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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 6:17 pm 
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Should anyone with a glimmer of an interest in Dzogchen teachings be encouraged to attend one of ChNNR's webcasts? Or does it signify a certain amount of commitment to practicing Dzogchen in this life? (at least keeping up a minimal daily practice of Guru Yoga as well as consideration of ChNNR as one's guru)

I'm asking because I know a couple people who are definitely interested and curious, and I wonder if this is enough. ChNNR has mentioned that he has suffered health problems due to damaged samayas of past students. If someone attends a webcast (or a few) and doesn't sustain interest/effort to gain knowledge of dzogchen in this life, is this a damaged samaya?


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 6:54 pm 
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Great question.

Chögyal Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche wrote:


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 7:05 pm 
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I am at that stage, wishing to know more of Dzogchen, and to receive ChNNR's teachings and transmissions.

So far I have kept samaya with all my Gurus, and from my perspective I think as long as the commitments are known before accepting them, it is pretty straightforward.

However, I have also experienced HYT empowerments where 7,000 people agreed to practice commitments and, admittedly based on a small sample, few knew that they had a choice about accepting them and others simply ignored them and treated the event like a rock concert.

Some webcasts are closed and others open. I don't know on what basis people are allowed access to the closed broadcasts but if samaya is involved then if that is understood and the person is accepted for the broadcast then surely the numbers of samaya breakers wold be very few.

I don't know how much more could be done to avoid having some samaya breakers.

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 7:17 pm 
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Blue Garuda wrote:
as long as the commitments are known before accepting them, it is pretty straightforward.


Right. My question is, what commitments exactly are implied in simply attending a webcast (which of course includes transmission of ati guru yoga)?

On the one hand, from what I understand, receiving dzogchen transmission from ChNNR implies samaya to at least practice guru yoga.

On the other hand, watching a webcast would at the very least plant karmic seeds, even if the person doesn't have the necessary motivation or circumstances to practice immediately or even in this life.

So that leaves me with my question - should I be generous in suggesting that my interested friends check out the webcast, because "any connection with an authentic dzogchen guru is favorabe?" OR, should I caution friends to know what they are getting into before they attend, and to confirm that they are really committed to practice & realization?


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 7:31 pm 
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Blue Garuda wrote:
Some webcasts are closed and others open. I don't know on what basis people are allowed access to the closed broadcasts but if samaya is involved then if that is understood and the person is accepted for the broadcast then surely the numbers of samaya breakers wold be very few.

Closed means just that it is for members of DC only. Which webcast is closed and which open is Rinpoche's decision. As to how he decides, I have no idea at all.

dakini_boi wrote:
On the other hand, watching a webcast would at the very least plant karmic seeds, even if the person doesn't have the necessary motivation or circumstances to practice immediately or even in this life.

So that leaves me with my question - should I be generous in suggesting that my interested friends check out the webcast, because "any connection with an authentic dzogchen guru is favorabe?" OR, should I caution friends to know what they are getting into before they attend, and to confirm that they are really committed to practice & realization?

Rinpoche sometimes mentions that he has students who attended a teaching and then weren't interested anymore. Then years later they come back and start practicing seriously. Maybe suggest them the webcasts and caution them a little bit haha.

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 7:48 pm 
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ChNN teaches genuine dharma from a genuine lineage of realization. So what harm would there be in someone having exposure to genuine dharma? It's so rare to find.
I say if the webcast is open then why not?

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 7:50 pm 
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Pero wrote:
Closed means just that it is for members of DC only. Which webcast is closed and which open is Rinpoche's decision. As to how he decides, I have no idea at all.


So we have four variables:

Whether the webcast is open or closed.

Whether those open or closed webcasts include practice commitments.

Who should be accepted as a member of DC?

What is required in order to be accepted?


I wonder what filter is used to identify those suitable to be members.

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 8:17 pm 
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Personally, I am very cautious whether I suggest the Webcasts. Apart if someone is really interested and likes to participate seriously, then I'll do my best for help him/her. If we like to help people obtain karmic connection with Dzogchen and especially with ChNN Rinpoche, it is enough to suggest them reading some books first.
I have experienced that often people who are enthusiastic in the beginning, after sometime they give up and forget everything about the transmission. From the other hand, there are people who are more reserved in the beginning, but they follow the teachings for many years and are serious in their approach.
It depends, there are no safe guidelines.... :shrug:
In any case, we must take full responsibility when we suggest the Webcasts to people, because they are live transmissions.

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 8:35 pm 
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Blue Garuda wrote:
So we have four variables:

Whether the webcast is open or closed.
Whether those open or closed webcasts include practice commitments.
Who should be accepted as a member of DC?
What is required in order to be accepted?

I wonder what filter is used to identify those suitable to be members.

LOL! It's not that complicated at all. Anyone can become a member. :smile:
As for practice commitments, outside of Guru Yoga, there weren't any in any of the webcasts I've attended.

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 8:38 pm 
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Blue Garuda wrote:
So we have four variables:

Whether the webcast is open or closed.


Closed webcasts are only for active members of Dzogchen Community with personal passwords.

Blue Garuda wrote:
Whether those open or closed webcasts include practice commitments.


There are always commitments because Webcasts are live Dzogchen transmissions. However, ChNN Rinpoche does not give practice commitments, like do some practice every day or recite some millions of mantras etc. But his teachings always include THE commitment! Which in fact, although is very simple, it can be the most difficult of all... :D

Blue Garuda wrote:
Who should be accepted as a member of DC?

What is required in order to be accepted?

I wonder what filter is used to identify those suitable to be members.


Everybody can be member of DC. If he/she feels sincerely that he belongs there. It is enough to get in touch with the nearest Gar or Ling and to ask for participation. :smile:

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 8:42 pm 
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If somebody does not have the karmic connection with CHNN then no matter what you do they will not follow the webcast or put the teachings into effect.

If somebody does have a karmic connection with CHNN then no matter what you do they will follow the webcast and put the practices into effect.

It's that simple. So don't stress too much over it.
:namaste:

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 8:49 pm 
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gregkavarnos wrote:
If somebody does not have the karmic connection with CHNN then no matter what you do they will not follow the webcast or put the teachings into effect.

If somebody does have a karmic connection with CHNN then no matter what you do they will follow the webcast and put the practices into effect.

It's that simple. So don't stress too much over it.
:namaste:


I agree with Gregory!
It is not our job to convert or persuade people.
Dzogchen is for mature and independent people, who can find alone their personal path through Samsara. ;)

PS. Curiosity is never enough!

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 9:03 pm 
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ChNN is giving open webcasts to a couple thousand people at a time, so obviously there is no actual commitment involved and the curious are welcome, otherwise he would close the teachings. So the prerequisite is anyone with an internet connection and an interest to hear him teach.


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 9:08 pm 
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Yes but if we attend with the intention to receive Transmission, then we should consider that we have also received the Samaya to practice Guru Yoga (which I'm sure you know, I'm just pointing this out for those who might not know). :anjali:


Last edited by Lhug-Pa on Wed May 09, 2012 9:14 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 9:09 pm 
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pensum wrote:
ChNN is giving open webcasts to a couple thousand people at a time, so obviously there is no actual commitment involved and the curious are welcome, otherwise he would close the teachings. So the prerequisite is anyone with an internet connection and an interest to hear him teach.


Yes, indeed. Very generous of him, considering.
/magnus

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 9:21 pm 
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Right, thank you all for your input.

So should I make sure my interested friends realize that by taking part in the webcast, they should be willing to practice guru yoga daily (and of course, in its most essential form it can be done in a few seconds)?


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 9:29 pm 
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pensum wrote:
ChNN is giving open webcasts to a couple thousand people at a time, so obviously there is no actual commitment involved and the curious are welcome, otherwise he would close the teachings. So the prerequisite is anyone with an internet connection and an interest to hear him teach.


This seems to contradict Dronma who says there is always THE commitment.

My experience of Gelugpa empowerments, which are presumably very different, is that an empowerment may be attended as a 'blessing' if someone does not wish to take vows or make commitments.

It seems that you are saying that all 'open' webcasts have no commtiments, others have mentioned that all have the Guru Yoga commtiment, or THE commitment.

So if I were a newbie interested in finding out more, or an advanced HYT practitioner seeking to explore Dzogchen, I think this thread would probably confuse me.

Can anyone clarify this in simple terms, please.

I'm still not sure that there is an answer to the OP.

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 9:31 pm 
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I recall Rinpoche saying in the last couple webcasts that you can never take an empowerment as a blessing and it always involves samaya.

And considering that, as far as I understand, direct introduction is the 4th Empowerment, rig pa'i rtsal dbang, it would seem to imply that samaya is involved in receiving transmission from Rinpoche.


Justin


Last edited by justin.hudgins on Wed May 09, 2012 9:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 9:32 pm 
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It's possible that in attending a webcast one could discover the Nature of Mind whether there is the intention to receive the Transmission or not. But if one does not intend on receiving the Transmission and does not discover, then there is no Samaya. Or if one intends on receiving the Transmission but does not know if they "got it" or not, then they should still consider that there is Samaya, and should practice Guru Yoga and continue to try to discover the Nature of Mind. Then in the case of one who has the intention to participate and receive the Transmission, but who later feels that they lack the ability to develop the other four capacities (diligence and so-forth), then well they should probably contact Chögyal Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche and ask him for advice.


Last edited by Lhug-Pa on Wed May 09, 2012 9:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 9:40 pm 
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Blue Garuda wrote:
So if I were . . . an advanced HYT practitioner seeking to explore Dzogchen, I think this thread would probably confuse me.

Can anyone clarify this in simple terms, please.


Well, as far as you're concerned, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain by receiving transmission from ChNNR. Why? The only practice commitment he requires is guru yoga, and once you receive dzogchen transmission, any guru yoga you practice can fulfill that commitment. In fact, in this last retreat, he gave the example of how he was asked to teach dzogchen at a Gelug monastery - he gave a commentary on the migtsema Lama Tsongkhapa guru yoga, explaining it in dzogchen terms. The monks weren't satisfied, saying they wanted a dzogchen teaching! But he had already given them a dzogchen teaching, explaining in a way that they would be able most seamlessly to integrate into their practice.


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