Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

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Re: Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

Postby Tilopa » Sat Oct 29, 2011 3:12 am

Jinzang wrote:The question in my mind is not why is Lama Lodu uncomfortable with Kalu Rinpoche's non-traditional teaching style, but why did he feel so strongly about it that he put up a page on the KDK Center website?

My take on your question is that except for a few notable exceptions Tibetan Lamas are generally very conservative and that's especially true for those of the older generation brought up and trained in Tibet or in India & Nepal in the 30 years since the diaspora. For most of them Tibetan culture and dharma are synonymous and any variation from the traditional methodology is just a step further down the path of degeneration. I think it's probable that even lamas like LLR who are quite familiar with the western way of life firmly believe the traditional way is the best or only way. Maybe they're right because it served them well for over 1000 years and is likely the main reason we are still able to access pure spiritual teachings today but things change and old habits die hard. I'm not surprised he feels so strongly about it but to publicly voice his concerns like that is...well... untraditional. :smile:
Last edited by Tilopa on Sat Oct 29, 2011 5:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

Postby Sherab Dorje » Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:45 am

Jinzang wrote:The question in my mind is not why is Lama Lodu uncomfortable with Kalu Rinpoche's non-traditional teaching style, but why did he feel so strongly about it that he put up a page on the KDK Center website?
If it's so important to you then why don't you just go and ask him personally instead of fishing for uninformed (or loosely informed) opinions?

Gossip is wrong speech, as you may know.
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"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

Postby J-Bird » Sat Oct 29, 2011 6:56 pm

Well I think we should not let our common sense go askew in this situation.
It seems fairly clear, at least from my diluted viewpoint that the interview was allowed to be posted to express disappointment with the current situation.
Much more than this who knows.....
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Re: Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

Postby dbangmo » Mon Oct 31, 2011 10:55 pm

Having spoken with Lama Lodru Rinpoche in person about this topic, I wanted to add that I think LLR had the posting in the KDK newsletter because many students at KDK San Francisco were asking questions and were puzzled by Kalu Rinpoche's presentation. Cone B. is my dear vajra brother, and I agree with him that LLR isn't being contradictory--he's being very honest, and I would say, very balanced and helpful to all of his students.

What I found interesting when I saw Yangsi Kalu Rinpoche (and I saw the previous Kalu Rinpoche many times), was just the general reaction I had in myself. He wasn't traditional in appearance, but then he did not say anything that wasn't Dharma. I was kind of surprised and maybe a little perturbed that he said he slept a lot during his first year of three year retreat -- but maybe it's more important to find out how his 3 year retreat ended. I was kind of expecting an instruction on the Shangpa ngondro....but on the other hand Kalu Rinpoche was talking to a general audience, so in the end I'd probably ask LLR for a specific teaching on the Shangpa ngondro anyway. With the previous Kalu Rinpoche, it would have been the same....even though he gave some profound teaching, in the end I went to LLR to get a more detailed explanation.

One person told me that he was delighted with the new Kalu Rinpoche, especially because he spoke English, and it inspired him to start practicing more. Seems that many people have that reaction based on the paldenshangpa.net page. It will be interesting to see how the presentation of the teachings evolve.
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Re: Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

Postby Tenzin1 » Mon Dec 26, 2011 7:42 am

For all we know, Yangsi Kalu Rinpoche, with his "unorthodox" views and ideas, could be the best thing to hit the Tibetan community in a long time. He's not afraid to tell it like it is and to set about addressing painful situations that have been swept under the rug for too long. If he succeeds in founding a school, or even a series of schools, that offer a safe living environment and high-quality religious and secular education to students from financially needy families, that alone will be a priceless contribution to his people. Not to mention the reforms he's already brought about in some of his centers, where he discovered corrupt lamas being abusive of disciples. According to one of the posts on his webpage, one of his centers had been completely abandoned due to this issue, and in another center the monks tried to sue him to divest him of his own center. This is a guy whose time has come. We'll see how far he gets. Best wishes to him. He'll need all the help he can get.
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Re: Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

Postby Tsering927 » Mon Dec 26, 2011 7:47 pm

I heard that the previous Bokar Rinpoche refused to recognize the tulkus in his own monastery. He said that they should prove who they are through their own practice in this life. Maybe this is a better way to go. Too many expectations and disturbing political situations arise for a young child with a high title.
It is said that you can tell whether someone has just eaten by how red his face is. Similarly, you can tell whether people know and practice the Dharma by whether it works as a remedy for their negative emotions and ego-clinging. --Jetsun Mila

The hungry are not satisfied by hearing about food; what they need is to eat. In the same way, just to know about Dharma is useless; it has to be practiced. --Jetsun Mila
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Re: Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

Postby Tenzin1 » Mon Dec 26, 2011 11:05 pm

Tsering927 wrote: Maybe this is a better way to go. Too many expectations and disturbing political situations arise for a young child with a high title.
Good point. Dzongsar Khentse Rinpoche made a cryptic statement in Gesar Mukpo's film, "Tulku". He said if the Tibetans aren't careful, the tulku system could be the downfall of Buddhism. I don't know what he meant by that, but this new, unconventional style of Kalu Rinpoche's, and his frankness and emphasis on reform could be a harbinger of change.
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Re: Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

Postby Willy » Thu Dec 29, 2011 7:56 am

Jinzang wrote:I was surfing the web and came across this curiously cool reaction by Lama Lodu to Kalu Rinpoche's recent visit to San Francisco. I found this startling, knowing how reluctant Tibetans are to publicly criticize high lamas. Did anyone here see Kalu Rinpoche on his recent tour and do you want to comment?


I wrote about seeing him in an other discussion thread. I saw Kalu Rinpoche in Santa Fe, in a private meeting and later at a public lecture. He was very witty and has a great sense of humor. I can't say how others took him in, but the audience in Santa Fe was mostly made up of people practicing for many years and students of the previous Kalu Rinpoche. There was a lot of laughter coming from the audience. Also some of the questions reflected people's concern for his safety. He is going against a massive institution with power, money and all the other things that go with medieval infrastructures.

He did not prop himself up, remained extremely humble and repeatedly played himself down. Despite this attitude I felt a very strong blessing and a friend of mine not at the lecture saw a massive rainbow coming down right on top of the community college where we were. This wouldn't be so special, except that we were in the middle of a terrible drought. You may have heard about the fires in NM and AZ. When Kalu Rinpoche was in town, we had wet weather - the first in months.

I don't want to add more rumors to the pot, but I have heard a rumor that he is actually not the incarnation of Kalu Rinpoche, but his son - and that explains his close appearance.
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Re: Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

Postby Tenzin1 » Fri Dec 30, 2011 1:27 am

Kalu Rinpoche died May 10, 1989. YKR was born in November of 1990. No chance of the rumor being true, unless YKR's birth certificate was forged, or something.
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Re: Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

Postby Willy » Fri Dec 30, 2011 6:21 am

Tenzin1 wrote:Kalu Rinpoche died May 10, 1989. YKR was born in November of 1990. No chance of the rumor being true, unless YKR's birth certificate was forged, or something.



"like" and - thanks!
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Re: Kalu Rinpoche: Panned in San Francisco

Postby Tsering927 » Fri Dec 30, 2011 5:51 pm

Kalu Rinpoche was born, according to his biography, on the 17th of September, 1990 -- around 3 in the afternoon. His father was the General Secretary of Sonada Monastery. He was actually born in the house of the previous Kyabje Dorje Chang Kalu Rinpche. Lama Gyalsten, Kalu Rinpoche Yangsi's father, was the previous Kalu Rinpoche's nephew. That might account for the physical similarity.
It is said that you can tell whether someone has just eaten by how red his face is. Similarly, you can tell whether people know and practice the Dharma by whether it works as a remedy for their negative emotions and ego-clinging. --Jetsun Mila

The hungry are not satisfied by hearing about food; what they need is to eat. In the same way, just to know about Dharma is useless; it has to be practiced. --Jetsun Mila
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