teknix's Views

Discuss your personal experience with the Dharma here. How has it enriched your life? What challenges does it present?

Re: Finding a teacher when you dislike interaction

Postby catmoon » Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:56 pm

teknix wrote:
conebeckham wrote:So.......atoms have memories?

And the Tree and I are the same? I thought this essence was part of being human, but now you're telling me that it's also part of being a tree?

Dude, look....I am not a tree. A tree cannot post to the internet. Nor can I sprout leaves.

You need to develop discrimination.


I never said you are a tree or are anything for that matter. You are entangled atoms as is a tree. Tree's have energy as well, it is much more subtle and dense than any "qi" you may generate. You can even "draw upon" or "exchange with" the energy of a tree once you realize metta.


This is the kind of statement that will get you labelled as a New Ager. Cone has made some exceedingly cogent points and you would do well to examine them more closely. I don't know what you're into there bud, but it seems to me to have very little to do with Buddhism. If you keep making pronouncements as Truth without working from a Dharmic base, you are going to find all of your posts transferred to the "personal experience" forum.
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Re: Finding a teacher when you dislike interaction

Postby conebeckham » Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:56 pm

You said:
You are no different from a tree,


Then you said
I never said you are a tree or are anything for that matter
.

If something is "no different" from something else, then it is by definition the same.

Look, I can "draw on the energy of tree," without metta, by eating fruit. Or burning wood. This word "energy" is an amorphous concept merely meaning that which has the capacity to do or power work.

If, as you say, my "essence" is energy, then you must explain how that essence differs from that of a tree, or anything else, such that I can type on the internet, eat fruit, and start fires, while a tree, or a rock, cannot. Why is that?
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Re: Finding a teacher when you dislike interaction

Postby Tara » Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:58 pm

conebeckham wrote:Dude, look....I am not a tree. A tree cannot post to the internet. Nor can I sprout leaves.


Haha hahahaha hahahahahahahahahaha ha hahaha Image *gasp for breath* hahahaahaahhaaaaaaa.

(And there was me thinking I had been reading the posts of a Araucaria araucana tree all these years)

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Re: Finding a teacher when you dislike interaction

Postby teknix » Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:59 pm

catmoon wrote:
teknix wrote:
conebeckham wrote:So.......atoms have memories?

And the Tree and I are the same? I thought this essence was part of being human, but now you're telling me that it's also part of being a tree?

Dude, look....I am not a tree. A tree cannot post to the internet. Nor can I sprout leaves.

You need to develop discrimination.


I never said you are a tree or are anything for that matter. You are entangled atoms as is a tree. Tree's have energy as well, it is much more subtle and dense than any "qi" you may generate. You can even "draw upon" or "exchange with" the energy of a tree once you realize metta.


This is the kind of statement that will get you labelled as a New Ager. Cone has made some exceedingly cogent points and you would do well to examine them more closely. I don't know what you're into there bud, but it seems to me to have very little to do with Buddhism. If you keep making pronouncements as Truth without working from a Dharmic base, you are going to find all of your posts transferred to the "personal experience" forum.


Please describe the dharmic base as anything other than liberation from suffering, that stems from greed and desires that I might avoid any pitfalls in the future, thanks!

If you are asking for "proof" within the non-locality, I will be happy to oblige. I just doubt it would aid you much on the discovery that must take place within.

Any "label" you stick to me is not describing me at all, it only describes your perspective. As limited as that perspective appears to be, I am not asking for anyone to believe me, only to find out the validity personally.
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Re: Absolute void as hazardous? (split)

Postby conebeckham » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:01 am

Where to start?

There is no "I" that peers into a void....rather, that "I" is as much void as that which it is allegedly peering into....

Buddha taught personal selflessness in the First Turning of the Wheel, and phenomenal selfless in the Second Turning of the Wheel.

To feel that one might "succumb" to something hazardous is self-cherishing, born of ignorance. This experience of "peering into the void" is a conceptual construct, nothing more.
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Re: Absolute void as hazardous? (split)

Postby Tara » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:02 am

wisdom wrote:The fear of emptiness comes from having a strong ego. Realizing emptiness means death for the ego, and the ego will do whatever it can to prevent that. This is why guidance and teachers are good to have on the path. When we try to do it all on our own, we will find it very difficult to surmount these many obstacles by ourselves. Even reincarnated Bodhisattvas will seek the guidance of teachers. Even Buddha had teachers. Every great master that I can think of in any spiritual tradition had teachers. I suggest you follow their example and do the same.


:good:

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Re: Finding a teacher when you dislike interaction

Postby teknix » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:05 am

Maybe we can forgo the mocking "high-fives" and "slap on the backs" for irrelevant critique. It is quite childish and conformist.
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Re: Absolute void as hazardous? (split)

Postby Mr. G » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:13 am

So stop reifying emptiness as an object of meditation.
    How foolish you are,
    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu
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Re: Finding a teacher when you dislike interaction

Postby conebeckham » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:18 am

I dunno, I thought my leaf-sprouting idea was pretty funny.....on it's own.

Look, Teknix, this is a forum about Buddhism. It's called "Dharma Wheel." It's not called "All-Is-One Wheel" or "Syncretic Systems" wheel. Anyone can make statements about anything here, as far as I'm concerned, but those statements will be examined under the lens of BuddhaDharma as it's understood by the participants. Ideally, this will allow all participants to develop their understanding of what exactly BuddhaDharma is--in actuality, there can be "teaching" in the "interaction" we have here. For most of us, though, the practical methods must be learned in person from a holder of the Tradition. For some of us, it seems, we are not content to learn, or even to engage in examination of our positions, but in fact would rather formulate our own conceptual elaboration of things, and foist it on others, without regard to coherence, or even consensual meaning.
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Re: Finding a teacher when you dislike interaction

Postby teknix » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:22 am

Thrasymachus wrote:I feel much the same as the topic starter. I never felt like I belonged to this world, to American society, to capitalist society. I don't like the company of most other people. Since I discovered Buddhism in 2008 via books it made me change my life. It made me stop doing drugs, contributed to my going vegan and want to avoid other non-virtuous activities. It made me realize that most other people are toxic, negative influences. It is like they say in Buddhist teachings, humans have much more potential than to just avoid suffering and avoid pain, even animals can do that. However if you look at your immediate environment, unless perhaps if you are in a monastery, everyone just seeks out greed, hedonism and to avoid what is unpleasant. It is not a very inspiring example, it drags you down closer to their level even if you want to seek a more virtuous path you just get discouraged.

However I have done more bogarting, wasting time, reading books, than actual mediation. Partly because my life is more of an existential crisis than something immanently livable and I have lots of negative sub-conscious beliefs, discomfort, and a bad environment. I can only wonder if I was more serious in my practice how different my life would have been. In the beginning of 2011 I went on on a week health retreat and it made me feel alot better while there, because the people there were oriented toward self-improvement and gossip was discouraged. Even though I didn't know those people people I felt much better around them than amongst my own family and so called friends.

I read a little in e-sangha about a Chinese Buddhist monk, Hsuan Hua, who become quite renowned without the benefit of a sangha, recourse to a monastery, or much retreat, but just using his own discipline to meditate in his own village. But I don't think I, or most people are like that, that we can follow his same methods. I realize now that it would be better if I find a sangha and teacher, but it doesn't seem there are many in northern New Jersey where I live. And even if there is one, I intensely don't trust most other Westerners. It seems everyone just centers their life on their relationship to money and vices in their spare time like tv, internet, drugs, alcohol. I wonder can even dharma practitioners be any different? Can they ever overcome the negative karma of the deeds they must make in the name of corporations to procure a living?


Part of your suffering is made evident in your post. Maybe I can point it out that it may help you.

" I can only wonder if I was more serious in my practice how different my life would have been."

These what if's are irrelevant and a hindrance regardless of where you are on the path. The focus should be directed towards what is occurring "NOW", within each moment.

Generally people will bring you "down" until you have "strengthened" enough to bring them "up". That people can bring you down is actually a gift of being able to switch perspectives. The gift is in being able to control it rather than it controlling you, that you may use that perspective to relate.

Working towards a symbiosis with the planet should be our main concern as a humanity IMO. Wants are often misconstrued as needs in our society. When Wants of one outweigh the needs of another, there is an injustice. (IMO)
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Re: Finding a teacher when you dislike interaction

Postby teknix » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:26 am

conebeckham wrote:I dunno, I thought my leaf-sprouting idea was pretty funny.....on it's own.

Look, Teknix, this is a forum about Buddhism. It's called "Dharma Wheel." It's not called "All-Is-One Wheel" or "Syncretic Systems" wheel. Anyone can make statements about anything here, as far as I'm concerned, but those statements will be examined under the lens of BuddhaDharma as it's understood by the participants. Ideally, this will allow all participants to develop their understanding of what exactly BuddhaDharma is--in actuality, there can be "teaching" in the "interaction" we have here. For most of us, though, the practical methods must be learned in person from a holder of the Tradition. For some of us, it seems, we are not content to learn, or even to engage in examination of our positions, but in fact would rather formulate our own conceptual elaboration of things, and foist it on others, without regard to coherence, or even consensual meaning.


I encourage you to present conflicting statements I have made, that I may alter course and approach from an alternative angle.

If your claim is that I offend the Buddha in anyway, then you better back it up.
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Re: Finding a teacher when you dislike interaction

Postby conebeckham » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:33 am

teknix wrote:
conebeckham wrote:I dunno, I thought my leaf-sprouting idea was pretty funny.....on it's own.

Look, Teknix, this is a forum about Buddhism. It's called "Dharma Wheel." It's not called "All-Is-One Wheel" or "Syncretic Systems" wheel. Anyone can make statements about anything here, as far as I'm concerned, but those statements will be examined under the lens of BuddhaDharma as it's understood by the participants. Ideally, this will allow all participants to develop their understanding of what exactly BuddhaDharma is--in actuality, there can be "teaching" in the "interaction" we have here. For most of us, though, the practical methods must be learned in person from a holder of the Tradition. For some of us, it seems, we are not content to learn, or even to engage in examination of our positions, but in fact would rather formulate our own conceptual elaboration of things, and foist it on others, without regard to coherence, or even consensual meaning.


I encourage you to present conflicting statements I have made, that I may alter course and approach from an alternative angle.


I have. See above, regarding Trees and me....you can also check out the split thread about Peering Into the Void, if you'd like.

If your claim is that I offend the Buddha in anyway, then you better back it up.

How silly. You can not offend the Buddha in any way. The Buddha is beyond offense. You can, however, create karmic seeds.
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Re: Finding a teacher when you dislike interaction

Postby Thrasymachus » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:40 am

I think you have a lot to learn, texnix. When I first discovered Tibetan Buddhist via the book The Joy of Living by Yongey Mingyur Rinpoche, I thought I didn't need teachers when I could just have books. That I didn't need a sangha, that I only needed myself. But since then I have seen lots of studies that show how your social environment, those around you effect you. Also you cannot convince people to take steps toward enlightenment or self-improvement that they are not receptive toward. It does not matter what you do, something has to happen in their lives to make them receptive to outside change. In Buddhism they explain this in terms of past karma. In the example of my going vegan, in the back of The Jungle by Upton Sinclair there were lots of articles of the past and modern meat-packing industry that I read. I thought it was so messed up, what happened to fodder animals, that I wished I had the strength or discipline to at least go vegetarian. But nothing happened until I saw my cat die in 2009, which I had with me for 14 years. When I saw how she just wanted to avoid suffering, the pathetic look in her eyes, when I saw her convulsing out of breath like a fish on the floor, it made me realize I could not do that other animals, by eating them. People don't just change because you are so awesome or enlightened, and it is not your personal failure if they don't.

I have come to believe that somehow through mental intuition the Buddhist canon is really the world vanguard, that they have discovered what some of the best and most uplifting discoveries of Western science(which is overall non-virtuous) are just beginning to scratch. When they advise to seek sanctuary from mundane concerns in a retreat, to find a teacher/root guru, to join a sangha, it is not just something they say to say it or for no reason. These are things that are really beneficial.
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Re: Finding a teacher when you dislike interaction

Postby teknix » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:41 am

conebeckham wrote:
I have. See above, regarding Trees and me....you can also check out the split thread about Peering Into the Void, if you'd like.


No, I am sorry but it is not relevant. You assumed I was saying you are a tree, that is your assumption, nothing to do with what I said. In fact, would be willing to wager that the Buddha is delighted that Quantum Mechanics provides insight into how reincarnation can exist.

Maybe the subtleties presented are beyond proper comprehension, but It doesn't seem like you ever tried and would rather debate and accuse. If there is any semblance of understanding in the other thread you mentioned, then I retract the previous statement.
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Re: teknix's Views

Postby teknix » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:45 am

Ah, so comse the exercise of Power, inherent within corruption, greed, and desire. What little power you think you have has no effect over me.

Let's see how bloated these ego's are.
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Re: teknix's Views

Postby Malcolm » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:48 am

teknix wrote:
Let's see how bloated these ego's are.


You might have to deflate your own a little, to make some room.
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Re: Absolute void as hazardous? (split)

Postby teknix » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:49 am

The fear of emptiness maybe reconciled within the ego, absolute void is not something one generally experiences without it becoming absolute nothingness.

There was not fear, but negativity and nothingness radiating. The void of emptiness is not an absolute nothingness. This of course is likely beyond your experiences to realize at this point.
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Re: teknix's Views

Postby teknix » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:51 am

Namdrol wrote:
teknix wrote:
Let's see how bloated these ego's are.


You might have to deflate your own a little, to make some room.


It takes an ego to point at an ego.

You may interpret my confidence however you choose, that is your right, although it does NOT say anything about me.

It is often the case when ones beliefs come into question, a self-defense mechanism designed to contain energy within a given structure or form is unleashed to aid in justifying the falseness.
Last edited by teknix on Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:55 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: teknix's Views

Postby Malcolm » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:54 am

teknix wrote:
Namdrol wrote:
teknix wrote:
Let's see how bloated these ego's are.


You might have to deflate your own a little, to make some room.


It takes an ego to point at an ego.

You may interpret my confidence however you choose, that is your right, although it does NOT say anything about me.



Image
http://www.bhaisajya.net
http://www.bhaisajya.guru
http://atikosha.org
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

Though there are infinite liberating gateways of Dharma,
there are none not included in the dimension of the knowledge of the Great Perfection.

-- Buddha Samantabhadri
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Re: teknix's Views

Postby Malcolm » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:55 am

teknix wrote:
It takes an ego to point at an ego.



And?
http://www.bhaisajya.net
http://www.bhaisajya.guru
http://atikosha.org
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

Though there are infinite liberating gateways of Dharma,
there are none not included in the dimension of the knowledge of the Great Perfection.

-- Buddha Samantabhadri
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