Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

lisehull
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Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by lisehull »

Has anyone read this book? If so, how complex is it? I am thinking of buying a copy but don't want to confuse my little brain.
:namaste:
Lise
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conebeckham
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by conebeckham »

Have not read it, but I plan on ordering it eventually.

I have read bits of Tai Situ Rinpoche's other recent volumes, which are really transcripts of teachings he's given in the context of various large empowerment groups--Kagyu Ngakdzo, etc. They are all good, and worth reading--if you're interested in the material, as it is specific to the topic. They're nice volumes--the ones I've seen.

For the Shangpa volume, my understanding is that these are transcripts of teachings given on the occasion of the bestowal of the Shangpa KaWang that was given at the request of Yangsi Kalu Rinpoche a few years back. There's limited info available on the web, regarding a table of contents, etc., so it's hard to say exactly what's included, but I'd bet there's a great deal of background information regarding the history of the lineage, major figures, and main practices--but I'd doubt the actual practice instructions would be included in any detail.

If you're interested specifically in the Shangpa lineage, I can recommend the following books:
Timeless Rapture is the best volume out there on the lives, and songs, of the Shangpa lineage masters.
Jamgon Kongtrul's Retreat Manual gives up quite a bit of info about the practices of the lineage themselves, though it's not only about the Shangpa lineage.
Luminous Mind by Kyabje Kalu Rinpoche covers the Shangpa lineage, as well as more general information about Buddhism in general and Vajrayana in particular. His other books, particularly Secret Buddhism, also have quite a few nuggets of information.
Like an Illusion contains some abridged life stories of the Masters, and some information about the lineage and practices as well. I wish that it were not abridged.

There are some other sources, as well......
དམ་པའི་དོན་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ཆེ་བ་དང་།
རྟོག་གེའི་ཡུལ་མིན་བླ་མའི་བྱིན་རླབས་དང་།
སྐལ་ལྡན་ལས་འཕྲོ་ཅན་གྱིས་རྟོགས་པ་སྟེ།
དེ་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ལ་ནི་ལོ་རྟོག་སེལ།།


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")
krodha
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by krodha »

lisehull wrote:Has anyone read this book? If so, how complex is it? I am thinking of buying a copy but don't want to confuse my little brain.
:namaste:
Lise
Sometimes confusing the brain is a good thing! Dedication to understanding something like a text which may not make sense at first is always a good thing in my eyes. Causes your perceptions and thought processes to evolve and grow :)
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conebeckham
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by conebeckham »

Forgot two really good books.....Kongtrul's "Sheja Kunkhyab," the volume translated as "Esoteric Instructions," has a great section on Shangpa. And Sarah Harding's Niguma book, how could I forget?!?
དམ་པའི་དོན་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ཆེ་བ་དང་།
རྟོག་གེའི་ཡུལ་མིན་བླ་མའི་བྱིན་རླབས་དང་།
སྐལ་ལྡན་ལས་འཕྲོ་ཅན་གྱིས་རྟོགས་པ་སྟེ།
དེ་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ལ་ནི་ལོ་རྟོག་སེལ།།


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")
lisehull
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by lisehull »

Thanks for the comments and the referrals to the other books.
Lise
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conebeckham
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by conebeckham »

I've just received this, and thumbed through it rather quickly. Look forward to reading it soon.

As I thought, this is a volume of transcribed oral teachings of Kyabje Dorje Chang Tai Situ Rinpoche, on the occasion of bestowing the Shangpa lineage transmissions at the request of Yangsi Kalu Rinpoche. As such, it has a lot of information about the Shangpa lineage and practices, as well as more general dharma teaching, expresed in the Guru's extemporaneous, sometimes playful and humorous, but always pithy and direct, way. It's not an "encyclopedia" of Shangpa, other volumes I mentioned above would better suit that description, but a collection of teachings directly from Kyabje Dorje Chang Tai Situ Rinpoche. Those with a connection to him, or to the Shangpa lineage, would definitely enjoy and benefit from this volume.
དམ་པའི་དོན་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ཆེ་བ་དང་།
རྟོག་གེའི་ཡུལ་མིན་བླ་མའི་བྱིན་རླབས་དང་།
སྐལ་ལྡན་ལས་འཕྲོ་ཅན་གྱིས་རྟོགས་པ་སྟེ།
དེ་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ལ་ནི་ལོ་རྟོག་སེལ།།


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")
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JinpaRangdrol
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by JinpaRangdrol »

conebeckham wrote:Forgot two really good books.....Kongtrul's "Sheja Kunkhyab," the volume translated as "Esoteric Instructions," has a great section on Shangpa. And Sarah Harding's Niguma book, how could I forget?!?
The Niguma book is fantastic.
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conebeckham
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by conebeckham »

Agreed!^
དམ་པའི་དོན་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ཆེ་བ་དང་།
རྟོག་གེའི་ཡུལ་མིན་བླ་མའི་བྱིན་རླབས་དང་།
སྐལ་ལྡན་ལས་འཕྲོ་ཅན་གྱིས་རྟོགས་པ་སྟེ།
དེ་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ལ་ནི་ལོ་རྟོག་སེལ།།


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")
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conebeckham
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by conebeckham »

So, an update to the list of publications:
Four Tibetan Lineages from the Tibetan Classics series has a good deal of previously unpublished stuff, translated by Sarah Harding, who is intimately familiar with this material.



It's been available for a while, and I commented about it elsewhere.

In a couple weeks, the first of two volumes from Dam Ngak Dzo will be published by Tsadra/SnowLion/Shambhala/MegaDharmaCorp... the first volume focuses mainly on the original source texts and the yidam practices specific to Shangpa Kagyu tradition.

དམ་པའི་དོན་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ཆེ་བ་དང་།
རྟོག་གེའི་ཡུལ་མིན་བླ་མའི་བྱིན་རླབས་དང་།
སྐལ་ལྡན་ལས་འཕྲོ་ཅན་གྱིས་རྟོགས་པ་སྟེ།
དེ་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ལ་ནི་ལོ་རྟོག་སེལ།།


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")
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heart
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by heart »

conebeckham wrote: Wed Jun 01, 2022 10:55 pm In a couple weeks, the first of two volumes from Dam Ngak Dzo will be published by Tsadra/SnowLion/Shambhala/MegaDharmaCorp... the first volume focuses mainly on the original source texts and the yidam practices specific to Shangpa Kagyu tradition.

I notice that all the material on six-armed makahala is missing from this text. What a shame.

/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)
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AmidaB
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by AmidaB »

heart wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 11:05 pm
conebeckham wrote: Wed Jun 01, 2022 10:55 pm In a couple weeks, the first of two volumes from Dam Ngak Dzo will be published by Tsadra/SnowLion/Shambhala/MegaDharmaCorp... the first volume focuses mainly on the original source texts and the yidam practices specific to Shangpa Kagyu tradition.

I notice that all the material on six-armed makahala is missing from this text. What a shame.

/magnus
This is vol. 1. hopefully we will find it in the vol. 2., because https://dnz.tsadra.org/index.php/Gdams_ ... /Volume_12 lists the related texts under 33., 34., 38. and 39.
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heart
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by heart »

AmidaB wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:04 am
heart wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 11:05 pm
conebeckham wrote: Wed Jun 01, 2022 10:55 pm In a couple weeks, the first of two volumes from Dam Ngak Dzo will be published by Tsadra/SnowLion/Shambhala/MegaDharmaCorp... the first volume focuses mainly on the original source texts and the yidam practices specific to Shangpa Kagyu tradition.

I notice that all the material on six-armed makahala is missing from this text. What a shame.

/magnus
This is vol. 1. hopefully we will find it in the vol. 2., because https://dnz.tsadra.org/index.php/Gdams_ ... /Volume_12 lists the related texts under 33., 34., 38. and 39.
There is nothing indicating that there will be a second volume of translated Shangpa teachings.

/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)
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AmidaB
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by AmidaB »

heart wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 12:26 pm
AmidaB wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:04 am
heart wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 11:05 pm

I notice that all the material on six-armed makahala is missing from this text. What a shame.

/magnus
This is vol. 1. hopefully we will find it in the vol. 2., because https://dnz.tsadra.org/index.php/Gdams_ ... /Volume_12 lists the related texts under 33., 34., 38. and 39.
There is nothing indicating that there will be a second volume of translated Shangpa teachings.

/magnus
Apart from the text on the cover, which says that 'The Translation of Khyungpo Naljor: PART I.'
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heart
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by heart »

AmidaB wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 1:04 pm
heart wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 12:26 pm
AmidaB wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:04 am
This is vol. 1. hopefully we will find it in the vol. 2., because https://dnz.tsadra.org/index.php/Gdams_ ... /Volume_12 lists the related texts under 33., 34., 38. and 39.
There is nothing indicating that there will be a second volume of translated Shangpa teachings.

/magnus
Apart from the text on the cover, which says that 'The Translation of Khyungpo Naljor: PART I.'
:emb: I didn't see that, sorry for the misplaced irritation. :smile:

/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)
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conebeckham
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by conebeckham »

heart wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 1:22 pm
AmidaB wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 1:04 pm
heart wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 12:26 pm

There is nothing indicating that there will be a second volume of translated Shangpa teachings.

/magnus
Apart from the text on the cover, which says that 'The Translation of Khyungpo Naljor: PART I.'
:emb: I didn't see that, sorry for the misplaced irritation. :smile:

/magnus

Volume two of the Shangpa is also in progress. The Chagdrupa texts are in there. (Not all of them are actually in the DamNgak Dzo, but will be interesting to see what gets translated.)
དམ་པའི་དོན་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ཆེ་བ་དང་།
རྟོག་གེའི་ཡུལ་མིན་བླ་མའི་བྱིན་རླབས་དང་།
སྐལ་ལྡན་ལས་འཕྲོ་ཅན་གྱིས་རྟོགས་པ་སྟེ།
དེ་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ལ་ནི་ལོ་རྟོག་སེལ།།


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")
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heart
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by heart »

conebeckham wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 8:18 pm
heart wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 1:22 pm
AmidaB wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 1:04 pm
Apart from the text on the cover, which says that 'The Translation of Khyungpo Naljor: PART I.'
:emb: I didn't see that, sorry for the misplaced irritation. :smile:

/magnus

Volume two of the Shangpa is also in progress. The Chagdrupa texts are in there. (Not all of them are actually in the DamNgak Dzo, but will be interesting to see what gets translated.)
:twothumbsup:
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)
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Pårl
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by Pårl »

This is on my shopping list too:
Screenshot 2022-06-11 143810.png
Screenshot 2022-06-11 143810.png (22.87 KiB) Viewed 1251 times
Although I'd like to source it from somewhere other than Amazon.
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heart
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by heart »

Pårl wrote: Sat Jun 11, 2022 1:40 pm This is on my shopping list too:

Screenshot 2022-06-11 143810.png

Although I'd like to source it from somewhere other than Amazon.
I have it, it's interesting but most of it comes from the Dam Ngak Dzö and so will also appear in the Tsadra translations.

/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)
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conebeckham
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by conebeckham »

heart wrote: Sat Jun 11, 2022 2:50 pm
Pårl wrote: Sat Jun 11, 2022 1:40 pm This is on my shopping list too:

Screenshot 2022-06-11 143810.png

Although I'd like to source it from somewhere other than Amazon.
I have it, it's interesting but most of it comes from the Dam Ngak Dzö and so will also appear in the Tsadra translations.

/magnus

This is true, but most (all?) of what's there in Four Tibetan Lineages will be in the second volume. First volume concerns root verses of the Five Golden Dharmas, as well as the two main yidam cycles unique to the Shangpa.
དམ་པའི་དོན་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ཆེ་བ་དང་།
རྟོག་གེའི་ཡུལ་མིན་བླ་མའི་བྱིན་རླབས་དང་།
སྐལ་ལྡན་ལས་འཕྲོ་ཅན་གྱིས་རྟོགས་པ་སྟེ།
དེ་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ལ་ནི་ལོ་རྟོག་སེལ།།


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")
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heart
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Re: Shangpa Kagyu Teachings

Post by heart »

conebeckham wrote: Sat Jun 11, 2022 9:08 pm
heart wrote: Sat Jun 11, 2022 2:50 pm
Pårl wrote: Sat Jun 11, 2022 1:40 pm This is on my shopping list too:

Screenshot 2022-06-11 143810.png

Although I'd like to source it from somewhere other than Amazon.
I have it, it's interesting but most of it comes from the Dam Ngak Dzö and so will also appear in the Tsadra translations.

/magnus

This is true, but most (all?) of what's there in Four Tibetan Lineages will be in the second volume. First volume concerns root verses of the Five Golden Dharmas, as well as the two main yidam cycles unique to the Shangpa.
Looking forward to read it.

/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)
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