doing that, for being a monk or nun at all, is really to be able to focus on a particular practice of set of practices, really to keep all distractions at a distance. But, that’s not much different than a law student studying for the bar exam, or even a regular meditator having a quiet room in their house where there’s no TV or other stuff going on. Sometimes we need that distance, because we aren’t realized buddhas.

Otherwise, however, in Vajrayana, what are often regarded as distractions simply become more fuel for the fire.
So, instead of thinking that one should avoid getting married and having household problems and screaming babies, screaming babies become the path, household problems become the path, married life becomes the path. Basically, samsara itself becomes the path. I think one could call vajrayana “samsarayana” and that wouldn’t be too far off the mark.

[Johnny Dangerous]

Renunciation is a prerequisite for Vajrayana, that's part of what the Four Thoughts are about. Once engaged in actual Vajrayana one transforms instead of renouncing the kleshas generally, but renunciation of samsara is still foundational.

We have to see the futility of our situation to really get serious about Dharma, is one way of putting it.

[SilenceMonkey]

Maybe it should be said that renunciation connotes something a bit different than in Theravada. It doesn’t mean to become a monk and leave home and family life... It means a profound wish to be free from samsara (the cycle of uncontrollable rebirth) and embark on the path to becoming a fully enlightened Buddha.

[Johnny Dangerous]

Maybe it should be said that renunciation connotes something a bit different than in Theravada. It doesn’t mean to become a monk and leave home and family life... It means a profound wish to be free from samsara (the cycle of uncontrollable rebirth) and embark on the path to becoming a fully enlightened Buddha.

I don't know, at the level of practicing the Four Thoughts, it really is not that different from Theravada from my point of view. I began Buddhism with the Pali Canon and it accords perfectly with the contemplations I later learned years later.

-precious human life

-death and impermanence

-karma/inescapability of cause and effect

-disadvantages of samsara

None of that is really even Mahayana specific, the wish to become a monk is an expression of the wish to renounce samsara, where one does so quite literally by externally renouncing. Internally the motivation/decision to do so is not so different at this level. Of course the Mahayana allows for expressions that are more varied, you could say...but the motivation is identical until we address Bodhicitta, etc....renouncing samsara is renouncing samsara.