More UFOs

Casual conversation between friends. Anything goes (almost).
User avatar
Aemilius
Posts: 4603
Joined: Sat Mar 27, 2010 11:44 am

Re: More UFOs

Post by Aemilius »

PeterC wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 2:56 am
Aemilius wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 2:36 am
PeterC wrote: Sun Jun 13, 2021 4:26 pm

Ok, joking aside, you’re citing that story as proof for aliens?
It is not proof of aliens. But there are some things that I regard as proofs, like this NATO Meets E.T. by Robert O. Dean https://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/soci ... ound02.htm
You regard something unverifiable and riddled with inconsistencies, conjecture and absurdities as proof? "Cosmic Top Secret Clearance"? Accounts from the Roman times? Aliens chatting to Danish farmers over a cup of tea, inviting Italian aviators to go for a spin? Every cliche in the book, including the crashed flying saucer that's harvested for engine technology and the autopsy on the grey aliens? Have you even checked to see if the people quoted here exist or are remotely credible?
I see no reason say that Robert O. Dean is lying.
Central Intelligence Agency publishes a CIA World Factbook, in these days only as net version. This mentioned governmental office had at one time published a lecture transcript about Ufos in the Roman Empire, which has now been withdrawn. But same kind of material exists now as an article in an academic journal:
Unidentified Flying Objects in Classical Antiquity
Richard Stothers
The Classical Journal
Vol. 103, No. 1 (Oct. - Nov., 2007), pp. 79-92 (14 pages)
Published By: The Classical Association of the Middle West and South, Inc. (CAMWS)

CIA Factbook contains UFO reports, maybe You can accept these as real truth? https://www.cia.gov/stories/story/take- ... r-x-files/

I know that NATO officially says that Robert O. Dean has been working there, but denies the truth of anything he claims to have seen or read there. You don't have to send me that information.
This is still in line with that reality is elusive, hard to pin down. It disappears from sight, like bodhisattva Maitreya from the sight of townspeople in ancient India.
Last edited by Aemilius on Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
svaha
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.
They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Sarvē mānavāḥ svatantrāḥ samutpannāḥ vartantē api ca, gauravadr̥śā adhikāradr̥śā ca samānāḥ ēva vartantē. Ētē sarvē cētanā-tarka-śaktibhyāṁ susampannāḥ santi. Api ca, sarvē’pi bandhutva-bhāvanayā parasparaṁ vyavaharantu."
Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1. (in english and sanskrit)
PeterC
Posts: 5192
Joined: Tue May 20, 2014 12:38 pm

Re: More UFOs

Post by PeterC »

Aemilius wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:45 am
PeterC wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 2:56 am
Aemilius wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 2:36 am

It is not proof of aliens. But there are some things that I regard as proofs, like this NATO Meets E.T. by Robert O. Dean https://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/soci ... ound02.htm
You regard something unverifiable and riddled with inconsistencies, conjecture and absurdities as proof? "Cosmic Top Secret Clearance"? Accounts from the Roman times? Aliens chatting to Danish farmers over a cup of tea, inviting Italian aviators to go for a spin? Every cliche in the book, including the crashed flying saucer that's harvested for engine technology and the autopsy on the grey aliens? Have you even checked to see if the people quoted here exist or are remotely credible?
I see no reason say that Robert O. Dean is lying.
Central Intelligence Agency publishes a CIA World Factbook, in these days only as net version. This mentioned governmental office had at one time published a lecture transcript about Ufos in the Roman Empire, which has now been withdrawn. But same kind of material exists now as an article in an academic journal:
Unidentified Flying Objects in Classical Antiquity
Richard Stothers
The Classical Journal
Vol. 103, No. 1 (Oct. - Nov., 2007), pp. 79-92 (14 pages)
Published By: The Classical Association of the Middle West and South, Inc. (CAMWS)

CIA Factbook contains UFO reports, maybe You can accept these as real truth? https://www.cia.gov/stories/story/take- ... r-x-files/
So the Roman UFOs were re-classified? Must be a conspiracy! Et tu, Brute?

I have trouble taking the "declassified CIA reports" seriously when they make constant references to Mulder and Scully. Sort of suggests that they consider the whole thing to be a joke, no?
User avatar
Aemilius
Posts: 4603
Joined: Sat Mar 27, 2010 11:44 am

Re: More UFOs

Post by Aemilius »

Certainly not joke, as there are hundreds of them, or thousands according to other sources, (Richard M. Dolan). I have read only some of them, it is interesting that CIA has been reporting ufo sightings from Europe in 1950's.
svaha
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.
They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Sarvē mānavāḥ svatantrāḥ samutpannāḥ vartantē api ca, gauravadr̥śā adhikāradr̥śā ca samānāḥ ēva vartantē. Ētē sarvē cētanā-tarka-śaktibhyāṁ susampannāḥ santi. Api ca, sarvē’pi bandhutva-bhāvanayā parasparaṁ vyavaharantu."
Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1. (in english and sanskrit)
User avatar
FiveSkandhas
Posts: 917
Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:40 pm

Re: More UFOs

Post by FiveSkandhas »

Excuse the topic flow interruption but...ten pages and nobody has mentioned the time when Nichiren faced beheading at Tatsunokuchi...suddenly there appeared some kind of bright shining disk in the sky. The executioners panicked and refused to carry out the deed. Cue the UFO theories...
images (41).jpeg
images (41).jpeg (50.48 KiB) Viewed 1027 times
"One should cultivate contemplation in one’s foibles. The foibles are like fish, and contemplation is like fishing hooks. If there are no fish, then the fishing hooks have no use. The bigger the fish is, the better the result we will get. As long as the fishing hooks keep at it, all foibles will eventually be contained and controlled at will." -Zhiyi

"Just be kind." -Atisha
User avatar
Aemilius
Posts: 4603
Joined: Sat Mar 27, 2010 11:44 am

Re: More UFOs

Post by Aemilius »

Robert O. Dean became well known when he appeared in the Alien Interview, in 1997.

July 26, 1996: Offices of Rocket Pictures receive a phone call from a man named "Victor", who claims to be in possession of a leaked tape of an alien creature being interviewed in a secret government installation.

svaha
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.
They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Sarvē mānavāḥ svatantrāḥ samutpannāḥ vartantē api ca, gauravadr̥śā adhikāradr̥śā ca samānāḥ ēva vartantē. Ētē sarvē cētanā-tarka-śaktibhyāṁ susampannāḥ santi. Api ca, sarvē’pi bandhutva-bhāvanayā parasparaṁ vyavaharantu."
Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1. (in english and sanskrit)
PeterC
Posts: 5192
Joined: Tue May 20, 2014 12:38 pm

Re: More UFOs

Post by PeterC »

Aemilius wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:17 am Certainly not joke, as there are hundreds of them, or thousands according to other sources, (Richard M. Dolan). I have read only some of them, it is interesting that CIA has been reporting ufo sightings from Europe in 1950's.
From the link you posted:
The CIA declassified hundreds of documents in 1978 detailing the Agency’s investigations into Unidentified Flying Objects (UFOs). The documents date primarily from the late 1940s and 1950s.

To help navigate the vast amount of data contained in our FOIA UFO collection, we’ve decided to highlight a few documents both skeptics and believers will find interesting. Below you will find five documents we think X-Files character Agent Fox Mulder would love to use to try and persuade others of the existence of extraterrestrial activity. We also pulled five documents we think his skeptical partner, Agent Dana Scully, could use to prove there is a scientific explanation for UFO sightings.

The truth is out there; click on the links to find it.
Sounds like a matter they take extremely seriously and not a joke at all.
simpsons.png
simpsons.png (607.82 KiB) Viewed 999 times
Giovanni
Posts: 765
Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2020 11:07 am

Re: More UFOs

Post by Giovanni »

Aemilius wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 2:31 am
Giovanni wrote: Sun Jun 13, 2021 4:02 pm Aemilius. Do you think that the existence of aliens can help relieve dukkha for any sentient being ?
If so how?
If not why does it matter?
It seems to matter. It matters like the arrival of europeans mattered to the australian aboriginals. They did continue with their own traditions, or they tried to do that. We are already in a period of transition where we have met the E.T., which is explained in Philip Corso's Day After Roswell and other books.
Your answer might be interesting. But it’s not to the question I asked. Which was can aliens aid or prevent Dukkha arising in sentient beings? With the obvious extension question, are aliens somehow free from Dukkha? With a further question if they are free from Dukkha how did that happen? Did an entire race become enlightened?
User avatar
Aemilius
Posts: 4603
Joined: Sat Mar 27, 2010 11:44 am

Re: More UFOs

Post by Aemilius »

Giovanni wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 1:29 pm
Aemilius wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 2:31 am
Giovanni wrote: Sun Jun 13, 2021 4:02 pm Aemilius. Do you think that the existence of aliens can help relieve dukkha for any sentient being ?
If so how?
If not why does it matter?
It seems to matter. It matters like the arrival of europeans mattered to the australian aboriginals. They did continue with their own traditions, or they tried to do that. We are already in a period of transition where we have met the E.T., which is explained in Philip Corso's Day After Roswell and other books.
Your answer might be interesting. But it’s not to the question I asked. Which was can aliens aid or prevent Dukkha arising in sentient beings? With the obvious extension question, are aliens somehow free from Dukkha? With a further question if they are free from Dukkha how did that happen? Did an entire race become enlightened?
Medium is the message, said Marshall McLuhan. Buddhism has changed in the course of millennia, fire arms have been invented, paper and book printing have been developed, all in China. Better roads, better postal services, larger cities, faster traveling, better sanitation, etc.. have been developed since the times of Buddha Gautama. These things have affected the Dharma and Buddhism, as a stream of culture or spiritual influence and tradition. You cannot deny that.

One thing that has had an enormous influence on Dharma is the invention anesthetics. You can maybe read what surgery was like in the centuries before 1900's!! How much suffering was experienced by most or all people, caused by cancer and milder diseases. How amputation was done without anesthetics, etc.. Your hair will stand on end, if you read and manage to understand how much pain and suffering there was in the era before the development anesthetics.
svaha
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.
They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Sarvē mānavāḥ svatantrāḥ samutpannāḥ vartantē api ca, gauravadr̥śā adhikāradr̥śā ca samānāḥ ēva vartantē. Ētē sarvē cētanā-tarka-śaktibhyāṁ susampannāḥ santi. Api ca, sarvē’pi bandhutva-bhāvanayā parasparaṁ vyavaharantu."
Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1. (in english and sanskrit)
Giovanni
Posts: 765
Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2020 11:07 am

Re: More UFOs

Post by Giovanni »

You are confusing individual suffering with Dukkha. Dukkha is one of the three signs of being. It arises with mundane consciousness. The form it takes varies, so anaesthetic modifies pain, but life expectancy growing brings a whole lot of other potential for suffering. If aliens are sentient they too will presumably be subject to Dukkha, and will be characterised by anatta and anicca. They are just as bound to the wheel as the beings of this world system. So instead of endless speculation about them perhaps a better use of our time would be spent in becoming realized.
User avatar
Aemilius
Posts: 4603
Joined: Sat Mar 27, 2010 11:44 am

Re: More UFOs

Post by Aemilius »

Giovanni wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:40 pm You are confusing individual suffering with Dukkha. Dukkha is one of the three signs of being. It arises with mundane consciousness. The form it takes varies, so anaesthetic modifies pain, but life expectancy growing brings a whole lot of other potential for suffering. If aliens are sentient they too will presumably be subject to Dukkha, and will be characterised by anatta and anicca. They are just as bound to the wheel as the beings of this world system. So instead of endless speculation about them perhaps a better use of our time would be spent in becoming realized.
That is ok, as far as it goes. But most of us are very much involved with the first kind of dukkha, the concrete physical and mental suffering, and to some degree we are even concerned with the suffering of change. Because of the immediacy of the first kind of dukkha, even well known buddhist masters take modern medicine, like covid vaccines and other medicines, which are products of scientific research and are thus produced by completely unnecessary worldly knowledge. What to speak of other implementations of modern technology! Which again are totally unnecessary (for an ascetic wearing thrown away pieces of clothing, and who is living in a forest, and is able bear the suffering involved, like bugs, ants, mosquitoes, mice, other rodents and insects, heat and cold). But even he may realize one day that the world is changing, when the forest he is living in is cut down, and sold to some business or company.
The knowledge of ufos etc can be useful and valid in terms of how the world is changing, and into what direction.

(I am referring to first two of the three kinds of duhkha in the beginning, which I believe are known by all.)
svaha
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.
They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Sarvē mānavāḥ svatantrāḥ samutpannāḥ vartantē api ca, gauravadr̥śā adhikāradr̥śā ca samānāḥ ēva vartantē. Ētē sarvē cētanā-tarka-śaktibhyāṁ susampannāḥ santi. Api ca, sarvē’pi bandhutva-bhāvanayā parasparaṁ vyavaharantu."
Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1. (in english and sanskrit)
Malcolm
Posts: 42974
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 2:19 am

Re: More UFOs

Post by Malcolm »

Aemilius wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:32 am Robert O. Dean became well known when he appeared in the Alien Interview, in 1997.

July 26, 1996: Offices of Rocket Pictures receive a phone call from a man named "Victor", who claims to be in possession of a leaked tape of an alien creature being interviewed in a secret government installation.

So fake.
User avatar
Johnny Dangerous
Global Moderator
Posts: 17092
Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:58 pm
Location: Olympia WA
Contact:

Re: More UFOs

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

I have a take that is sort of Jungian towards Aliens and abduction stories.

I'm not sure about some of the stuff in Patrick Harpur's book Daimonic Reality, but his basic premise is that these things narratives are part of something deeply connected to humans, and that questions about whether they are physically real sort of miss the point. IIRC he does claim that there are some interesting physical phenomena surrounding such things, but that they are always somehow non-falsifiable anomalies. The similarity between fairy stories from across the world and modern Alien abduction stories is unmistakable - little people come from some place which is "other", take people away, sometimes return them, and they are often changed by the experience. They are often even proportioned and colored the same way.

Somehow the Alien Abduction community takes all this thinks that even with cellphone cameras and all the other crap we have now we have just missed everything but a few pieces of video of UFO's, and this is proof positive that there are these beings "out there" somewhere. To me, they appear to be more "in there" than out.
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when afflicted by disease

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when sad

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when suffering occurs

Meditate upon Bodhicitta when you are scared

-Khunu Lama
Malcolm
Posts: 42974
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 2:19 am

Re: More UFOs

Post by Malcolm »

Image
Danny
Posts: 1043
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 12:43 pm

Re: More UFOs

Post by Danny »

Johnny Dangerous wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 8:47 pm I have a take that is sort of Jungian towards Aliens and abduction stories.

I'm not sure about some of the stuff in Patrick Harpur's book Daimonic Reality, but his basic premise is that these things narratives are part of something deeply connected to humans, and that questions about whether they are physically real sort of miss the point. IIRC he does claim that there are some interesting physical phenomena surrounding such things, but that they are always somehow non-falsifiable anomalies. The similarity between fairy stories from across the world and modern Alien abduction stories is unmistakable - little people come from some place which is "other", take people away, sometimes return them, and they are often changed by the experience. They are often even proportioned and colored the same way.

Somehow the Alien Abduction community takes all this thinks that even with cellphone cameras and all the other crap we have now we have just missed everything but a few pieces of video of UFO's, and this is proof positive that there are these beings "out there" somewhere. To me, they appear to be more "in there" than out.

I remember reading Whitley Striebers Communion back in the 90’s... I thought it was a good horror story of the modern age. Then I watched the movie with Christopher Walken and Then it dawned on me...

This is just nuts.

So my question is, in the early days 50’s through to the late 80’s people were contractees, then in the 90’s they became abductees.

Interesting that the narrative changed.

Image
Attachments
738D3E82-8CB4-4BD5-BC5D-9C67A1FFC992.jpeg
738D3E82-8CB4-4BD5-BC5D-9C67A1FFC992.jpeg (64.74 KiB) Viewed 842 times
Danny
Posts: 1043
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 12:43 pm

Re: More UFOs

Post by Danny »

Then I realized I had already read Betty and Barney Hills
1966 publication of Interrupted Journey, I had it in the house...

The original hypnosis tapes are available on YouTube.
Danny
Posts: 1043
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 12:43 pm

Re: More UFOs

Post by Danny »

Danny
Posts: 1043
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 12:43 pm

Re: More UFOs

Post by Danny »

JD, one has to ask real witches, or cunning folk as they are known in the rural tradition, what are fairies?

They will tell you..

You need on a full moon night to sit at a cross roads on a dark country lane a three legged milking stoll.

The fairies will whisper to you the names of the near dead, who will pass In the village for the year coming..
Last edited by Danny on Fri Jun 18, 2021 11:51 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Danny
Posts: 1043
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 12:43 pm

Re: More UFOs

Post by Danny »

Folks who know.. don’t mess with it.
Danny
Posts: 1043
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 12:43 pm

Re: More UFOs

Post by Danny »

There’s an old tradition called “beating the rounds”

You wanna keep intruders off your property..

Lol
Modern people these days don’t know shit.

Buddhist might call it ..
Vajra protection ring, or vajra tent.
Danny
Posts: 1043
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 12:43 pm

Re: More UFOs

Post by Danny »

Sorry to the lady from Kentucky...
Your magic was wikka learned and not authentic..

No matter how hard you tried ..

It didn’t work

But you were awesome
Locked

Return to “Lounge”