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by tobes
Fri Nov 13, 2020 6:20 am
Forum: Tibetan Buddhism
Topic: The Two Truths Debate - Poll & Discussion
Replies: 29
Views: 1200

Re: The Two Truths Debate - Poll & Discussion

A poll here is going to almost purely reflect sectarian bias/the lineage or school one has entered into, received teachings from etc. Online 'debates' about the two truths are very rarely genuine, open ended, rational dialogues on the topic... They usually take the form (unstated of course): I prac...
by tobes
Fri Nov 13, 2020 1:10 am
Forum: Tibetan Buddhism
Topic: The Two Truths Debate - Poll & Discussion
Replies: 29
Views: 1200

Re: The Two Truths Debate - Poll & Discussion

A poll here is going to almost purely reflect sectarian bias/the lineage or school one has entered into, received teachings from etc. Online 'debates' about the two truths are very rarely genuine, open ended, rational dialogues on the topic... They usually take the form (unstated of course): I pract...
by tobes
Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:56 am
Forum: Tibetan Buddhism
Topic: Milarepa's famous mudra
Replies: 18
Views: 990

Re: Milarepa's famous mudra

I find the secrecy thing a bit overblown to be honest. He is Tibet's most famous yogin and there is more than a little mythology that has built up over the centuries. The claim for secrecy seems connected to an unstated claim for authenticity or privileged access. Ear whispered teachings, dakinis, v...
by tobes
Thu Oct 15, 2020 2:12 am
Forum: Lounge
Topic: Backyard Astronomers?
Replies: 24
Views: 1359

Re: Backyard Astronomers?

A nice pair of 10x50 magnification, BAK 4 prisim, multi coated surface optics, with a tripod adapter, binoculars is the way to start, is a great jump off point to begin with. Use a tripod for steady viewing. It keeps the cost down, without shelling out for expensive gear. Light weight, portable and...
by tobes
Tue Oct 13, 2020 5:02 am
Forum: Gelug
Topic: Where’s all the Gelukpas?
Replies: 15
Views: 1460

Re: Where’s all the Gelukpas?

I have a very robust Gelug connection (among others), but sorry I don't like to speak about my gurus publicly.

**don't worry, it ain't NKT**
by tobes
Mon Oct 12, 2020 12:37 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

I'll have a good think about this Malcolm, but in the meantime let me say: an excellent response. I think it shows why this question is worth pursuing. It might seem trivial or prapanca, but it is actually very profound and necessary to contemplate. :anjali: It’s not trivial at all. In the West, we...
by tobes
Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:14 pm
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

I'll offer an argument: I walk outside and see a tree. The tree is physical, and I apprehend it (partly) through my physical senses. Then at night time I go to sleep. I dream of the same tree. Being (now) only an appearance in my mind, it does not depend on my physical senses or the physical tree. ...
by tobes
Sun Oct 11, 2020 6:23 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

I'll offer an argument: I walk outside and see a tree. The tree is physical, and I apprehend it (partly) through my physical senses. Then at night time I go to sleep. I dream of the same tree. Being (now) only an appearance in my mind, it does not depend on my physical senses or the physical tree. L...
by tobes
Thu Oct 08, 2020 2:11 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

You're saying all that you are is material...? No - I'm saying there are material and mental parts, and language is connected more with the mental. i.e. it is my name imputed on my form. If you wish to understand the classical position on this point, according to the Sautrantika school, refer to th...
by tobes
Wed Oct 07, 2020 9:38 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

avatamsaka3 wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 3:57 am
i.e. Who/what am I? The material parts + the linguistic imputation 'tobes'.
You're saying all that you are is material...?
No - I'm saying there are material and mental parts, and language is connected more with the mental. i.e. it is my name imputed on my form.
by tobes
Wed Oct 07, 2020 3:03 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

Malcolm's position is clear. I think it is a profound topic worth contemplating, and which I am still quite unclear on. Mods maybe should split the thread? Some further thoughts: *if we consider the very basic division of the skandhas into namah and rupa, this clearly situates language and speech wi...
by tobes
Tue Oct 06, 2020 6:42 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

Anyone have anything to add on these points? 2. When a part of the body relaxes, and we feel a pleasant, bright sensation, is this a physical change or a subtle change or both? What regulates this relaxation? 3. Are there non-restricted practices that work with the subtle body? Only, first of all: ...
by tobes
Tue Oct 06, 2020 5:25 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

Vocal actions, speech, is part of the rūpaskandha. You are confusing mind with body. The sambhogakāya belongs to the rūpakāya, the material kāya. Karma is cetana (namaḥ), and what proceeds from cetana: verbal and physical actions (rūpa). Generally, nāmaḥ, mind, corresponds to the dharmakāya; where ...
by tobes
Mon Oct 05, 2020 3:02 am
Forum: Tibetan Buddhism
Topic: Question Regarding Samaya Pollution
Replies: 25
Views: 1651

Re: Question Regarding Samaya Pollution

Sometimes you have to damage something in order to discover how it functions. Or at least, this is how I learned about samaya. I used to also find the moral imperatives around this very coercive, maybe even ideological, and definitely psychoanalytically dangerous. But having damaged it and discovere...
by tobes
Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:13 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

I look forward to it Malcolm. I'm sure you'll offer good reasons. Vocal actions, speech, is part of the rūpaskandha. You are confusing mind with body. The sambhogakāya belongs to the rūpakāya, the material kāya. Karma is cetana (namaḥ), and what proceeds from cetana: verbal and physical actions (rū...
by tobes
Sat Oct 03, 2020 2:43 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

I look forward to it Malcolm. I'm sure you'll offer good reasons.
by tobes
Sat Oct 03, 2020 12:13 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

Maybe we need to distinguish between speech as a physical-verbal articulation of sound, and the wider sense of the term in the Buddhist tradition, which is clearly more subtle.

Body body and mind.

OM OM HUM......

Something is clearly missing right?
by tobes
Sat Oct 03, 2020 12:10 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

Speech is part of rupa skandha; likewise the sambhogakaya is part of the rupakaya. Surely speech entails samjnaskandha and samskaraskandha too. It has both rupa and namah components. No, it’s a purely physical action. See the Kosha. This is speech. Although it contains physical elements, it is clea...
by tobes
Fri Oct 02, 2020 5:16 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

But if channels, pranas etc are purely rupa, then why the association with sambogakaya (eg in the speech empowerment)? Speech is part of rupa skandha; likewise the sambhogakaya is part of the rupakaya. Surely speech entails samjnaskandha and samskaraskandha too. It has both rupa and namah components.
by tobes
Fri Oct 02, 2020 3:00 am
Forum: Mahāyāna Buddhism
Topic: Subtle body
Replies: 73
Views: 4615

Re: Subtle body

But if channels, pranas etc are purely rupa, then why the association with sambogakaya (eg in the speech empowerment)?

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