the great rebirth debate

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
notself
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby notself » Fri May 07, 2010 10:10 pm

With respect,

If one should not think about what is reborn because it leads to confusion, then why think about anything from any of the suttas? Are we to sink into blind faith? I believe in rebirth. I believe in kamma. I believe in anatta. I believe in anicca. I believe in everything and understand nothing. Heck I might as well be a Christian. :rolleye: :anjali:
Though one may conquer a thousand times a thousand men in battle, yet he is indeed the noblest victor who conquers himself. ---Dhp 103

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acinteyyo
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby acinteyyo » Fri May 07, 2010 10:25 pm

Thag 1.20. Ajita - I do not fear death; nor do I long for life. I’ll lay down this body, aware and mindful.

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retrofuturist
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby retrofuturist » Fri May 07, 2010 10:27 pm

Excellent explanation acinteyyo!

:twothumbsup:

As accurate as can be, without becoming bewildering...

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

notself
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby notself » Fri May 07, 2010 11:38 pm

Though one may conquer a thousand times a thousand men in battle, yet he is indeed the noblest victor who conquers himself. ---Dhp 103

Reductor
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby Reductor » Sat May 08, 2010 1:38 am


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Modus.Ponens
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby Modus.Ponens » Sat May 08, 2010 1:47 am

He turns his mind away from those phenomena, and having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.'
(Jhana Sutta - Thanissaro Bhikkhu translation)

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Pannapetar
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby Pannapetar » Sat May 08, 2010 2:05 am


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tiltbillings
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby tiltbillings » Sat May 08, 2010 2:23 am


notself
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby notself » Sat May 08, 2010 4:46 am

Though one may conquer a thousand times a thousand men in battle, yet he is indeed the noblest victor who conquers himself. ---Dhp 103

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Pannapetar
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby Pannapetar » Sat May 08, 2010 5:16 am


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tiltbillings
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby tiltbillings » Sat May 08, 2010 5:20 am


notself
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby notself » Sat May 08, 2010 5:48 am

Though one may conquer a thousand times a thousand men in battle, yet he is indeed the noblest victor who conquers himself. ---Dhp 103

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tiltbillings
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby tiltbillings » Sat May 08, 2010 6:03 am


PeterB
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby PeterB » Sat May 08, 2010 6:55 am


Shonin
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby Shonin » Sat May 08, 2010 8:02 am

Here's a thought. If self-view falls away, the idea 'I will be reborn as...' falls away and all that is left is karma - there is this action and this consequence. All sentient beings, all moments of sentience are viewed impartially. It doesn't matter who is the 'owner' or 'receiver' of the consequence or more accurately perhaps it is seen (not just believed) that there is no owner - just actions and consequences. Thus metaphysical speculation about the mechanisms for karma to be 'transmitted into a new life' become irrelevant and even meaningless.

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tiltbillings
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby tiltbillings » Sat May 08, 2010 8:14 am


PeterB
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby PeterB » Sat May 08, 2010 8:18 am

Or as someone put it in another thread kamma = dukkha =anatta or dukkha = anatta = kamma. They are the same process.
Everything arises dependantly and that includes time.
That is not my opinion. My opinion is irrelevant. That is a reading of Buddhadasa which resonates for me..
Last edited by PeterB on Sat May 08, 2010 8:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

PeterB
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby PeterB » Sat May 08, 2010 8:20 am


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tiltbillings
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby tiltbillings » Sat May 08, 2010 8:27 am


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Aloka
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Re: the great rebirth debate

Postby Aloka » Sat May 08, 2010 9:22 am

.

Any views relating to rebirth are always going to be conceptual speculation (other than in a verifiable sense relating to the changes in our day to day lives) - and for me personally they aren't relevant to the practice in the here and now.


_/\_


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