Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

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Malcolm
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by Malcolm »

Seeker12 wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 1:52 pm

I think in some contexts it's appropriate to not simply equate dukkha with suffering, personally. Reason being that in normal parlance, suffering implies acute suffering in the moment, which could be considered to be the type of dukkha called Dukkha-dukkha.
Yes, and this is acknowledged in traditional Indian commentaries; that is, the that term "dukha" itself refers to duhka-duhka. The other two dukhas are considered dukha because everything pleasant becomes a source of pain, and everything neutral falls apart.
Last edited by Malcolm on Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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LastLegend
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by LastLegend »

^^^So what’s the real Dharma if everything else is misconception?
It’s eye blinking.
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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 2:30 pm ^^^So what’s the real Dharma if everything else is misconception?
It’s what isn’t everything else.
EMPTIFUL.
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LastLegend
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by LastLegend »

PadmaVonSamba wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:12 pm
LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 2:30 pm ^^^So what’s the real Dharma if everything else is misconception?
It’s what isn’t everything else.
What gives birth to Dharma?
It’s eye blinking.
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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:21 pm
PadmaVonSamba wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:12 pm
LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 2:30 pm ^^^So what’s the real Dharma if everything else is misconception?
It’s what isn’t everything else.
What gives birth to Dharma?
That question doesn’t make sense.
It’s like asking, “why is everything?”
“The Dharma” meaning the Buddhist teachings
is simply the explanation of how things truly are.
So, you are asking, “what gives birth to the way things truly are?” or “what causes the truth about how everything exists?” Nothing causes that truth.Its simply the truth about things. It’s like asking “what causes the truth about the door being open?” It’s a non-question. Illogical.

Or, “dharma” can mean an arising phenomena, as in “all dharmas are empty”. But nothing ‘gives birth’ to that either.
EMPTIFUL.
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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

‘Suffering’ is an abstract concept, meaning that it’s a word and you can give it any meaning you like. So, it’s really pointless to debate whether dukkha actually means suffering or not.

But the basic Buddhist reckoning is that either the mind is still, or it isn’t still. I just thought this was worth repeating, because there is a criteria. It’s not just one person’s opinion against someone else’s whether the day-to-day ups and downs of joy and sorrow count as ‘suffering’ or not.
So, like a candle that is either burning or not burning, regardless of how big the flame is,
if your mind is shaken by the movement of appearances, that in itself is sufficiently dukkha.
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LastLegend
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

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PadmaVonSamba wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 5:33 pm
LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:21 pm
PadmaVonSamba wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:12 pm
It’s what isn’t everything else.
What gives birth to Dharma?
That question doesn’t make sense.
It’s like asking, “why is everything?”
“The Dharma” meaning the Buddhist teachings
is simply the explanation of how things truly are.
So, you are asking, “what gives birth to the way things truly are?” or “what causes the truth about how everything exists?” Nothing causes that truth.Its simply the truth about things. It’s like asking “what causes the truth about the door being open?” It’s a non-question. Illogical.

Or, “dharma” can mean an arising phenomena, as in “all dharmas are empty”. But nothing ‘gives birth’ to that either.
The Buddha gave Dharma. Then Dharma is also given by us. You just gave Dharma no?
It’s eye blinking.
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LastLegend
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by LastLegend »

So like the Sutra:

1) nothing arises: non-arising
2) then everything arises from mind

Dharma is also arising from mind. The Buddha gave Dharma. But we understand Dharma and that’s understanding is from our mind not the Buddha mind anymore.
It’s eye blinking.
Malcolm
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by Malcolm »

LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:02 pm So like the Sutra:

1) nothing arises: non-arising
2) then everything arises from mind

Dharma is also arising from mind. The Buddha gave Dharma. But we understand Dharma and that’s understanding is from our mind not the Buddha mind anymore.
You guys love to make the simple complicated.
Giovanni
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by Giovanni »

LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:02 pm So like the Sutra:

1) nothing arises: non-arising
2) then everything arises from mind

Dharma is also arising from mind. The Buddha gave Dharma. But we understand Dharma and that’s understanding is from our mind not the Buddha mind anymore.
What does that mean?
Genjo Conan
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by Genjo Conan »

LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:02 pm The Buddha gave Dharma.
Buddhas realize and expound the Dharma. They don't create it.
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LastLegend
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

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Genjo Conan wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:27 pm
LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:02 pm The Buddha gave Dharma.
Buddhas realize and expound the Dharma. They don't create it.
You mean upaya isn’t real?
It’s eye blinking.
Genjo Conan
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by Genjo Conan »

LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 7:00 pm
Genjo Conan wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:27 pm
LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:02 pm The Buddha gave Dharma.
Buddhas realize and expound the Dharma. They don't create it.
You mean upaya isn’t real?
I'm not sure how what you said follows from what I said. Buddhas use skillful means to expound the Dharma to sentient beings based on their understanding. They're not making up new Dharmas.
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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:02 pm So like the Sutra:

1) nothing arises: non-arising
2) then everything arises from mind

Dharma is also arising from mind. The Buddha gave Dharma. But we understand Dharma and that’s understanding is from our mind not the Buddha mind anymore.
Dharma doesn’t arise from mind.
One’s understanding of dharma arises from mind.
That understanding is your Buddha nature.
In that sense, Buddha arises from mind.
So, in all your spaghetti reasoning
There are no tangles after all.
EMPTIFUL.
An inward outlook produces outward insight.
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LastLegend
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by LastLegend »

Genjo Conan wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 7:04 pm
LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 7:00 pm
Genjo Conan wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:27 pm

Buddhas realize and expound the Dharma. They don't create it.
You mean upaya isn’t real?
I'm not sure how what you said follows from what I said. Buddhas use skillful means to expound the Dharma to sentient beings based on their understanding. They're not making up new Dharmas.
So what Dharma are they preaching? Why does Diamond Sutra say there isn’t Dharma to be obtained? Then how do people progress on Bodhisattvapath?
It’s eye blinking.
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LastLegend
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by LastLegend »

PadmaVonSamba wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 7:21 pm
LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:02 pm So like the Sutra:

1) nothing arises: non-arising
2) then everything arises from mind

Dharma is also arising from mind. The Buddha gave Dharma. But we understand Dharma and that’s understanding is from our mind not the Buddha mind anymore.
So Dharma says self is illusion. Then you say is illusion, are you not creating Dharma already with that? :lol:

Dharma doesn’t arise from mind.
One’s understanding of dharma arises from mind.
That understanding is your Buddha nature.
In that sense, Buddha arises from mind.
So, in all your spaghetti reasoning
There are no tangles after all.

So Dharma says self is illusion. Then you say is self illusion, are you not creating Dharma already with that? :lol: If you didn’t create that Dharma then who did?
It’s eye blinking.
Malcolm
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by Malcolm »

PadmaVonSamba wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 7:21 pm
LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:02 pm So like the Sutra:

1) nothing arises: non-arising
2) then everything arises from mind

Dharma is also arising from mind. The Buddha gave Dharma. But we understand Dharma and that’s understanding is from our mind not the Buddha mind anymore.
Dharma doesn’t arise from mind.
One’s understanding of dharma arises from mind.
That understanding is your Buddha nature.
In that sense, Buddha arises from mind.
So, in all your spaghetti reasoning
There are no tangles after all.
There are two kinds of Dharma: the Dharma of realization and the Dharma of scripture. There is no third kind. The latter arises from the former. This notion that there is an eternal dharma is just an importation of the Hindu idea of Sanatana Dharma.
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

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Unclear or non-sensical statements removed.

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LastLegend
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by LastLegend »

The main misconception for us on the Bodhisattva path is that Dharma is one way. One way would be doing nothing after full realization and not conduct works that benefits beings in Samadhi. If we follow Lankavatara Sutra: everything is an illusion this body and the triple worlds are mere projection. It begs the question: if everything is an illusion and projection, how do fully realized individuals conduct their work to progress towards Buddhahood? Basically, various sutras (describe full realization which includes transformation of depository consciousness which turns into wisdom, namely Lankavatara Sutra).
It’s eye blinking.
Malcolm
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Re: Let's talk about common misconceptions of Buddhism

Post by Malcolm »

LastLegend wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 11:45 pm if everything is an illusion and projection, how do fully realized individuals conduct their work to progress towards Buddhahood?
Fully realized persons are buddhas. There are no other kinds of fully realized persons.
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