is the tirthika doctrine of Brahman incarnating into maya impossible?

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Artziebetter1
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is the tirthika doctrine of Brahman incarnating into maya impossible?

Post by Artziebetter1 »

if there is a infinite,omnsicient,omnipresent yet transendant,unchanging(in ontology and nature not acts,though A'sharis would say their God/unconditioned reality can not have emotions or different acts coming from different wills rather than one eternal will) and omnipotent entity can it enter into infinite number of ignorant,limited and finite and impotent beings with a temporal nondivine nature?I have been reading on the christian doctrine of the hypostatic union (Where christ had two fully divine and fully human natures simultanouesly)and its impossibility and I wonder if this also applies to brahman?also wouldn't that mean that ishwara can't create avatars?

wouldn't if this were true be a great argument buddhists could use against tirthika doctrines?I have heard malcolm say something to the effect that if a unconditioned reality becomes many atmans then it would become conditioned and this is impossible?please explain in detail why this is impossible and educate us.
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Re: is the tirthika doctrine of Brahman incarnating into maya impossible?

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Re: is the tirthika doctrine of Brahman incarnating into maya impossible?

Post by Aryjna »

You can always sidestep arguments against monotheism by saying that "it is inconceivable" how things work.

This is one of my latest byzantine music favorites, could also be a nice background while engaging in this kind of ruminations.

Malcolm
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Re: is the tirthika doctrine of Brahman incarnating into maya impossible?

Post by Malcolm »

Artziebetter1 wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 5:46 am if there is a infinite,omnsicient,omnipresent yet transendant,unchanging(in ontology and nature not acts,though A'sharis would say their God/unconditioned reality can not have emotions or different acts coming from different wills rather than one eternal will) and omnipotent entity can it enter into infinite number of ignorant,limited and finite and impotent beings with a temporal nondivine nature?I have been reading on the christian doctrine of the hypostatic union (Where christ had two fully divine and fully human natures simultanouesly)and its impossibility and I wonder if this also applies to brahman?also wouldn't that mean that ishwara can't create avatars?

wouldn't if this were true be a great argument buddhists could use against tirthika doctrines?I have heard malcolm say something to the effect that if a unconditioned reality becomes many atmans then it would become conditioned and this is impossible?please explain in detail why this is impossible and educate us.
Read your own statement. You have provided this proof right there:

"if a unconditioned reality becomes many atmans then it would become conditioned"

Anything that is uncompounded is indivisible.
Artziebetter1
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Re: is the tirthika doctrine of Brahman incarnating into maya impossible?

Post by Artziebetter1 »

Malcolm wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 3:11 pm
Artziebetter1 wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 5:46 am if there is a infinite,omnsicient,omnipresent yet transendant,unchanging(in ontology and nature not acts,though A'sharis would say their God/unconditioned reality can not have emotions or different acts coming from different wills rather than one eternal will) and omnipotent entity can it enter into infinite number of ignorant,limited and finite and impotent beings with a temporal nondivine nature?I have been reading on the christian doctrine of the hypostatic union (Where christ had two fully divine and fully human natures simultanouesly)and its impossibility and I wonder if this also applies to brahman?also wouldn't that mean that ishwara can't create avatars?

wouldn't if this were true be a great argument buddhists could use against tirthika doctrines?I have heard malcolm say something to the effect that if a unconditioned reality becomes many atmans then it would become conditioned and this is impossible?please explain in detail why this is impossible and educate us.
Read your own statement. You have provided this proof right there:

"if a unconditioned reality becomes many atmans then it would become conditioned"

Anything that is uncompounded is indivisible.
is the trinity then possible if anything uncompounded is indivisible?the Nicene doctrine states that the son and spirit being coeternal and coequal with the father have the same ousia(nature,essence..though not material but metaphorical as the trinity is supposed to be immaterial spirit) numerically as the father being spawned from him eternally (wich some people say is impossible as you cannot beget without causing ).and why must something unconditioned/uncompounded be indivisible?

I am using buddhist logic and it is bringing me away from the religions I have been into in the past like hinduism and christianity.
Last edited by Artziebetter1 on Fri Jun 18, 2021 10:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Johnny Dangerous
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Re: is the tirthika doctrine of Brahman incarnating into maya impossible?

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

Artziebetter1 wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 10:33 pm
Malcolm wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 3:11 pm
Artziebetter1 wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 5:46 am if there is a infinite,omnsicient,omnipresent yet transendant,unchanging(in ontology and nature not acts,though A'sharis would say their God/unconditioned reality can not have emotions or different acts coming from different wills rather than one eternal will) and omnipotent entity can it enter into infinite number of ignorant,limited and finite and impotent beings with a temporal nondivine nature?I have been reading on the christian doctrine of the hypostatic union (Where christ had two fully divine and fully human natures simultanouesly)and its impossibility and I wonder if this also applies to brahman?also wouldn't that mean that ishwara can't create avatars?

wouldn't if this were true be a great argument buddhists could use against tirthika doctrines?I have heard malcolm say something to the effect that if a unconditioned reality becomes many atmans then it would become conditioned and this is impossible?please explain in detail why this is impossible and educate us.
Read your own statement. You have provided this proof right there:

"if a unconditioned reality becomes many atmans then it would become conditioned"

Anything that is uncompounded is indivisible.
is the trinity then possible if anything uncompounded is indivisible?the Nicene doctrine states that the son and spirit being coeternal and coequal with the father have the same ousia(nature,essence..though not material but metaphorical as the trinity is supposed to be immaterial spirit) numerically as the father being spawned from him eternally (wich some people say is impossible as you cannot beget without causing ).and why must something unconditioned/uncompounded be indivisible?

I am using buddhist logic and it is bringing me away from the religions I have been into in the past like hinduism and christianity.
This is really verging into "comparative religion" territory.

Obviously though, nothing uncompounded can have parts, nor parts of parts, etc., the very definition of "compounded" explains this:

https://www.thefreedictionary.com/compounded
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when afflicted by disease

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when sad

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when suffering occurs

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when you are scared

-Khunu Lama
amanitamusc
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Re: is the tirthika doctrine of Brahman incarnating into maya impossible?

Post by amanitamusc »

Artziebetter1 wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 10:33 pm
Malcolm wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 3:11 pm
Artziebetter1 wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 5:46 am if there is a infinite,omnsicient,omnipresent yet transendant,unchanging(in ontology and nature not acts,though A'sharis would say their God/unconditioned reality can not have emotions or different acts coming from different wills rather than one eternal will) and omnipotent entity can it enter into infinite number of ignorant,limited and finite and impotent beings with a temporal nondivine nature?I have been reading on the christian doctrine of the hypostatic union (Where christ had two fully divine and fully human natures simultanouesly)and its impossibility and I wonder if this also applies to brahman?also wouldn't that mean that ishwara can't create avatars?

wouldn't if this were true be a great argument buddhists could use against tirthika doctrines?I have heard malcolm say something to the effect that if a unconditioned reality becomes many atmans then it would become conditioned and this is impossible?please explain in detail why this is impossible and educate us.
Read your own statement. You have provided this proof right there:

"if a unconditioned reality becomes many atmans then it would become conditioned"

Anything that is uncompounded is indivisible.


I am using buddhist logic and it is bringing me away from the religions I have been into in the past like hinduism and christianity.
Congratulations!
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