commonalities and divergences between traditions...

General forum on the teachings of all schools of Mahayana and Vajrayana Buddhism. Topics specific to one school are best posted in the appropriate sub-forum.
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Zenshin 善心
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commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby Zenshin 善心 » Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:17 pm

i enjoy exploring the commonalities and divergences between different traditions and am curious to know - which school/s do you feel most closely resemble your own? which least closely? why? cheers :thanks:
All beings since their first aspiration till the attainment of Buddhahood are sheltered under the guardianship of Buddhas and Bodhisattvas who, responding to the requirements of the occasion, transform themselves and assume the actual forms of personality.

Thus for the sake of all beings Buddhas and Bodhisattvas become sometimes their parents, sometimes their wives and children, sometimes their kinsmen, sometimes their servants, sometimes their friends, sometimes their enemies, sometimes reveal themselves as devas or in some other forms.


- Ashvaghosa, The Awakening of Faith


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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby Indrajala » Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:36 pm

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

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Zenshin 善心
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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby Zenshin 善心 » Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:41 pm

All beings since their first aspiration till the attainment of Buddhahood are sheltered under the guardianship of Buddhas and Bodhisattvas who, responding to the requirements of the occasion, transform themselves and assume the actual forms of personality.

Thus for the sake of all beings Buddhas and Bodhisattvas become sometimes their parents, sometimes their wives and children, sometimes their kinsmen, sometimes their servants, sometimes their friends, sometimes their enemies, sometimes reveal themselves as devas or in some other forms.


- Ashvaghosa, The Awakening of Faith


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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby Mr. G » Fri Dec 09, 2011 6:33 pm


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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby ronnewmexico » Fri Dec 09, 2011 8:13 pm

I own no school of buddhism.

But verseing opinion though that be true, first exposure to pure land, then studying all, voluteering at a Zen place for quite some time then a tibetan place for quite some time(stealing things from them)... then practicing......I use mostly tools from tibetan source but occasionally also with tools from zen and pure land.


Theravadan I have looked at their forms such as monastic forest monks things of that sort and find equal things there as well. Do not use them as they seem about the same. This is easier but I think it is the same, just less accessible is theravadan. So I use what is more available.

To those that will then say...oh he is new to this, or a dillatant a picker a chooser...no.... I have many trainings and empowerments in tibetan buddhism. Have spent time in retreat house as much as or more than many here.... I just find all to be equal in their abillity to be used...all schools, I own none.

Pure land or theravadan or mayahanan or any other thing really to my opinion we must be to a degree consistant that is important.
But to think we are so close to enlightenment that we will carry specific knowledge of this sort from this life to the bardo and then to another life....I think that is silly a bit.

REally we are mostly not that close to enlightenment that it makes a bit of difference pure land or theravadan or m or any other...buddhism it is not theism absolutism nor eternilism .....we are on the right path Some sooner some later...what the import of that. For most none.

Next life perhaps theravadan if that presents in circumstance. I cannot choose my circumstance certainly to such a specific degree nor know karma to such a fine point....others think they can...well they can then.

So the answer...formal training I use tibetan
Informally...Zen then pure land

Practice wise the fundamental training is tibetan, direction of spiritual friends in this school.... augumented by a bit zen in conceptual fashion and a bit pure land.
Mantra is what I use in the main from pure land. Choice of mantra. Chanting and singing other but also that.
So they are all common in a fashion as tools they can be used for purpose.
All uncommon in that it is specific to the person the choice.

Error and truth can be also found in all.
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.

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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby catmoon » Fri Dec 09, 2011 8:26 pm

I think all the major schools are very similar. From the spare elegance of Zen to the huts of Forest Tradition monks, from the subtle complexities of Tibetan Buddhism to the simple faith and inexhaustable determination of the Purelanders, a single scent arises. All practice compassion, equanimity, meditation and good works. And all revere the Buddha as teacher.
Sergeant Schultz knew everything there was to know.

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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby ronnewmexico » Fri Dec 09, 2011 8:31 pm

Well quite a bit poetic, succient, and absolutely true, that.
Well said.

What school teaches such conciseness I will have to steal that :smile:
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.

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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby catmoon » Fri Dec 09, 2011 8:39 pm

Sergeant Schultz knew everything there was to know.

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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby Dechen Norbu » Fri Dec 09, 2011 8:39 pm


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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby ronnewmexico » Fri Dec 09, 2011 8:55 pm

Well if it makes one feel better...consider the source... :smile:
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.

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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby Indrajala » Sat Dec 10, 2011 2:59 pm

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby DGA » Sat Dec 10, 2011 3:35 pm

Commonalities and divergences:

In terms of practice, I'm interested in the ways in which shamatha and vipashyana are presented in different schools.

In terms of doctrine, I'm interested in the distinct approaches to Buddhagarbha/Buddha-nature and the two truths taken across various Mahayana schools.

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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby tobes » Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:51 am


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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby tobes » Sun Dec 11, 2011 11:05 am


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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby Indrajala » Sun Dec 11, 2011 3:14 pm

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby Mr. G » Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:33 pm


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tobes
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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby tobes » Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:19 am


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ronnewmexico
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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby ronnewmexico » Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:39 am

I will of course not speak for pure land or any other form of buddhism.

Speaking for myself I say firmly this, ...any pure land practice performed as intended and with sufficient in the way of accomplishment to actually put one in such places as described.....it is that practice of necessity it is displaying perfect compassion. Of course if one is to just chant this or that visualize this or that pray this or that and do not anything else,wanting mostly just to get somewhere...it is in the perfection of those things comes the understanding of those things and with them a understanding and expression of perfect compassion.

It cannot be accomplished in any other manner.

Faulted practices and faulted conceptions of where one is going and to what aim...abound in error in any form of buddhism.
Suchly this is as any other form means to a end the end always being compassion...greater lesser...those conceptual in origin and nature.

It is not that one is put anywhere but that ones mind fits a place....that place leading to full enlightenment....why then reach for fulll enlightenement and not just a pleasent place? NO it is not that but full enlightenment that is endeavored. That always by its defintiion for other not I.
That is my personal opinion.

I am tending to think this may be the most difficult of practices to perform to sufficiency, but am not firm in that particular opinion, as it is not of my concern to determine such things. That things be equal of not..... that is part of my concern in things.
I find this the same as any other, not better nor worse.
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.

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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby Mr. G » Mon Dec 12, 2011 3:14 am


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Re: commonalities and divergences between traditions...

Postby ronnewmexico » Mon Dec 12, 2011 3:35 am

I think the problem may be this common one..

Many speak of the issue, but know nothing
Some know the issue to totality, but many of those rarely speak of it .
Those that know the issue to totality and speak of the issue are very rare.

Mostly it is those that interpret or determine what those who may know things.... are what they are...and being as we are... they may be faulted a bit in their sayings. So I think it is easily misunderstood and hence some opinions may be faulted on that thing more than other things.

But that happening is also common.
Even this quote...is of about another.
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.


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