Six Yogas of Naropa

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mzaur
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Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby mzaur » Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:01 am

Hi,
Is it accurate to say that Six Yogas of Naropa are only taught in a retreat setting? Also, to get to the advanced level of being ready to be taught the Six Yogas, I take it you have to finish Ngondro? Are you ready then?

:thanks:

J-Bird
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby J-Bird » Wed Aug 31, 2011 5:03 am

In general yes & yes.

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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby heart » Wed Aug 31, 2011 5:05 am

"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

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mzaur
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby mzaur » Wed Aug 31, 2011 8:00 am

Oh I see. I didn't know mahamudra was taught before doing ngondro and generation/completion. Is it possible to ask a lama for path of liberation guidance?

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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby dakini_boi » Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:48 am


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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby heart » Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:10 pm

"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

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Kelwin
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby Kelwin » Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:12 pm

'I will not take your feelings seriously, and neither will you' -Lama Lena

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conebeckham
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby conebeckham » Wed Aug 31, 2011 5:07 pm

The Six Yogas of Naropa, or Naro Chodruk, are specific and detailed Completion Stage instructions that originated from various Tantras, and various masters, and which were bundled together and have since been transmitted as the core of the Kagyu Path of Means. They are almost always given in strict retreat setting, though there may be some exceptions, these exceptions are very rare. (Tulkus get them......as for the rest of us, well.......bits and pieces, perhaps....outside of retreat)

In general, these practices "rely" to an extent on prior experience in the Creation Stage of deity yoga, or what you would call Yidam practice. In particular, the practice(s) of Vajrayogini, and often Chakrasamvara, precede these practices.

However, Yidam practices actually have their own completion stage practices, as well.....so things like "Tummo." "Illusory Body," and "Dream Yoga" can be, and often are, taught as Completion Stage practices on their own, outside of strict retreat, and perhaps even not in conjunction with Creation Stage practices. But these practices may not be the same as those found in the Naro Chodruk.

There are actually quite a few "Phowa" practices, just for starters...the "Phowa" of the Naro Chodruk is not the same as those which are commonly taught outside of a three year retreat, for instance.

Some may disagree with me, but, frankly speaking, the Naro Chodruk is a demanding set of methods, requiring isolation, a retreat setting, minimization of distractions, and great determination, as well as adequate preparation. It's not something one does for an hour, before heading off to the office in the morning, really.....for most of us, at least.

The Path of Liberation, or the Path of Mahamudra, complements the Path of Means, but it is often taught separately, and almost always gradually, outside of strict retreat. The common "Karma Kagyu Ngondro" is actually part of that path--it's not really part of the Path of Means, which has it's own ngondro.

In my experience, Mahamudra Ngondro is the quintessential method of accumulating merit, and, with the proper guidance and instructions, it can also be the setting for proper accumulation of wisdom--in fact, the quintessence of ngondro, really, is Guru Yoga, which is the essential method of developing wisdom.


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

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Kelwin
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby Kelwin » Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:30 pm

Thanks Cone, indeed it is important to emphasize the difference between the six yogas as taught more publicly, and the way it's done in strict retreat.
I know a bunch of people doing it in retreat in the Dordogne, but have only practiced the 'easy-access' versions myself.

Could you please elaborate on the differences between the Naro Chodruk practices, and let's say the dream/sleep practices found in relation to other yidam practices, the more common Longchen Nyintig phowa, the tummo as part of many sadhanas, etc? As far as publicly possible, obviously.

All the best,
Kelwin
'I will not take your feelings seriously, and neither will you' -Lama Lena

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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby Pero » Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:35 pm

Although many individuals in this age appear to be merely indulging their worldly desires, one does not have the capacity to judge them, so it is best to train in pure vision.
- Shabkar

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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby conebeckham » Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:02 am



"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

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Kelwin
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby Kelwin » Thu Sep 01, 2011 9:51 am

'I will not take your feelings seriously, and neither will you' -Lama Lena

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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby heart » Thu Sep 01, 2011 9:51 am

"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

Pero
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby Pero » Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:07 am

Although many individuals in this age appear to be merely indulging their worldly desires, one does not have the capacity to judge them, so it is best to train in pure vision.
- Shabkar

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Sönam
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby Sönam » Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:18 am

Khenchen Thrangu Rinpoché gives straightaway pointing out instruction ... this is because of the recommandation of his master Khenpo Gangshar.

Sönam
By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby Adamantine » Thu Sep 01, 2011 11:17 am

Contentment is the ultimate wealth;
Detachment is the final happiness. ~Sri Saraha

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Sönam
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby Sönam » Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:42 pm

By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

Pero
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby Pero » Thu Sep 01, 2011 3:52 pm

Although many individuals in this age appear to be merely indulging their worldly desires, one does not have the capacity to judge them, so it is best to train in pure vision.
- Shabkar

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heart
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby heart » Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:13 pm

"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

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Malcolm
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Re: Six Yogas of Naropa

Postby Malcolm » Thu Sep 01, 2011 5:40 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa


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