Vegan Diet

[edearl]

According to the doctors who produced the documentary Forks Over Knives a vegan diet heals many cancers as well as veins and arteries that are clogged with cholesterol. The documentary also says that vegans are protected from osteoporosis and diabetes. Forks Over Knives is worth watching several times.

[padma norbu]

i enjoy it, personally... i eat meat when it is offered, but otherwise not. I always feel the difference; meat makes you feel like filth, basically. Is Forks Over Knives still streaming on Netflix? I can check in an instant, of course, just being lazy.

[Jesse]

I have been thinking about trying vegetarianism at least, vegan-ism may be a bit much.. My body sometimes will not lose the feeling of hunger until I eat meat.. how long does it take for that to go away?

What were your experiences in switching to a no meat diet?

[dakini_boi]

According to the doctors who produced the documentary Forks Over Knives a vegan diet heals many cancers as well as veins and arteries that are clogged with cholesterol. The documentary also says that vegans are protected from osteoporosis and diabetes. Forks Over Knives is worth watching several times.

It's important to mention that not any vegan diet will produce these results. In fact, vegans can easily be far more unhealthy than meat eaters, if they are not conscientious. Many damaging processed foods are technically vegan - such as refined flour, poor-quality plant fats (including hydrogenated oils), processed sugar, just to name a few. So I think a diet based on whole foods is the key. If someone is eating a typical diet of developed nations consisting of processed foods, fast foods, etc - then I think it's far more skillful to start eliminating these foods than to eliminate animal products per se. Then when you have stabilized on a diet based on organic whole grains, legumes, fruits & vegetables, pasture-raised animal products - then one may be able to transition to less animal products, and possibly eliminate them completely. But I've known many who went straight to vegan, but found they had no idea what to eat, other than processed soy and wheat "meat," vegan pizzas, etc - and their health suffered for it.

Now I haven't seen the film mentioned, and I imagine that the type of vegan diet promoted in the film is a healthy one - I just thought I'd post the above for the casual reader, so they don't have an unrealistic idea about a generalized "vegan diet."

[rory]

When I went from meat eater to veg finally 99% vegan. A very helpful thing is to always allow yourself,a monthly treat. Whatever you want. I used to salivate over the idea of hamburgers, ribs etc but after time went by they appealed less to me. Always give yourself this guilt-free option, otherwise you'll obsess. Sometimes I feel I must have meat/fish and I have it, no guilt.

Also you don't have to be perfect in any way. I'd suggest making chili with veggie soy bit & having an ear of corn, side of quinoa, or even easier put it all in a baked potato. Another easy recipe is w.w. spagetthi with faux meat sauce and toss in some frozen veggies. Quick and so healthful. Do go to whole grains, the only processed food I eat are meat substitutes, since my family likes them and I get lots of protein that way.

I hope this is helpful, never think you have to be %100. Take your time & start with easy recipes. I did & now I'm close to a gourmet vegan cook My dad is 87 became veg/vegan at 70. He has no arthritis, rhumatism, no prostate problems, he is mentally acute, never gets a cold, and goes to the gym with me. Everyone thinks he's much younger and is astounded when they find out his true age. I'm writing this to encourage you. Eating animals has karma: bad health & early aging.
gassho
rory

[Jesse]

Thanks, definitely helpful information.

At this point I think my tastes for meat may be more addictive in nature than anything, so much grease, sugar etc. I have noticed at least with soda that after I quit drinking it, I really have no desire to anymore..
Anyways, I think I will try veggy spaghetti tonight, sounds very good actually!

[Nemo]

Forks Over Knives is very ironic at times. About 15 minutes in they talk about diets high in animal protein causing cancer. In an Indian study mice on a very low animal protein diet exhibited less cancer than mice on a high animal protein diet. The mice were poisoned by aflatoxin. A fungal toxin found on fruits, veggies and grains. Especially nuts and legumes like peanuts. Liver cancer being one of the most common cancers among Vegans who ate tons of nuts back in the day when we didn't check for aflatoxin, probably including Steve Jobs.

Rats on the high animal protein diet got cancer. Fact! *
*But they all lived.
40% of the low animal protein diet rats died and the survivors showed significantly more liver necrosis than the carnivores.
But they didn't get cancer.

Stats show an insignificant difference between the cancer rates of veggies and omnivores.

[kirtu]

The documentary also says that vegans are protected from ... diabetes.

I'll check it out. I'm not vegan or vegetarian but I rarely eat meat (so twice a year on average by one measure except for tsok [Tibetan Buddhist feasts]). However my sole source of water is Dr. Pepper (and lately just Pepsi because my Chinese order out place doesn't have Dr. Pepper). This is a sure danger for diabetes over time no matter how well I eat otherwise.

Do they talk about something like this? Soy milk has just gotten too expensive.

Kirt

[rory]

Before there was Forks over Meat, there was the Adventist study; it's a continuing 50 year study on Seventh Day Adventists by the NIH , Adventists advocate a vegan diet, though they have members who are veg & meat eaters, so it makes for a great study as they have same beliefs, lifestyle (no smoking etc) & they can really compare. And their longevity and fitness is phenomenal.

Sam's Club has cheap soy milk, the local Jains I know shop there. If you want you can make it yourself, it's not hard & you have the leftover okara which is nourishing. You can avoid diabetes, my dad's mother had adult onset, my dad and I love sweets but are prudent, he doesn't have diabetes and I won't get it either. What I do is cook healthy at home but when I go out to eat with friends I have whatever I want. Try that.

For those wanting to try veg meals, just give it a whirl once or twice a week; that's great. Don't ever force yourself. Vegweb is a great resource for homey recipes:
http://vegweb.com/
gassho
Rory

[pemachophel]

As Tibetan, Ayurvedic, and Chinese medicines all teach, no one diet is correct for everyone. As a retired traditional Chinese doctor with more than 30 years clinical experience, anytime I hear anyone suggesting that anything (including water and oxygen) is universally good for everyone, I know I'm hearing partisan propaganda, not truly well-informed, wise, and experienced health care advice.

[edearl]

i enjoy it, personally... i eat meat when it is offered, but otherwise not. I always feel the difference; meat makes you feel like filth, basically. Is Forks Over Knives still streaming on Netflix? I can check in an instant, of course, just being lazy.

Still on Netflix.

[edearl]

I have been thinking about trying vegetarianism at least, vegan-ism may be a bit much.. My body sometimes will not lose the feeling of hunger until I eat meat.. how long does it take for that to go away?

What were your experiences in switching to a no meat diet?

People are usually addicted to the flavor of meat, and breaking an addiction can be difficult. One must make a commitment and be strong. Once I made the commitment, stopping to eat meat was not difficult, and after two months being able to stop blood pressure medication and Tricor (for high triglycerides) made me very happy and reinforced my commitment--continuing is easy.

[edearl]

According to the doctors who produced the documentary Forks Over Knives a vegan diet heals many cancers as well as veins and arteries that are clogged with cholesterol. The documentary also says that vegans are protected from osteoporosis and diabetes. Forks Over Knives is worth watching several times.

It's important to mention that not any vegan diet will produce these results. In fact, vegans can easily be far more unhealthy than meat eaters, if they are not conscientious. Many damaging processed foods are technically vegan - such as refined flour, poor-quality plant fats (including hydrogenated oils), processed sugar, just to name a few. So I think a diet based on whole foods is the key. If someone is eating a typical diet of developed nations consisting of processed foods, fast foods, etc - then I think it's far more skillful to start eliminating these foods than to eliminate animal products per se. Then when you have stabilized on a diet based on organic whole grains, legumes, fruits & vegetables, pasture-raised animal products - then one may be able to transition to less animal products, and possibly eliminate them completely. But I've known many who went straight to vegan, but found they had no idea what to eat, other than processed soy and wheat "meat," vegan pizzas, etc - and their health suffered for it.

Now I haven't seen the film mentioned, and I imagine that the type of vegan diet promoted in the film is a healthy one - I just thought I'd post the above for the casual reader, so they don't have an unrealistic idea about a generalized "vegan diet."

You are correct. Three books written by Dr. McDougal can help with assuring a proper vegan diet.

[edearl]

Thanks, definitely helpful information.

At this point I think my tastes for meat may be more addictive in nature than anything, so much grease, sugar etc. I have noticed at least with soda that after I quit drinking it, I really have no desire to anymore..
Anyways, I think I will try veggy spaghetti tonight, sounds very good actually!

People learn to like what they eat, and loose desire for foods they stop eating. I once ate cheeseburgers and loved them. However, after many years of not eating cheeseburgers, they now have a disgusting fatty flavor.

[edearl]

Forks Over Knives is very ironic at times. About 15 minutes in they talk about diets high in animal protein causing cancer. In an Indian study mice on a very low animal protein diet exhibited less cancer than mice on a high animal protein diet. The mice were poisoned by aflatoxin. A fungal toxin found on fruits, veggies and grains. Especially nuts and legumes like peanuts. Liver cancer being one of the most common cancers among Vegans who ate tons of nuts back in the day when we didn't check for aflatoxin, probably including Steve Jobs.

Rats on the high animal protein diet got cancer. Fact! *
*But they all lived.
40% of the low animal protein diet rats died and the survivors showed significantly more liver necrosis than the carnivores.
But they didn't get cancer.

Stats show an insignificant difference between the cancer rates of veggies and omnivores.

Reference please.

One can be poisoned by salmonella from eating chicken and other birds, and other pathogens that consume other kinds of meat. One must be careful not to eat any food that is infested with a pathogen.

[AdmiralJim]

I think anyone can take anything to extremes. I remember a couple of parents at a paediatric clinic whose children were suffering from iron deficiency anaemia and Rickets disease. It was traced back to their poor nutrient deficient vegan diets - we were blasted as propaganda doctors biased against veganism - they had to be threatened with social workers to get them to even give their children supplements - they didn't like modern medicine either. They had just recently moved to northern Scotland from abroad and didn't seem to appreciate that the sun doesn't shine enough to produce enough vitamin D for a growing child without eating fortified food or dairy products - it is so bad the government are considering fortifying common foods with Vit D as the sunlight problem is also linked to Scotland having the worst rate of multiple sclerosis in the world. All their crowing about us being biased fell on its face when we pointed we had to recently had to treat a child for Scurvy - yeah this shit happens in Scotland LOL - because all they ate was hamburgers and no vegetables.

[rory]

I take vitamins and Vit D supplements, it is very important, Ihave a physician who is also vegetarian so it's very helpful in discussing daily diet and what I am doing.

a good quick meal is the Adventist haystack
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haystack_% ... _haystacks
here is a link to the various Adventist health studies:
http://www.llu.edu/public-health/health/index.page
gassho
rory

[Nemo]

Forks Over Knives is very ironic at times. About 15 minutes in they talk about diets high in animal protein causing cancer. In an Indian study mice on a very low animal protein diet exhibited less cancer than mice on a high animal protein diet. The mice were poisoned by aflatoxin. A fungal toxin found on fruits, veggies and grains. Especially nuts and legumes like peanuts. Liver cancer being one of the most common cancers among Vegans who ate tons of nuts back in the day when we didn't check for aflatoxin, probably including Steve Jobs.

Rats on the high animal protein diet got cancer. Fact! *
*But they all lived.
40% of the low animal protein diet rats died and the survivors showed significantly more liver necrosis than the carnivores.
But they didn't get cancer.

Stats show an insignificant difference between the cancer rates of veggies and omnivores.

Reference please.

One can be poisoned by salmonella from eating chicken and other birds, and other pathogens that consume other kinds of meat. One must be careful not to eat any food that is infested with a pathogen.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14326435
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/4294825
http://www.westonaprice.org/blogs/2010/ ... er/#indian

[Adumbra]

Restricting the amount of meat in your diet is definitely healthy no matter your age or constitution. I myself went from being a heavy meat eater (ate meat every single day) to being totally vegan over a course of 2 years. While I have since started eating a small amount of seafood and dairy again, the experience taught me how dramatically diet impacts both physical and mental health. Even now I wish I could be totally vegan and not exploit and harm animals at all, but my body just doesn't seem to agree with me.

Personally, I'd like to be a breatharian since even with conventional agriculture you still have to kill vermin like insects and rodents as well as clear forests, pollute water and deplete soil. If it were possible to live on pure prana or chi like some Taoists can allegedly do, then no killing or exploitation would be necessary. I'm obviously not ready for such a change yet but I am working towards it. Maybe in a few years I will give it a try.

[Nemo]

Try supplementing with 1 gram of carnitine a day. Only costs 8$ a bottle. Tell me how it went after a month