Is Zen Rational?

Is Zen Rational?

Yes
9
56%
No
7
44%
 
Total votes : 16

Re: Is Zen Rational?

Postby PadmaVonSamba » Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:30 pm

HA!
Profile Picture: "The Foaming Monk"
The Chinese characters are Fo (buddha) and Ming (bright). The image is of a student of Buddhism, who, imagining himself to be a monk, and not understanding the true meaning of the words takes the sound of the words literally. Likewise, People on web forums sometime seem to be foaming at the mouth.
Original painting by P.Volker /used by permission.
User avatar
PadmaVonSamba
 
Posts: 2845
Joined: Sat May 14, 2011 1:41 am

Re: Is Zen Rational?

Postby ajax » Mon Sep 19, 2011 4:24 pm

Astus wrote:Is being rational Zen? Is being irrational Zen? Of course not. Can Zen be rationalised or "irrationalised"? Definitely. So it is not something but can be made into anything, such is the magic of mind. Zen can be presented in any way it is needed, that's the primary approach Zen has. That is quite a rational attitude that understands dependent origination and how to assist people in seeing the nature of mind, i.e. perceiving that ideas such as rationality and irrationality depend on each other without any real basis.

No real basis. I like that.
ajax
 
Posts: 58
Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2011 5:48 am

Re: Is Zen Rational?

Postby alwayson » Mon Sep 19, 2011 8:24 pm

I know Dependent Origination is rational.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prat%C4%AB ... tp%C4%81da
alwayson
 
Posts: 533
Joined: Sat Sep 10, 2011 1:36 am

Re: Is Zen Rational?

Postby Sherab » Tue Sep 20, 2011 12:31 am

Zen is rationally irrational.
User avatar
Sherab
 
Posts: 735
Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2010 6:28 am

Re: Is Zen Rational?

Postby kirtu » Tue Sep 20, 2011 1:48 am

ajax wrote:
kirtu wrote:Zen is rational, but it is not linear and it is not bound by logic.

Kirt

Hello Kirt

Can you possibly elaborate? How can Zen be rational if it is not bound by logic or reasoning?


Zen relies upon Buddha Nature directly. Because Buddha Nature cannot be elaborated upon meaningfully using logic, Zen is beyond logic. Logic is a tool for consistent reasoning but Zen accords to the circumstance and condition. Zen's rationality is totally based on Buddha Nature. You can reason correctly in Zen, just not with a linear intellectual approach (although you can get started that way).

Kirt
Kirt's Tibetan Translation Notes

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche
User avatar
kirtu
Former staff member
 
Posts: 4368
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 5:29 pm
Location: Baltimore, MD

Re: Is Zen Rational?

Postby PadmaVonSamba » Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:03 am

on one side is rational, on the other side is irrational. That's not zen.
So the answer is, no.

Sheng-ts'an's great poem, "On Beliveing In Mind" sums it up niceley:
"As long as you tarry in the dualism, How can you realize oneness?"
Profile Picture: "The Foaming Monk"
The Chinese characters are Fo (buddha) and Ming (bright). The image is of a student of Buddhism, who, imagining himself to be a monk, and not understanding the true meaning of the words takes the sound of the words literally. Likewise, People on web forums sometime seem to be foaming at the mouth.
Original painting by P.Volker /used by permission.
User avatar
PadmaVonSamba
 
Posts: 2845
Joined: Sat May 14, 2011 1:41 am

Re: Is Zen Rational?

Postby catmoon » Thu Sep 22, 2011 12:02 pm

ajax wrote:hello catmoon

catmoon wrote:I doubt the practice of sitting on cushions was derived from a process of logical analysis.

I also doubt the practice of zazen was derived from a process of logical analysis. However the question of how the practice was derived is a different question.


It was just an example of rationality in Zen. I am implying that the same line of thought can be applied broadly to Zen practice.
Sergeant Schultz knew everything there was to know.
User avatar
catmoon
Former staff member
 
Posts: 3006
Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:20 am
Location: British Columbia

Re: Is Zen Rational?

Postby AdmiralJim » Sat Oct 01, 2011 7:37 pm

to quote spock 'logic is the beginning of wisdom not the end'
I don't know where we are going but it will be nice when we get there
User avatar
AdmiralJim
 
Posts: 162
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2011 6:11 pm
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland

Previous

Return to Zen

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Astus and 8 guests

>