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The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada - Page 10 - Dhamma Wheel

The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
alan
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby alan » Fri May 28, 2010 5:01 am

Dexing,
I understand how you could have fallen in love with this argument. It's satisfying for those of us who like to think a lot about big ideas. The argument for total subjectivity is usually something like this:
I can't trust the senses, therefore,
anything perceived is not trustworthy--not worth my emotional investment.
So I'll just assume there is nothing. It's all Empty--Nothingness is the nature of reality.

I actually used to kind of subscribe to that. Funny enough, it wasn't until I became fed up with the fact that ideas of emptiness and nothingness were leading me nowhere that I started to look around and took a good look at Therevada. That's when I started to take thing like "right effort" a bit more seriously.

As I said earlier, Emptiness is an interesting concept. But it kills right effort. Kills a lot of things, actually.

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Goofaholix
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby Goofaholix » Fri May 28, 2010 5:06 am


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Dan74
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby Dan74 » Fri May 28, 2010 5:17 am

I tend to agree that a Theravada forum is not the best place for this discussion. In fact a lot of this could be copied over to Dharma Wheel which our hosts here have also kindly created and there may also be more participants interested in this sort of thing. (( Edit: having had a look, maybe Dharma Wheel is not the place, it kind of stinks of enlightenment over there, while at ZFI we kind of meander aimlessly in samsara. It's a tough choice... :shrug: ))

As for whether what Dexing is presenting is accurate or not, it's worth keeping in mind that Mahayana is a term describing a bunch of schools with lots of common ground but often differing interpretations of certain notions (for instance some scholars believe that Madhyamaka and Yogacara are contradictory while others see them as complimentary). I am not qualified to pronounce judgment one way or another but I do recall reading a similar interpretation of emptiness as taught by the Yogacara school elsewhere so it may actually be pretty standard. I am also guessing that where it diverges Ven Huifeng would correct it, like he did in the identification of space and emptiness, color and form, which is perhaps sloppy but probably doesn't go to the heart of the argument.

But in the end it boils down to semantics and realization I guess. Semantics in the sense that people could mean the same thing but be wording it very differently. Realization because until then, it's all just words and pretty ideas.

And even great ideas in the absence of appropriate preparation can cause harm rather than liberation.
Last edited by Dan74 on Fri May 28, 2010 10:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
_/|\_

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Goofaholix
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby Goofaholix » Fri May 28, 2010 5:25 am


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Dan74
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby Dan74 » Fri May 28, 2010 5:43 am

That was not my meaning, G.

"Guilding the lilly" implies that all Mahayana does is obscure the perfection of the Pali canon. It's not a kind appraisal, nor an accurate one in my opinion.
_/|\_

Paññāsikhara
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby Paññāsikhara » Fri May 28, 2010 6:12 am

My recently moved Blog, containing some of my writings on the Buddha Dhamma, as well as a number of translations from classical Buddhist texts and modern authors, liturgy, etc.: .

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tiltbillings
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby tiltbillings » Fri May 28, 2010 6:14 am


alan
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby alan » Fri May 28, 2010 6:30 am

If this thing has not been locked, I'd like to to ask a question. It actually was an important step in my "conversion".

--Why should I act?

Emptiness or non-duality does not answer that question.

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tiltbillings
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby tiltbillings » Fri May 28, 2010 6:39 am


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jcsuperstar
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby jcsuperstar » Fri May 28, 2010 6:47 am

สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

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tiltbillings
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby tiltbillings » Fri May 28, 2010 7:16 am


PeterB
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby PeterB » Fri May 28, 2010 7:59 am


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Dan74
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby Dan74 » Fri May 28, 2010 8:43 am

This probably merits another thread, but there is non-duality as a position, and there is a way of demolishing the dual positions (like in Madhyamaka or Vimalakirti Nirdesa). This latter is sometimes called non-duality which is unfortunate because it implies an "it", a position. But now I take Ven Huifeng's advice and must leave internet to its own devices.

((oh shudder - no doubt all hell will break loose! :cry: )

:bow: :bow: :bow:
_/|\_

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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby PeterB » Fri May 28, 2010 8:51 am


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tiltbillings
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby tiltbillings » Fri May 28, 2010 8:53 am


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Dan74
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby Dan74 » Fri May 28, 2010 9:42 am

just as I thought.. :meditate: Dan :meditate: upekkha now!

ok Dan out :toilet:
_/|\_

Dexing
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby Dexing » Sat May 29, 2010 2:46 am


alan
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby alan » Sat May 29, 2010 2:55 am

Not sure what you mean by actual function...can you clarify?

Dexing
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby Dexing » Sat May 29, 2010 2:55 am


Dexing
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Re: The Bodhisattva Ideal in Theravada

Postby Dexing » Sat May 29, 2010 2:59 am



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