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Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises - Dhamma Wheel

Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

General discussion of issues related to Theravada Meditation, e.g. meditation postures, developing a regular sitting practice, skillfully relating to difficulties and hindrances, etc.
zazang
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Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 9:21 am

Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby zazang » Tue Jun 29, 2010 3:17 pm

Greetings

I find that the methodical scanning of body for sensations from head to toe appears to me a bit too long a process.
Are there real statistics of people who became Arahant with this technique ?
What is even more difficult for me to understand is waiting until a sensation arises in a body part. Sometimes the brain may fool us
into believing that a sensation arose just by thinking that the sensation should arise ?
Do you think that the Buddha would have been doing the same ?
Can we not take the approach of going through each part of the body and if nothing arose then move to the next part but not wait for a sensation.
Or maybe simply note whatever prominent arises.

Also , how does one realize that the aggregate of perception is also impermanent using this technique ?

Metta
zazang

PeterB
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby PeterB » Tue Jun 29, 2010 3:23 pm

I was taught something rather different to what you describe Zazang. I was taught to scan the body and note what is arising. Not to wait for something to arise . The noting will over time involve more and more subtle arisings. But if nothing notable arises ...move on.
Do you have a teacher ?

zazang
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Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 9:21 am

Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby zazang » Tue Jun 29, 2010 3:29 pm

Thank you PeterB. I have heard this kind of noting practice in Goenka's audio discourse
and then decided to try it.
Very soon I'll be taking a 10 day retreat in Goenka's style and thats why I asked these questions.

Also , any idea how perceptions ( vinanna aggregate ) will appear impermanent with this technique since we
are only noting sensations !

Metta
zazang

PeterB
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby PeterB » Tue Jun 29, 2010 3:36 pm

Over time Zazang we note with greater and greater clarity the arising and passing of sensations , this begins a process of "joining up the dots" as we see the truth of anicca within ourselves for ourselves.

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Goofaholix
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby Goofaholix » Tue Jun 29, 2010 8:11 pm


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Modus.Ponens
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby Modus.Ponens » Tue Jun 29, 2010 8:25 pm

I'm with Goofaholix. Give the technique a chance in a 10 day retreat.
He turns his mind away from those phenomena, and having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.'
(Jhana Sutta - Thanissaro Bhikkhu translation)

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Ben
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby Ben » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:21 pm

“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

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Goofaholix
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby Goofaholix » Wed Jun 30, 2010 12:25 am

Even if you choose to do a different technique later on the sensitivity to the sensations in the body that you develop with this technique can be valuable when you do other techniques.

The same could be said for noting practice, Goenka doesn't teach a lot about mindfulness so having a grounding in noting practice can help you if you later do body sweeping.

This is assuming that you don't try to mish mash the techniques up, which is not what I'm talking about.

zazang
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 9:21 am

Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby zazang » Wed Jun 30, 2010 1:56 am

wow thanks so much for the replies..I will give the 10 day retreat a fair try !

Metta
zazang

PeterB
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby PeterB » Wed Jun 30, 2010 7:27 am

Good for you. :thumbsup:

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jcsuperstar
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby jcsuperstar » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:04 am

สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

PeterB
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby PeterB » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:08 am


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jcsuperstar
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby jcsuperstar » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:25 am

i don't think my post is negative in any way....
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

PeterB
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby PeterB » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:42 am

Well re-read it.
You first posit a doubt about whether he is REALLY interested..this man unlike many who profess an interest in Dhamma is devoting ten days of his life to an demanding regime. he is getting off his butt and actually doing something other than stating views and splitting semantic hairs..
You then use the expression "waste of time" which is much stronger than the qualification that you hedge the phrase about with..and outweighs the "wont".
Your actual position leaks far more than you realise.

For goodness sake we should be cheering a real attempt involving leaving behind the familiar and comforting and attempting to actually DO Buddhadhamma. Not telling people that if they fail they can always try something else.

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jcsuperstar
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby jcsuperstar » Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:00 am

:thinking: i think you're reading the negativity into it... :shrug:
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

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Ben
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Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby Ben » Wed Jun 30, 2010 12:16 pm

Gentlemen,
Let's return to topic.
kind regards

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

zazang
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 9:21 am

Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby zazang » Wed Jun 30, 2010 12:33 pm

Hey metta to all..I did not mind anything :)

I am finding that the more we attach weight to events in our life ( like "oh he told me [email protected]!"..."Let me correct him by replying appropriately ")
, the more sankharas we deposit..and I cannot tell how much it is helping me by simply remembering the truth that these deposited sankharas
are the real problem in our way to enlightenment( no wonder the Buddha said "Sabbe Sankhar nirodha" if I'm not wrong )..once we remember the
danger inherent in depositing any sankhara, we start ignoring most events and this aids in being peaceful. Likewise , even if an old sankhara pops up , I decide not to attach any weight to it simply by remembering the truth that how dangerous these sankharas are if we feed them by getting affected by them.

Is this a right practice according to Dhamma ?

Metta
zazang

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Ben
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Location: kanamaluka

Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby Ben » Wed Jun 30, 2010 12:47 pm

“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

User avatar
kc2dpt
Posts: 957
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 3:48 pm

Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby kc2dpt » Wed Jun 30, 2010 1:32 pm

- Peter


zazang
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 9:21 am

Re: Methodical scanning vs Noting what arises

Postby zazang » Wed Jun 30, 2010 1:44 pm

Thank you Ben..Thats very encouraing !


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