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 Post subject: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 6:23 pm 
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I know next to nothing about Dzogchen and indeed the Nyingma in general.

My background is Gelugpa where the chanting I have encountered has been fairly flat or the deep throat chanting I can almost accomplish at times.

I have recently posted about receiving an empowerment form Dozgchen Rinpoche, in the course of which I received a mantra and also bought a CD of Dzogchen Monastery Chants.

I find the chants completely engrossing as they enter my mind, almost hypnotic, and chanting the one for which I have transmission is a wonderful experience.

The complexity of the Dzogchen chants seems to involve a lot of singing 'around' each syllable rather than simple enunciation, and some variation such as 'OYM' at the start rather than 'OM' or 'AUMN'.

Is this a characteristic?

Is it was intended to disguise the mantra, or because it is rooted in a more ancient form, etc ?

Here's an example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YSlU1_kd-A

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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 6:29 pm 
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Blue Garuda wrote:
I know next to nothing about Dzogchen and indeed the Nyingma in general.

My background is Gelugpa where the chanting I have encountered has been fairly flat or the deep throat chanting I can almost accomplish at times.

I have recently posted about receiving an empowerment form Dozgchen Rinpoche, in the course of which I received a mantra and also bought a CD of Dzogchen Monastery Chants.

I find the chants completely engrossing as they enter my mind, almost hypnotic, and chanting the one for which I have transmission is a wonderful experience.

The complexity of the Dzogchen chants seems to involve a lot of singing 'around' each syllable rather than simple enunciation, and some variation such as 'OYM' at the start rather than 'OM' or 'AUMN'.

Is this a characteristic?

Is it was intended to disguise the mantra, or because it is rooted in a more ancient form, etc ?

Here's an example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YSlU1_kd-A


It is just style.

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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 6:54 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 5:23 pm
Posts: 1967
Namdrol wrote:
Blue Garuda wrote:
I know next to nothing about Dzogchen and indeed the Nyingma in general.

My background is Gelugpa where the chanting I have encountered has been fairly flat or the deep throat chanting I can almost accomplish at times.

I have recently posted about receiving an empowerment form Dozgchen Rinpoche, in the course of which I received a mantra and also bought a CD of Dzogchen Monastery Chants.

I find the chants completely engrossing as they enter my mind, almost hypnotic, and chanting the one for which I have transmission is a wonderful experience.

The complexity of the Dzogchen chants seems to involve a lot of singing 'around' each syllable rather than simple enunciation, and some variation such as 'OYM' at the start rather than 'OM' or 'AUMN'.

Is this a characteristic?

Is it was intended to disguise the mantra, or because it is rooted in a more ancient form, etc ?

Here's an example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YSlU1_kd-A


It is just style.



Thank you.

Is that from lineage practices or an aspect of regional linguistics. ?

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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 7:03 pm 
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Location: Bay Area, CA, USA
I think it's a combination of a lot of things.....melodies and means of chanting sometimes came to great masters in "visions," etc.

There's a funny song, I think it was from Jamyang Khyentse Wangpo, about the differences between lineages--and he talks about the differences in chanting styles--"Gandenpas chant from deep below, Nyingmas chant through the nose, " or some sort of funny comments like that. He also pokes fun of every lineage, before really making some terse statements about the great benefit of all....

There are quite elaborate systems of music, melody, chanting, etc., for every lineage--even for sub-lineages. I'm sure even the various Nyingma lineages have quite a variety of styles, melodies, etc.

A few years back I was very fortunate to have two Bhutanese (Drukpa Kagyu) Loppons stay with me for a while, and we did a shrine consecration--I joined them, and their methods of chanting, melodies, music, etc. was utterly unlike what I'd been taught. The varieties are truly endless!

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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 7:12 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 5:23 pm
Posts: 1967
conebeckham wrote:
I think it's a combination of a lot of things.....melodies and means of chanting sometimes came to great masters in "visions," etc.

There's a funny song, I think it was from Jamyang Khyentse Wangpo, about the differences between lineages--and he talks about the differences in chanting styles--"Gandenpas chant from deep below, Nyingmas chant through the nose, " or some sort of funny comments like that. He also pokes fun of every lineage, before really making some terse statements about the great benefit of all....

There are quite elaborate systems of music, melody, chanting, etc., for every lineage--even for sub-lineages. I'm sure even the various Nyingma lineages have quite a variety of styles, melodies, etc.

A few years back I was very fortunate to have two Bhutanese (Drukpa Kagyu) Loppons stay with me for a while, and we did a shrine consecration--I joined them, and their methods of chanting, melodies, music, etc. was utterly unlike what I'd been taught. The varieties are truly endless!


Ah, thanks. :)

At the moment, when unfamiliar, I just rise and fall with the tide of actions by those who know what they are doing! LOL :)

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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 7:16 pm 
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Posts: 12736
Blue Garuda wrote:
conebeckham wrote:
I think it's a combination of a lot of things.....melodies and means of chanting sometimes came to great masters in "visions," etc.

There's a funny song, I think it was from Jamyang Khyentse Wangpo, about the differences between lineages--and he talks about the differences in chanting styles--"Gandenpas chant from deep below, Nyingmas chant through the nose, " or some sort of funny comments like that. He also pokes fun of every lineage, before really making some terse statements about the great benefit of all....

There are quite elaborate systems of music, melody, chanting, etc., for every lineage--even for sub-lineages. I'm sure even the various Nyingma lineages have quite a variety of styles, melodies, etc.

A few years back I was very fortunate to have two Bhutanese (Drukpa Kagyu) Loppons stay with me for a while, and we did a shrine consecration--I joined them, and their methods of chanting, melodies, music, etc. was utterly unlike what I'd been taught. The varieties are truly endless!


Ah, thanks. :)

At the moment, when unfamiliar, I just rise and fall with the tide of actions by those who know what they are doing! LOL :)


The most profound Dzogchen chant is Song of the Vajra.

N

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http://www.bhaisajya.net
http://www.bhaisajya.guru
http://www.sakyapa.net
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

How can you not practice the highest Dharma
at this time of obtaining a perfect human body?

-- Jetsun Dragpa Gyaltsen


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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 7:30 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 5:23 pm
Posts: 1967
Namdrol wrote:

The most profound Dzogchen chant is Song of the Vajra.

N


Thanks. :)

I have the Nyenpa Lha Sum chant.

The CD has:
Seven line Prayer
Benza Guru Mantra
Bodhicitta Prayer
Om Mani..
Long life Prayer
Prayer for the Tradition


Does the Song of the Vajra require transmission or is it available generally. If so, where can I find it please?

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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 7:57 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:44 pm
Posts: 1565
Blue Garuda wrote:

Does the Song of the Vajra require transmission or is it available generally. If so, where can I find it please?

You can get the transmission and text via tonights webcast most likely.

I used to be self conscious about the chanting/singing practices until I started doing the SOV daily.
Now it is one of the most profound practices I have ever encountered. There is a diverse range of applications for it.

The SOV basically turns you into a walking dispensary of ma sgom sangs rgyas chos lnga for the beings you encounter as long as you are present of your potential to benefit then through the practice.


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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 8:01 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 5:23 pm
Posts: 1967
Nangwa wrote:
Blue Garuda wrote:

Does the Song of the Vajra require transmission or is it available generally. If so, where can I find it please?

You can get the transmission and text via tonights webcast most likely.

I used to be self conscious about the chanting/singing practices until I started doing the SOV daily.
Now it is one of the most profound practices I have ever encountered. There is a diverse range of applications for it.

The SOV basically turns you into a walking dispensary of ma sgom sangs rgyas chos lnga for the beings you encounter as long as you are present of your potential to benefit then through the practice.


Thanks. :)

Is there a link or is it closed?

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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 8:08 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:44 pm
Posts: 1565
Blue Garuda wrote:
Nangwa wrote:
Blue Garuda wrote:

Does the Song of the Vajra require transmission or is it available generally. If so, where can I find it please?

You can get the transmission and text via tonights webcast most likely.

I used to be self conscious about the chanting/singing practices until I started doing the SOV daily.
Now it is one of the most profound practices I have ever encountered. There is a diverse range of applications for it.

The SOV basically turns you into a walking dispensary of ma sgom sangs rgyas chos lnga for the beings you encounter as long as you are present of your potential to benefit then through the practice.


Thanks. :)

Is there a link or is it closed?


It's open.
http://www.shangshunginstitute.net/webcast/video.php


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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 8:12 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 5:23 pm
Posts: 1967
Nangwa wrote:


Thanks. :)

Seems I'm too late for May 7th - did you mean May 8th?

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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 8:27 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:51 pm
Posts: 80
Location: Budapest, Hungary
Nangwa wrote:
The SOV basically turns you into a walking dispensary of ma sgom sangs rgyas chos lnga


Meaning?


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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 8:52 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 30, 2011 9:12 pm
Posts: 354
Kilaya. wrote:
Nangwa wrote:
The SOV basically turns you into a walking dispensary of ma sgom sangs rgyas chos lnga

Meaning?


The five methods of liberation without meditating, namely through seeing, hearing, touch, taste and wearing.


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 Post subject: Re: Dzogchen Chanting
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 8:55 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:51 pm
Posts: 80
Location: Budapest, Hungary
pensum wrote:
Kilaya. wrote:
Nangwa wrote:
The SOV basically turns you into a walking dispensary of ma sgom sangs rgyas chos lnga

Meaning?


The five methods of liberation without meditating, namely through seeing, hearing, touch, taste and wearing.


Thanks!


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