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Need some help please. - Dhamma Wheel

Need some help please.

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
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Hunter
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Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 5:16 pm

Need some help please.

Postby Hunter » Mon Jun 21, 2010 8:21 pm

A few years back I got into the concept of enlightenment. I wanted to be enlightened really bad and because of this I made a mistake. I lied to some people that I attained a state of enlightenment. I feel really bad now and I saw that in the Vinaya that if a Bhikku lies about attaining a state of enlightenment that he is defeated and expelled from the sangha, does this mean that I cant practice Buddhism? Is there anyway I can purify myself of this? Can I not become a Stream-Enterer now?
the Buddha said :

"Intention, monks, is karma, I say. Having willed, one acts through body, speech and mind."

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cooran
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Location: Queensland, Australia

Re: Need some help please.

Postby cooran » Mon Jun 21, 2010 8:36 pm

Hello Hunter,

Rest easy :group: - it was wrong speech, but I really doubt if anyone believed you at the time. Otherwise you'd have a gang of disciples following you about. :jumping: Just let it go, and follow the Teachings to the best of your ability from now on - what is done is past and cannot be undone. Every single one of us has done worse than this within beginningless time.

with metta
Chris
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---

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Hunter
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Re: Need some help please.

Postby Hunter » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:02 pm

So, does this mean that because im not a Bhikku now and did that dumb action that I can still be accepted into the sangha as a Bhikku. I have been considering becomming a Bhikku for a while now.
the Buddha said :

"Intention, monks, is karma, I say. Having willed, one acts through body, speech and mind."

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Tex
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Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 9:46 pm
Location: Austin, TX, USA

Re: Need some help please.

Postby Tex » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:04 pm

If the mass murderer Angulimala was able to attain Nibbana in the very same lifetime, surely you can still attain stream entry after telling a lie...

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html

:buddha2:
"To reach beyond fear and danger we must sharpen and widen our vision. We have to pierce through the deceptions that lull us into a comfortable complacency, to take a straight look down into the depths of our existence, without turning away uneasily or running after distractions." -- Bhikkhu Bodhi

"No man ever steps in the same river twice, for it's not the same river and he's not the same man." -- Heraclitus

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Goofaholix
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Re: Need some help please.

Postby Goofaholix » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:05 pm


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Nibbida
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Re: Need some help please.

Postby Nibbida » Tue Jun 22, 2010 3:14 am

Rather than punishing yourself for it, use it as an opportunity to investigate with mindfulness. Examine what was going on, what is going on when you remember it. It sounds like a study in craving. Instead of it just being a mistake, it can become an opportunity for learning. It's all grist for the mill.

Oh yeah, and how about throwing in a little compassion for oneself while you're at it? Couldn't hurt. Everyone knows what it's like to make a mistake when in the grips of craving, and how that leads to suffering. Compassion is always the appropriate response to suffering, even (or especially) when it's toward yourself.

Check out this excerpt from Gil Fronsdal's Issue At Hand:

Sila is usually translated as “virtue” or “ethics,” but we need to be careful not to confuse it with Western ideas of virtue and ethics. A traditional foundation of Western ethics is commandments and values often handed down from a god. These values include ideas about right and wrong, good and evil, and absolute rules that we have to live by. This approach to ethics leads easily to guilt, an emotion that is pervasive in the West, but which is considered unnecessary and counterproductive in Buddhism.

Buddhism understands virtue and ethics pragmatically, based not on ideas of good and bad, but rather on the observation that some actions lead to suffering and some actions lead to happiness and freedom. A Buddhist asks, “Does this action lead to increased suffering or increased happiness, for myself and others?” This pragmatic approach is more conducive to investigation than to guilt.



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Emi
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Re: Need some help please.

Postby Emi » Tue Jun 22, 2010 10:46 am

"When all you've got is nothing, there's a lot to go around."

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Hunter
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Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 5:16 pm

Re: Need some help please.

Postby Hunter » Tue Jun 22, 2010 2:26 pm

Thank you all for helping me. The fact that I did that really made me feel bad and what you have all said has really helped me and I feel that I am ready to proceed with my practice thanks to you all!

Nibbida, thank you for what you said and you are right. Instead of sitting around and beating myself up, I could use it to help me with my prctice.

Tex, your right. If Angulimala can kill 999 people then be ordained as a monk and attain Arhatship in the same life, I guess I can too. I look at it like this: Had Angulimala been a Bhikku when he killed he would have been expelled. Had I of lied about that while being of Bhukku it would have been an offence. But because im not a Bhikku I dont have to worry about anything but some bad karma from lying. Thanks Tex!

Thanks again everyone!
the Buddha said :

"Intention, monks, is karma, I say. Having willed, one acts through body, speech and mind."

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Goedert
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Location: SC, Brazil

Re: Need some help please.

Postby Goedert » Tue Jun 22, 2010 7:41 pm


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Hunter
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Re: Need some help please.

Postby Hunter » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:51 pm

Thank you very much Goedert
the Buddha said :

"Intention, monks, is karma, I say. Having willed, one acts through body, speech and mind."


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