YOU CANNOT POST. OUR WEB HOSTING COMPANY DECIDED TO MOVE THE SERVER TO ANOTHER LOCATION. IN THE MEANTIME, YOU CAN VIEW THIS VERSION WHICH DOES NOT ALLOW POSTING AND WILL NOT SAVE ANYTHING YOU DO ONCE THE OTHER SERVER GOES ONLINE.

How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality? - Page 3 - Dhamma Wheel

How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Casual discussion amongst spiritual friends.
User avatar
Sekha
Posts: 789
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:32 am
Location: Earth
Contact:

Re: How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Postby Sekha » Mon Jun 21, 2010 4:47 pm

Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

http://www.buddha-vacana.org

PeterB
Posts: 3909
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:35 pm

Re: How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Postby PeterB » Mon Jun 21, 2010 5:22 pm

I dont think that Tilt was providing a critique of Christianity, Dukkhanirodha. I am sure that he will soon say if I am wrong but I think he was saying that there is little point in substituting one rationale for suppression of sexuality ( Christian ) with a more Buddhist sounding one.
As I say thats my take on his take.

User avatar
zavk
Posts: 1161
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 12:04 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Postby zavk » Tue Jun 22, 2010 2:14 am

With metta,
zavk

User avatar
jcsuperstar
Posts: 1915
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 5:15 am
Location: alaska
Contact:

Re: How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Postby jcsuperstar » Tue Jun 22, 2010 6:47 am

we also need to keep in mind the HUGE influence colonialism played on changing the social values of pretty much every culture in Asia, even those that weren't colonized had to respond to it and make changes because of it.
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

User avatar
zavk
Posts: 1161
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 12:04 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Postby zavk » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:43 am

With metta,
zavk

User avatar
Lazy_eye
Posts: 996
Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2009 3:23 pm
Location: Laurel, MD
Contact:

Re: How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Postby Lazy_eye » Tue Jun 22, 2010 7:15 pm

Thanks, Zavk and JC, those are great observations.

It makes sense to me that if we think mainly in terms of a "deconditioning" process, then we don't fall into the desire-guilt trap. The dhamma strikes me as representing a potentially healthier point of view in that the Buddha didn't deny that sexuality is a form of worldly joy, whereas Christianity (as I understand it) tends to see it as inherently linked to Satan and the fall, and thus "bad" in some essential sense.

The feeling of guilt is closely linked to the fear of punishment; it basically represents internalization of the punishing God or father-figure. Buddhism has retribution too, though the agent is kamma (and thus ultimately ourselves). Still, I wonder if popular Buddhism, as practiced in some of the traditionally Buddhist cultures, does apply some of the same fear and guilt-inducing strategies...I'm thinking of those frightening depictions of hell realms seen in Chinese tradition. "Hell anxiety" seems to be as much a factor for some Buddhists as "fear of God" is for some Christians.

Also, although arguably it's not so central to the dhamma, Buddhism has its own version of the Eden myth, as seen in the Aganna sutta.

What kinds of attitudes towards sexuality tend to be prevalent among Buddhists born and raised in, say, Thailand? Or China? To what extent are those attitudes driven by culture, and to what extent by religious education? I know this is a broad question... How might an "ordinary" practicing Chinese or Thai Buddhist, born and raised in an environment where dhamma was present, respond to the OP in this thread?

User avatar
zavk
Posts: 1161
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 12:04 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Postby zavk » Tue Jul 06, 2010 12:18 am

Hey LE

I forgot about your post. Was away on retreat last week. I'll post some comments when I have the time.
With metta,
zavk

User avatar
Lazy_eye
Posts: 996
Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2009 3:23 pm
Location: Laurel, MD
Contact:

Re: How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Postby Lazy_eye » Wed Jul 07, 2010 12:10 am


User avatar
zavk
Posts: 1161
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 12:04 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Postby zavk » Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:22 am

With metta,
zavk

User avatar
zavk
Posts: 1161
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 12:04 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Postby zavk » Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:23 am

With metta,
zavk

User avatar
Lazy_eye
Posts: 996
Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2009 3:23 pm
Location: Laurel, MD
Contact:

Re: How has the Dhamma influenced your experience of sexuality?

Postby Lazy_eye » Fri Jul 09, 2010 8:09 pm

Hi again, Zavk,

Your post reminded me of something my wife, who is Chinese, told me awhile back. She said that a woman brought up in Chinese culture typically feels embarassed about pregnancy because "it means that everyone knows you've been having sex".

I found that comment fascinating, especially because the concern seemed to apply regardless of marriage or other social/religious sanction. By contrast, in Christian culture, the concern seems to be more about whether the behavior is OK "in God's eyes".

I'm partial to structuralist approaches, so yes, I very much liked the WHAT-WHY-HOW-GOAL paradigm. I suppose for Buddhism it would go something like this:

WHAT: Attachment to sense pleasures
WHY: Because it keeps you stuck in samsara
HOW: Sila, samadhi, panna
GOAL(s): happier present life, fortunate rebirth, ultimate liberation

By contrast:

(Christian)

WHAT: Desire
WHY: Original sin
HOW: Adhere to "God's law," confess sin
GOAL: Unity with God, salvation

(Greek)

WHAT: Pleasure
WHY: Unbecoming for the virtuous and wise
HOW: Moderation and cultivation
GOAL: Self mastery

So how would you apply this model to Western secularism?


Return to “Lounge”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests

Google Saffron, Theravada Search Engine