gzhan stong and Great Madhyamaka

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Mariusz
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gzhan stong and Great Madhyamaka

Postby Mariusz » Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:18 pm

Last edited by Mariusz on Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Malcolm
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Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Malcolm » Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:21 pm

Last edited by Malcolm on Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.




འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

Mariusz
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Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Mariusz » Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:37 pm


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Malcolm
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Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Malcolm » Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:44 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

Mariusz
Posts: 708
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Mariusz » Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:50 pm


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conebeckham
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Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby conebeckham » Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:53 pm

I'm in agreement that this is all dancing on books--this being the Academic Discussion forum, of course that's what's done here. But I feel the need to point out that Yogacara was not merely a conceptual philosophy foisted upon us, but was an attempt to make sense of some real meditative experience, originally--or so I think. Also, all these categorizations into 6, 8, 9 or however-many consciousnesses need to be seen as dynamic attempts at explaining experience in a conceptual way, rather than as "positions" one must defend. Then again, maybe this is all inappropriate for the Academic Discussion.


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

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Malcolm
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Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Malcolm » Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:16 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

Mariusz
Posts: 708
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Mariusz » Wed Feb 15, 2012 7:33 pm


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Malcolm
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Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 2:19 am

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Malcolm » Wed Feb 15, 2012 7:42 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

Mariusz
Posts: 708
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Mariusz » Wed Feb 15, 2012 7:48 pm


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Malcolm
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Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 2:19 am

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Malcolm » Wed Feb 15, 2012 7:50 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

Mariusz
Posts: 708
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Mariusz » Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:01 pm


Mariusz
Posts: 708
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Mariusz » Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:47 pm


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Malcolm
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Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 2:19 am

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Malcolm » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:26 am





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

User avatar
Malcolm
Posts: 24173
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 2:19 am

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Malcolm » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:41 am





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

User avatar
conebeckham
Posts: 4553
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2010 11:49 pm
Location: Bay Area, CA, USA

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby conebeckham » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:50 am

I must confess, the denigration of Namdrol was pretty much the only part of your post I understood, Mariusz. I THINK you were trying to provide me with an answer, but I'll be damned if I understood what it was, nevermind the citations.

Are you trying to say that the ālayavijñāna neither exists, nor does not exist, etc? Are you attempting to equate the ālayavijñāna with the Two Truths?


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

Mariusz
Posts: 708
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Mariusz » Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:44 am


Mariusz
Posts: 708
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Mariusz » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:11 am


Mariusz
Posts: 708
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Mariusz » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:50 am


Mariusz
Posts: 708
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Re: ālayavijñāna--conventional or ultimate existent?

Postby Mariusz » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:32 am



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