Is there a universal consciousness?

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Supramundane
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Re: Is there a universal consciousness?

Post by Supramundane »

karmanyingpo wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 1:49 pm
PadmaVonSamba wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:16 am
Supramundane wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:13 ambut what of the Bodhi mind? What of the consciousness of the awakened mind? Is it individual, conditioned, a thing then in your opinion, PVS?
even though I suppose it’s possible.
Hello Dharma friend I was grateful for your response on other threads so thank you if I did not already say so :namaste:
I am curious about the possibility of a universal consciousness from a buddhist perspective. You seem to be knowledgable so I wonder if you might know any teachings or scriptures that can be interprable as talking about a universal consciousness?

KN
I am also looking for such a concept, but it seems I was mistaken and that it does not exist. It reminds me of a statement by Krishnamurthi who claimed that the 'observer is the observed'. This means that when you observe your own thoughts, this 'observer' is, in fact, the true self. However, this is erroneous.

It is simply pushing back the deluded notion of a Self by one order. It is falling into the same trap of positing an independent Self.

Ajahn Sumedho is a very well respected theravadan who posits that the silent alertness which can be accessed in meditation precedes --- and also follows --- our existence. This could be the universal consciousness you're seeking. However, I fear that it is, much like Krishnamurti's supposition, a faulty understanding.

Others may have different opinions, however.

http://chinabuddhismencyclopedia.com/en ... sciousness
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Supramundane
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Re: Is there a universal consciousness?

Post by Supramundane »

Malcolm wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 2:37 pm
Supramundane wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:13 am
Yes, consciousness can end. It has a beginning and an end; it is conditioned.
Compounded phenomena cannot be said to have beginnings since there is no first cause.
What about my consciousness, M? Didn't it begin with my birth?
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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: Is there a universal consciousness?

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

Supramundane wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:26 pm
karmanyingpo wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 1:49 pm
PadmaVonSamba wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:16 am
even though I suppose it’s possible.
Hello Dharma friend I was grateful for your response on other threads so thank you if I did not already say so :namaste:
I am curious about the possibility of a universal consciousness from a buddhist perspective. You seem to be knowledgable so I wonder if you might know any teachings or scriptures that can be interprable as talking about a universal consciousness?

KN
I am also looking for such a concept, but it seems I was mistaken and that it does not exist. It reminds me of a statement by Krishnamurthi who claimed that the 'observer is the observed'. This means that when you observe your own thoughts, this 'observer' is, in fact, the true self. However, this is erroneous.

It is simply pushing back the deluded notion of a Self by one order. It is falling into the same trap of positing an independent Self.

Ajahn Sumedho is a very well respected theravadan who posits that the silent alertness which can be accessed in meditation precedes --- and also follows --- our existence. This could be the universal consciousness you're seeking. However, I fear that it is, much like Krishnamurti's supposition, a faulty understanding.

Others may have different opinions, however.

http://chinabuddhismencyclopedia.com/en ... sciousness
Again, define exactly, precisely what you are referring to. Otherwise, it’s just reefer talk.
Do you mean a kind of mega-cognition? Do you mean awareness existing in between molecules?
The thing is, being humans, we are going to liken the concept of consciousness to something that we ourselves experience. “Universal consciousness, like my own consciousness, only bigger!” But maybe it’s the consciousness of a virus or of an amoeba. So, please be explicit.
EMPTIFUL.
An inward outlook develops outward insight.
Malcolm
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Re: Is there a universal consciousness?

Post by Malcolm »

Supramundane wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:29 pm
Malcolm wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 2:37 pm
Supramundane wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:13 am
Yes, consciousness can end. It has a beginning and an end; it is conditioned.
Compounded phenomena cannot be said to have beginnings since there is no first cause.
What about my consciousness, M? Didn't it begin with my birth?
No, in Buddhadharma we have this little thing called "rebirth."
"Nonduality is merely a name;
that name does not exist."
—Kotalipa
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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: Is there a universal consciousness?

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

:techproblem:
Malcolm wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 8:47 pm
Supramundane wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:29 pm
Malcolm wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 2:37 pm

Compounded phenomena cannot be said to have beginnings since there is no first cause.
What about my consciousness, M? Didn't it begin with my birth?
No, in Buddhadharma we have this little thing called "rebirth."
...and that’s simply because consciousness, cognition, whatever you want to call it, can’t just spontaneously begin out of pure matter, which is all that the physical body is.
Every moment of consciousness follows another moment of consciousness.

Salt is a mineral, a type of rock. It’s also one of the components of the human brain, along with fat, water, amino acids... unless one believes that things like rock and water have consciousness (animism), there’s nothing in the brain that is actually aware of anything. The brain only processes sensory information and converts impressions from the external world into neuro-electricity, which is really all that our awareness or consciousness can feed off of while we are alive.
EMPTIFUL.
An inward outlook develops outward insight.
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Supramundane
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Re: Is there a universal consciousness?

Post by Supramundane »

Malcolm wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 8:47 pm
Supramundane wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:29 pm
Malcolm wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 2:37 pm

Compounded phenomena cannot be said to have beginnings since there is no first cause.
What about my consciousness, M? Didn't it begin with my birth?
No, in Buddhadharma we have this little thing called "rebirth."
Ooooo gotcha haha. Makes sense. It is becoming clearer.
Thanks.
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Supramundane
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Re: Is there a universal consciousness?

Post by Supramundane »

karmanyingpo wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 1:49 pm
PadmaVonSamba wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:16 am
Supramundane wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:13 ambut what of the Bodhi mind? What of the consciousness of the awakened mind? Is it individual, conditioned, a thing then in your opinion, PVS?
even though I suppose it’s possible.
Hello Dharma friend I was grateful for your response on other threads so thank you if I did not already say so :namaste:
I am curious about the possibility of a universal consciousness from a buddhist perspective. You seem to be knowledgable so I wonder if you might know any teachings or scriptures that can be interprable as talking about a universal consciousness?

KN
No one here seems to like the term universal; however, there is reference in the sutras to "original mind". This is a mind which is 'shining, luminous and permanent'. Various sutras make reference to such luminosity of mind, although they never use the term universal; nonetheless, universal does not seem too far from the concept of an original mind. (at the time of the Buddha, I doubt if there was such a word as 'universal').

there are meditative states in which one is aware of awareness. In such a state, there are no thought formations and thus, some may call it an original mind. All people are capable of experiencing this meditative state. Is this Universal enough?:)
Malcolm
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Re: Is there a universal consciousness?

Post by Malcolm »

Supramundane wrote: Wed Dec 16, 2020 12:51 pm
karmanyingpo wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 1:49 pm
PadmaVonSamba wrote: Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:16 am
even though I suppose it’s possible.
Hello Dharma friend I was grateful for your response on other threads so thank you if I did not already say so :namaste:
I am curious about the possibility of a universal consciousness from a buddhist perspective. You seem to be knowledgable so I wonder if you might know any teachings or scriptures that can be interprable as talking about a universal consciousness?

KN
No one here seems to like the term universal; however, there is reference in the sutras to "original mind". This is a mind which is 'shining, luminous and permanent'. Various sutras make reference to such luminosity of mind, although they never use the term universal; nonetheless, universal does not seem too far from the concept of an original mind. (at the time of the Buddha, I doubt if there was such a word as 'universal').

there are meditative states in which one is aware of awareness. In such a state, there are no thought formations and thus, some may call it an original mind. All people are capable of experiencing this meditative state. Is this Universal enough?:)
As a generic quality, it is universal, just like all fires are hot, but there is no absolute universal fire.
"Nonduality is merely a name;
that name does not exist."
—Kotalipa
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