The dukha of student loans.

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Indrajala
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The dukha of student loans.

Postby Indrajala » Thu Mar 25, 2010 7:20 am

Does anyone else suffer student loans?

I'm slowly paying mine off, but I've had many nightmares dealing with the government agencies that deal with them.

All around the world it seems so many youth have to suffer a debt sentence in order to get an education and secure the promised middle-class lifestyle (which is no guarantee).

It is a source of never ending grief for a lot of people. In fact it leads to suicides in some extreme cases too. In Canada for example you can't even escape student loans through bankruptcy unless you've been out of school for eight years. The government even sells student debt to private collection agencies that will stop at nothing and even harass relatives.

One thing that comes to mind is the potential hindrance that comes with debt when it comes to dharmic practise. If you want to go on a lengthy retreat, you probably can't do it with a boatload of debt on your back (it would be funny nevertheless to tell them that you're going to meditate in a cave for three years and thus won't have any income at all). As far as I know, according to the Vinaya you can't ordain if you have existing debt (or is it just one version of the vinaya that states that?).
tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

Clueless Git
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Clueless Git » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:03 pm

'Lo Huseng :)

You are not going to like me for saying this, BUT!

The 'purpose' of student loans is to deter people from taking an expensive education unless they intend to use it to pay society back by using that education to earn big bucks. Big bucks meaning big taxes, obviously ..

I come from the pre loan generation myself and I remember it well. Every work-shy waster who had half a brain would use Uni as a 3-5 year skive off of work and then, being work shy, would never use that education for society's gain.

They would complete uni and then turn buddhist and want to go live in a cave, that kinda thing?

The student loan is their legacy. A little bit of the old 'the sins of the fathers shall be visited upon the sons' going on there. In buddhist terms I guess that would be something akin to the new generation reaping the karmic fruits of the last.

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Indrajala
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Indrajala » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:34 pm

However, the purpose of post-secondary education -- in particular in universities -- is not to produce higher income earners, but to foster learning, education and understanding of a myriad of topics. Universities nominally on paper at least do not operate on business models and their charters specify providing education as their key goal. It doesn't specify producing high income taxpayers who can provide added capital to the public coffers.

In that sense, whether you study commerce or abhidharma, the end result of earning potential shouldn't be stressed so much.

Also, I might add that several decades ago university tuition was far cheaper than it is now.

As one gentleman told me, "When I was in university I could work in the summer and earn enough to cover all my expenses during the year."

Unless you already have a high paying trade or something, you can't reasonably be expected to earn $11,000 in four months nowadays!
tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

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Sönam
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Sönam » Thu Mar 25, 2010 1:06 pm

I'm no more in age to get a loan (at all).
But as far as I can remember, students when they wanted to pursue studies shared there time half for uni half for work, so they were financing them self ... and it works, and it brought them freedom from establishment. But that was another period of time.
Any educated student, should understand what is a loan ... an engagement to a particular system that they will never quit until they take engagements in the capitalistic system (loans principes).
So they are stuke from the beginning ! ... are our students so uneducated ?

Sönam :smile:
By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby ChangYuan » Sat Mar 27, 2010 5:26 pm

I wouldn't say that people are so uneducated, but they are stuck. If you don't come from a family of means, you have no choices but to either get student loans and go to a public university, getting a hopefully middle class job after; or don't get student loans, and work low paying blue collar jobs and be struggling with making ends meet for the rest of your life.
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Luke
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Luke » Sat Mar 27, 2010 10:15 pm


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Indrajala
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Indrajala » Sun Mar 28, 2010 2:14 am

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby ChangYuan » Sun Mar 28, 2010 4:15 am

Amituofo


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Sönam
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Sönam » Sun Mar 28, 2010 9:12 am

By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

Clueless Git
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Clueless Git » Sun Mar 28, 2010 12:41 pm


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Indrajala
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Indrajala » Sun Mar 28, 2010 3:12 pm

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

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Sönam
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Sönam » Sun Mar 28, 2010 4:29 pm

By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

Clueless Git
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Clueless Git » Mon Mar 29, 2010 10:47 am


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Sönam
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Sönam » Mon Mar 29, 2010 12:23 pm

By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

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Luke
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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby Luke » Mon Mar 29, 2010 4:14 pm

This thread has focused on only money so far. I think there is another way for college graduates to give back to society: They could become teachers in high schools. In many countries, there is a shortage of good teachers.

Another thing I want to mention is that young people aren't just compelled to go to college for economic reasons. Many go for social reasons. For example, many people unfortunately look down at people who did not go to college. So many young people go to college simply to remain with their peer group and maintain their social status than for educational reasons. And some women go to college simply to find a "suitable" husband for themselves.

So there are many other forces at play here other than economic ones.

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Re: The dukha of student loans.

Postby thomcoes » Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:10 am



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