Children Covid Vaccinations

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Queequeg
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Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by Queequeg »

Covid vaccinations for children have been approved in the US. Will you be getting your children vaccinated?
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
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Archie2009
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by Archie2009 »

In the Netherlands children from age 12 to 17 can get vaccinated. If I had children in that age bracket I would indeed get them vaccinated.

I understand children under age 11 are soon eligible for a vaccine in the US?

Intensive care units here are full of the (adult) unvaccinated. The Dutch bible belt is especially hard hit. I understand people are starting to get fed up with it. Surgeries postponed too accomodate Jebus people.
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Nemo
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by Nemo »

Based on the chances of children having an adverse vaccine reaction versus the current probability of them catching Covid and having a major complication the vaccine is the right choice. But I get many people don't understand math.
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Queequeg
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

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Archie2009 wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 1:12 pm In the Netherlands children from age 12 to 17 can get vaccinated. If I had children in that age bracket I would indeed get them vaccinated.

I understand children under age 11 are soon eligible for a vaccine in the US?

Intensive care units here are full of the (adult) unvaccinated. The Dutch bible belt is especially hard hit. I understand people are starting to get fed up with it. Surgeries postponed too accomodate Jebus people.
Children 5-11 have been approved for Pfizer in the US. I am sure the rest of the world will soon follow suit.

I believe the COVID shot will become as routine as the annual flu shot and we'll get to some sort of normal soon. I hope the mask wearing indoors in the winter becomes routine - sort of like it is in E. Asia. One thing that I've become more conscientious about in the last year is breathing in other people's breath. Ew. Touching strangers is gross enough; who knows where they've been and what they've touched. Breathing in vapors they've just exhaled is even grosser.
Nemo wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 2:07 pm Based on the chances of children having an adverse vaccine reaction versus the current probability of them catching Covid and having a major complication the vaccine is the right choice. But I get many people don't understand math.
Its indeed math.

I suspect I had a heart issue related to the shot (my heart went into afib - there's an apparent higher incidence of heart inflammation among E. Asians from the shot). Drs couldn't confirm or deny it was from the shot, but based on my heart health and age, I shouldn't have gotten afib. It cleared up on it own, but it inspired me to meditate on mortality for a bit. Still, I would take the shot again, and we plan on getting our kids vaccinated ASAP. The virus has been getting around in our community and quarantine protocols seem excessive, they're still extremely cautious despite revisions from the rules at the height of last year, and a certainly a pain in the ass - our kids have had one quarantine order, and might be getting another any minute. That said, contrary to the news coverage that seems to focus on pockets of demonstrative panic, we have neither freakouts about wanting the schools to go remote nor anti-mask drama queens. I suspect most communities are more like us - nobody is happy, but we suck it up and deal - we know this COVID can kill our elders and others with certain health conditions.
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

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If I were basing it solely on risk of severe disease vs risk of myocarditis in kids, I am not sure I would choose to vaccinate our youngest at this point in time.

When you add in the risk of them killing grandma, it makes the calculation clearer, so yeah, my youngest needs to see his grandma.
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by Shotenzenjin »

I'm not in the States but in Canada. And my boy 13 got his first shot
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by Genjo Conan »

100% going to get it for our 9 yo as soon as we can.
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by treehuggingoctopus »

An off-top, but I need it:

Is it a relief to see such threads. The vast majority of the Western Buddhists I know consider the jab an evil concoction from outer space.
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

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treehuggingoctopus wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:55 pmThe vast majority of the Western Buddhists I know consider the jab an evil concoction from outer space.

Then Dharmawheel.net does not represent the views of most western Buddhists afterall then...?

Good to hear.
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by Malcolm »

Sādhaka wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:40 pm
treehuggingoctopus wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:55 pmThe vast majority of the Western Buddhists I know consider the jab an evil concoction from outer space.

Then Dharmawheel.net does not represent the views of most western Buddhists afterall then...?

Good to hear.
He lives in Eastern Europe, so not representative of Western Buddhists as a whole. But anyway, anyone who thinks the covid vaccine is harmful is dumber than shit.

The amount of damage this virus can wreck on the unvaccinated, even when they never show symptoms, is astonishing.
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by narhwal90 »

My 14ry old daughter got hers as soon as the shots opened up. If/when boosters are reasonably available, we're all getting them. Even if we dont catch it the win is reducing the odds of giving it to someone else.
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

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Queequeg wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 12:40 pm Covid vaccinations for children have been approved in the US. Will you be getting your children vaccinated?
I am eagerly awaiting this, but do not see it in the news. (CNN or Reuters)

I have been working in healthcare at the sharp end of the frontline (ICU) up until recently and my family has been on extended lock-down.

My youngest has asthma and has frequent flare-ups at just the most minor upper respiratory infections. So, it has been all about protecting him.

Yes, when it is approved he will be receiving the vaccination.

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Queequeg
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

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zerwe wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:05 am
Queequeg wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 12:40 pm Covid vaccinations for children have been approved in the US. Will you be getting your children vaccinated?
I am eagerly awaiting this, but do not see it in the news. (CNN or Reuters)

I have been working in healthcare at the sharp end of the frontline (ICU) up until recently and my family has been on extended lock-down.

My youngest has asthma and has frequent flare-ups at just the most minor upper respiratory infections. So, it has been all about protecting him.

Yes, when it is approved he will be receiving the vaccination.

Shaun :namaste:
Sorry, I was mistaken. It looks like approval is imminent but not approved yet. If things go as anticipated, the Pfizer shot may be available the first week of November for children 5-11.
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
zerwe
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by zerwe »

Johnny Dangerous wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:27 pm If I were basing it solely on risk of severe disease vs risk of myocarditis in kids, I am not sure I would choose to vaccinate our youngest at this point in time.

When you add in the risk of them killing grandma, it makes the calculation clearer, so yeah, my youngest needs to see his grandma.
Evidence had shown some increase in myocarditis in kids. However, the post-vaccination myocarditis cases in the adult population were predominately self-limiting and/or responded well to treatment. The risk a couple months ago in adults was calculable at roughly < 0.0000025. One would stand a greater chance of being struck by lightning many times over. The risk of death or long-term disability from the disease itself is many, many, many times greater. Even with increased cases of myocarditis in children the risk-benefit-ratio is relatively the same.

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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

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zerwe wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:14 am
Johnny Dangerous wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:27 pm If I were basing it solely on risk of severe disease vs risk of myocarditis in kids, I am not sure I would choose to vaccinate our youngest at this point in time.

When you add in the risk of them killing grandma, it makes the calculation clearer, so yeah, my youngest needs to see his grandma.
Evidence had shown some increase in myocarditis in kids. However, the post-vaccination myocarditis cases in the adult population were predominately self-limiting and/or responded well to treatment. The risk a couple months ago in adults was calculable at roughly < 0.0000025. One would stand a greater chance of being struck by lightning many times over. The risk of death or long-term disability from the disease itself is many, many, many times greater. Even with increased cases of myocarditis in children the risk-benefit-ratio is relatively the same.

Shaun :namaste:
AFAIK yes the risk of myocarditis via vaccination is still lower than the risk of severe disease in kids (and this is good ancillary reason to vaccinate for sure), but I don't think the situation compares to adults at all, because the risk level of Covid increases insanely as one ages. The risk of severe disease to children is simply much lower than for adults period, even with Delta. I know about the scary MISC cases and all that, but statistically the AFAIK my nine year old boy is at pretty low risk of severe disease from Covid in the first place, especially in my highly vaccinated area. Yes I know there are more delta cases, but that is explained by more people getting Covid, the largest increase in kids and delta is in the states and areas with low adult vaccination.

I am not saying it is an acceptable risk given vaccine availability, but it does not compare to even someone my ages (45) risks from Covid. Trying to compare risk between adults and children (especially older adults, and especially given that the riskiest age for myocarditis is young males) does not make much sense to me, despite it being the default public health approach.

I'm willing to look at numbers btw, but what you are saying about the relative risk in children vs. adults does not make sense to me. At least, it is less of a slam-dunk argument to me than adult vaccination, where it seems to be a no brainer risk vs benefit wise.
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

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The risk of severe disease to children is simply much lower than for adults period, even with Delta.
Actually, we don’t know this. As I said, the harm this virus wrecks on people who are unvaccinated is astonishing, and is only revealed by extensive imaging. Pancreas damage, lung damage, kidney damage, etc. Look, one of my friends is the head nurse of Boston Medical Center, another friend is a surgeon at the top hospital in Mexico City. Most people have no idea the shitshow this virus creates, and long term effects are likely to be severe and ongoing in many who have been infected prior to vaccination, even if they showed no symptoms.
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

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Malcolm wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:35 am
The risk of severe disease to children is simply much lower than for adults period, even with Delta.
Actually, we don’t know this. As I said, the harm this virus wrecks on people who are unvaccinated is astonishing, and is only revealed by extensive imaging. Pancreas damage, lung damage, kidney damage, etc. Look, one of my friends is the head nurse of Boston Medical Center, another friend is a surgeon at the top hospital in Mexico City. Most people have no idea the shitshow this virus creates, and long term effects are likely to be severe and ongoing in many who have been infected prior to vaccination, even if they showed no symptoms.
Yes it causes severe disease in children, I know that happens. The younger a person is there is less risk of severe disease, just by the numbers. Of course again I am not claiming it is an acceptable risk, but AFAIK it is pretty established fact that things like the pulmonary and cardio complications of Covid are simply much less likely in children.

Just find a graph of the relative risk of Covid by age, it's not controversial.

Also I have two dead family members from Covid, I know what it can do. Factually though, it does that a lot more often in older people than in kids.

Long Covid is poorly understood and there is no "likely" with it until there is an understood mechanism, more data etc.
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

Here we go:

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... y-age.html

I'm not trying to take away from the importance of vaccination by any means, just saying, the risk by age is hugely different, and vaccinating young kids is less of a slam dunk IMO, though I think there are some solid arguments.

One of my issues was with lack of testing, but then I watch Paul Offit and I found his explanations convincing, because there is a reason we won't do large scale RCT's on kids.
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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by Kim O'Hara »

Johnny Dangerous wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:41 am
Malcolm wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:35 am
The risk of severe disease to children is simply much lower than for adults period, even with Delta.
Actually, we don’t know this. As I said, the harm this virus wrecks on people who are unvaccinated is astonishing, and is only revealed by extensive imaging. Pancreas damage, lung damage, kidney damage, etc. Look, one of my friends is the head nurse of Boston Medical Center, another friend is a surgeon at the top hospital in Mexico City. Most people have no idea the shitshow this virus creates, and long term effects are likely to be severe and ongoing in many who have been infected prior to vaccination, even if they showed no symptoms.
Yes it causes severe disease in children, I know that happens. The younger a person is there is less risk of severe disease, just by the numbers. Of course again I am not claiming it is an acceptable risk, but AFAIK it is pretty established fact that things like the pulmonary and cardio complications of Covid are simply much less likely in children.

Just find a graph of the relative risk of Covid by age, it's not controversial.

Also I have two dead family members from Covid, I know what it can do. Factually though, it does that a lot more often in older people than in kids.

Long Covid is poorly understood and there is no "likely" with it until there is an understood mechanism, more data etc.
Yes, but, as you said -
Johnny Dangerous wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:27 pm When you add in the risk of them killing grandma, it makes the calculation clearer, so yeah, my youngest needs to see his grandma.
- and more broadly, the risk to the community of children getting covid is not just the relatively slight risk to them but carries the additional risk that infected children will pass on the illness to older people.

Here in Australia we're steadily offering the jab to younger and younger age-groups but that progress varies at the state level and I haven't been keeping up with the details.

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Re: Children Covid Vaccinations

Post by Malcolm »

Johnny Dangerous wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:41 am
Long Covid is poorly understood and there is no "likely" with it until there is an understood mechanism, more data etc.
I am talking about unvaxxed people who are not suffering from long covid, who, when imaged thoroughly, MRI, CAT scans, tomography, etc.,, show extensive damage to their internal organs, people who had little or no symptoms.
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