Is Zen Rational?

Is Zen Rational?

Yes
10
59%
No
7
41%
 
Total votes: 17

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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: Is Zen Rational?

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

HA!
EMPTIFUL.
An inward outlook produces outward insight.
ajax
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Re: Is Zen Rational?

Post by ajax »

Astus wrote:Is being rational Zen? Is being irrational Zen? Of course not. Can Zen be rationalised or "irrationalised"? Definitely. So it is not something but can be made into anything, such is the magic of mind. Zen can be presented in any way it is needed, that's the primary approach Zen has. That is quite a rational attitude that understands dependent origination and how to assist people in seeing the nature of mind, i.e. perceiving that ideas such as rationality and irrationality depend on each other without any real basis.
No real basis. I like that.
alwayson
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Re: Is Zen Rational?

Post by alwayson »

I know Dependent Origination is rational.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prat%C4%AB ... tp%C4%81da" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Sherab
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Re: Is Zen Rational?

Post by Sherab »

Zen is rationally irrational.
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kirtu
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Re: Is Zen Rational?

Post by kirtu »

ajax wrote:
kirtu wrote:Zen is rational, but it is not linear and it is not bound by logic.

Kirt
Hello Kirt

Can you possibly elaborate? How can Zen be rational if it is not bound by logic or reasoning?
Zen relies upon Buddha Nature directly. Because Buddha Nature cannot be elaborated upon meaningfully using logic, Zen is beyond logic. Logic is a tool for consistent reasoning but Zen accords to the circumstance and condition. Zen's rationality is totally based on Buddha Nature. You can reason correctly in Zen, just not with a linear intellectual approach (although you can get started that way).

Kirt
Kirt's Tibetan Translation Notes

"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

"Most all-knowing Mañjuśrī, ...
Please illuminate the radiant wisdom spirit
Of my precious Buddha nature."
HH Thinley Norbu Rinpoche
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PadmaVonSamba
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Re: Is Zen Rational?

Post by PadmaVonSamba »

on one side is rational, on the other side is irrational. That's not zen.
So the answer is, no.

Sheng-ts'an's great poem, "On Beliveing In Mind" sums it up niceley:
"As long as you tarry in the dualism, How can you realize oneness?"
EMPTIFUL.
An inward outlook produces outward insight.
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catmoon
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Re: Is Zen Rational?

Post by catmoon »

ajax wrote:hello catmoon
catmoon wrote:I doubt the practice of sitting on cushions was derived from a process of logical analysis.
I also doubt the practice of zazen was derived from a process of logical analysis. However the question of how the practice was derived is a different question.
It was just an example of rationality in Zen. I am implying that the same line of thought can be applied broadly to Zen practice.
Sergeant Schultz knew everything there was to know.
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AdmiralJim
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Re: Is Zen Rational?

Post by AdmiralJim »

to quote spock 'logic is the beginning of wisdom not the end'
I don't know where we are going but it will be nice when we get there
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