Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Casual conversation between friends. Anything goes (almost).

Which do you think is worse?

Eating meat
10
33%
Drinking alcohol
14
47%
Neither: They are equally bad
6
20%
 
Total votes: 30

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kirtu
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby kirtu » Fri May 07, 2010 8:23 pm



"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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kirtu
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby kirtu » Fri May 07, 2010 8:28 pm



"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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Astus
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Astus » Fri May 07, 2010 8:44 pm

Kirt,

Maybe there is some misunderstanding here. I didn't say alcohol is OK for anyone according to any set of precepts mentioned. I've also mentioned how certain kinds of meat are forbidden for monks. I've said nothing about the Brahmajala Sutra itself, only that meat eating is one of the minor precepts in it (the 3rd), just like drinking (the 2nd).

It'd be actually nice of you to outline tantric precepts about meat and alcohol.
Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.



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Lazy_eye
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Lazy_eye » Fri May 07, 2010 9:51 pm

Last edited by Lazy_eye on Fri May 07, 2010 10:23 pm, edited 6 times in total.

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kirtu
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby kirtu » Fri May 07, 2010 9:53 pm



"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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Astus
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Astus » Fri May 07, 2010 10:08 pm

Lazy_eye,

It shows perfectly why being a butcher is listed specifically among wrong livelihoods right there in the noble eightfold path.
Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.



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Indrajala
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Indrajala » Sat May 08, 2010 2:32 am

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

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catmoon
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby catmoon » Sat May 08, 2010 7:17 am

Try telling that to an ex-alcoholic.
Sergeant Schultz knew everything there was to know.

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Namu Butsu
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Namu Butsu » Sat May 08, 2010 5:03 pm

Huseng your vegentarianism seems to be a dogma for you. I study and practice alternative medicine. There are countless studies and essays on this subject. did I ask you to provide proof that vegenarianism is the healthy way to live? This is similar to your earlier argument that I have never been to tibet. It reminds me when i was speaking to a muslim co-worker and was telling him about the wife beating that is supported in the quran and that is a big problem in muslim countries and his response was "have you been to those countries?"

I dont want to give you a dogma of nonvegentarianism but neither do I want your dogma of vegetarianism. Save it for your holy men. I eat mainly organic and grass fed meat. Not the same as processed food, but I will admit that this isnt always the case since I do eat out sometimes etc..

For me is my way and for you your way

-.-
Gassho
Namo Amida Butsu
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"However hard it may be to bid farewell to this world, when the conditions that bind us to this saha [samsara] realm run out, we are powerless to do anything as the final hour arrives and we are swept away to that Land." -A Record in Lament of Divergences

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kirtu
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby kirtu » Sat May 08, 2010 5:39 pm



"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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Indrajala
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Indrajala » Sat May 08, 2010 6:12 pm

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

ball-of-string
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby ball-of-string » Sat May 08, 2010 11:07 pm


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Dexing
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Dexing » Sun May 09, 2010 6:13 pm

There is a story, told in several ways.................


Once there was a Buddhist monk who was approached by a woman who demanded that he make a choice between three options. One, sleep with her. Two, slaughter a goat to share dinner. Three, drink alcohol. If he chose no action she would commit suicide.

Thinking over the options :juggling: , the monk couldn't lose his celibacy or commit murder as these are cardinal sins in the Buddhist monastic rules. He also didn't want to leave the woman dead by refusing to act. So he figured drinking alcohol would have the least affect on others.

So the monk then drank the alcohol.. slept with the woman and killed the goat.

:namaste:
nopalabhyate...

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Astus
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Astus » Sun May 09, 2010 8:27 pm

Dexing,

Funny and wise! :applause:
Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.



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kirtu
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Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 5:29 pm
Location: Baltimore, MD

Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby kirtu » Sun May 09, 2010 11:26 pm



"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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Indrajala
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Indrajala » Mon May 10, 2010 2:53 am

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

Ngawang Drolma
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Ngawang Drolma » Mon May 10, 2010 5:36 am

This is in the Lounge which makes it a bit of a free-for-all.

It's my opinion that in regards to consuming meat and meat products, one should do as his/her teacher instructs him/her.

And if one is without a spiritual friend, use the common sense :)
And be compassionate.

Best,
Laura

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Astus
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Astus » Mon May 10, 2010 10:31 am

Huseng,

One shouldn't confuse killing with eating meat. They are not the same. The precept against killing includes asking someone else to do it, includes even telling others that it is OK to kill. But if you don't ask for it, it is not killed for you, there is no harm on one's "precept-body", neither is there intentional act (karma) of killing involved.

If eating meat is a problem because (in most cases) it is a result of someone killing an animal, and by buying meat one indirectly is involved in the meat industry, paying taxes is even more problematical. Or, for instance, I work at an IT company that I know is involved in government and military things too, therefore my work indirectly supports the soldiers on the battlefield.
Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.



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Indrajala
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Location: Netherlands
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby Indrajala » Mon May 10, 2010 10:34 am

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

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kirtu
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Re: Eating Meat vs. Drinking Alcohol--Which is worse?

Postby kirtu » Mon May 10, 2010 10:56 am



"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche


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